Bullpup Hunting Rifle

[treillw]

Seems like a good idea to me. Why aren't they more popular? Without adventuring onto google, the Defensive Edge one is the only bolt bullpup I've ever heard of - I'd much prefer a magazine to go along with it.

Looks like Desert Tech makes one that mag feeds, after a 2 minutes google search.

Just curious of the downfalls and why they aren't more popular. Seems like it would be awesome to throw a can on and be as long or shorter than a normal hunting rifle.

I would want the rifle to be able to reach out to 1000+ yards for play and 700 ish for hunting. Anything out there that fits this bill?

Maybe they will become the hunting rifle of the future.

Thanks!

 

[Soj51hopeful]

Only thing I can think of would be working the bolt by your ear is something that would need getting used to.

 

[maxx075]

Triggers are usually crap because of the travel

 

[JohnJohnson]

With the Desert Tech people dislike the different ergonomics of running the bolt, the triggers in bullpups tend to be more convoluted and less crisp, and they're heavy for hunting. Oh and their magazines are proprietary/annoying if memory serves.

 

[Formidilosus]

Seems like a good idea to me. Why aren't they more popular? Without adventuring onto google, the Defensive Edge one is the only bolt bullpup I've ever heard of - I'd much prefer a magazine to go along with it.

Looks like Desert Tech makes one that mag feeds, after a 2 minutes google search.

Just curious of the downfalls and why they aren't more popular. Seems like it would be awesome to throw a can on and be as long or shorter than a normal hunting rifle.

I would want the rifle to be able to reach out to 1000+ yards for play and 700 ish for hunting. Anything out there that fits this bill?

Maybe they will become the hunting rifle of the future.

Thanks!

Bullpups are something that sounds great on paper, and suck in real life. This isn’t just hunting rifles- Bullpups are heavy compromises in shooting performance and nearly every country that has adopted them as service rifles have went back to conventional designs, and /or their units that have a choice don’t use them.


Bullpup pros:

1). 4-6” less overall length.





Bullpup cons:

1). Manipulations are harder and less optimum- loading, unloading, reloading, racking the bolt, etc.

2). Forend length and balance are poor for positional and alternate position shooting- pack, hiking sticks, etc.

3). Triggers in general are not very good and have a complicated linkage system.

4). Clearing malfunctions/status checks is awkward and contorted.



In short- for field shooting performance, Bullpup is not the way.

 

[treillw]

Bullpups are something that sounds great on paper, and suck in real life. This isn’t just hunting rifles- Bullpups are heavy compromises in shooting performance and nearly every country that has adopted them as service rifles have went back to conventional designs, and /or their units that have a choice don’t use them.


Bullpup pros:

1). 4-6” less overall length.





Bullpup cons:

1). Manipulations are harder and less optimum- loading, unloading, reloading, racking the bolt, etc.

2). Forend length and balance are poor for positional and alternate position shooting- pack, hiking sticks, etc.

3). Triggers in general are not very good and have a complicated linkage system.

4). Clearing malfunctions/status checks is awkward and contorted.



In short- for field shooting performance, Bullpup is not the way.

Dangit, but I want a free lunch!

 

[maxx075]

Only good bull pup is the P90, and that's only if it's chopped, suppressed, and full auto.

 

[NSI]

Bullpups are something that sounds great on paper, and suck in real life. This isn’t just hunting rifles- Bullpups are heavy compromises in shooting performance and nearly every country that has adopted them as service rifles have went back to conventional designs, and /or their units that have a choice don’t use them.


Bullpup pros:

1). 4-6” less overall length.





Bullpup cons:

1). Manipulations are harder and less optimum- loading, unloading, reloading, racking the bolt, etc.

2). Forend length and balance are poor for positional and alternate position shooting- pack, hiking sticks, etc.

3). Triggers in general are not very good and have a complicated linkage system.

4). Clearing malfunctions/status checks is awkward and contorted.



In short- for field shooting performance, Bullpup is not the way.

This pretty much tracks with my experience, though I wish it didn't. I was a part of the initial Tavor roll-out to the Golani brigade in Israel. The pros were longer barrel length for improved terminal performance with 55 grain ball, in a package that still worked for the sort of sloppy CQB with which most Israeli conscript units concern themselves.

The cons were ... everything else. To give the Tavor designers credit, their bolt-lock reload ergonomics are still the slickest available on any bullpup, and they designed a system that is sand-tolerant enough that clearing double feeds or FTEs (awkward in any bullpen) was a rarity.

The triggers were long and mushy (there is some admirable magic in the Super Sabra aftermarket trigger). There is no rail space adequate to mount modern fighting accessories (lasers, lights, yada yada) without bolting a vertical pic grip to the bottom which sucks for all the reasons vertical grips suck when you are forced to use them for a full grip. The (inherent) accuracy was always minute-of-man and only improved slightly over the years.

When I got exposure to higher end career units, the Tavor was scarce (about as popular as the L85 with SAS or the Aug with ... the other SAS). A good analogy is the infamous "Israeli" condition-3 pistol carry. Much like the Tavor, it makes some sense for a conscript brigade but doesn't see any practice by the men (and super hot women) who make warfighting their career.

RE: hunting rifles, I lust after a bullpup carbon Ruger no.1, and I shall have one. I'm sure I'll hate it. But as Form says, the Bullpup is a seductive concept.

-J

 

[Nine Banger]

The Desert Tech SRS A2 is a cool gun.

Here's mine. It has been my primary rifle for 4 years or so.



Over all length is where it shines. It fits in my front ATV box with the suppressor on. It fits in a short pelican case.

My 223 conversion kit let me down at Shoot 2 Hunt but it works great with the factory 6.5 CM barrel and bolt. I have a 450 Marlin conversion kit with a suppressor too.

This rifle was designed around 338 Lapua so the magazines are huge and the ejection port is long. All the conversion kits involve compartments in the magazine and bolt stops.

The trigger is great and adjustable.

It takes around 2 minutes to switch barrel, bolt and magazine and bolt stop to have a new caliber. The new point of impact is usually on with windage and off 1.5-2" in elevation with the loads I shoot.

It's heavy. I stripped it down for Shoot 2 Hunt with a light SWFA scope, ultralight rings, and removed my arca rail and the monopod and put a light suppressor on it and it was still over 10lbs. With the arca rail, an ATACR, the monopod, etc its around 14 lbs.

If I'm hiking over to a saddle tree or deer stand here I carry it with a 2 point sling draped over my torso in the front and that's good for 2 miles or so but I don't want to carry it around for a western hunt.

This rifle got thru most of the shooting positions at Shoot 2 Hunt and I'm stubborn but gave up on my ejection issues with the 223 conversion kit and I borrowed a Tikka from our instructor for the rest of the class.

The Tikka is superior for field shooting.

The Desert Tech is better for load development and tripod mounting and slow stuff like deer stand hunting.

In prone position I can shoot it as fast as a tikka but that required muscle memory built over lots of shooting time. You also have to memorize where the mag releases and saftey are, etc to stay in your glass. The Tikka is more intuitive and I was back to operating those features without thought very quickly.

I currently have a Tikka that I picked up just for my next travel hunt. All we do here where I live is saddle hunt, still hunt in stands and ride around in side by sides, so the desert tech was never an issue until I went hunting with Shoot 2 Hunt.

 

[Nine Banger]

RE: hunting rifles, I lust after a bullpup carbon Ruger no.1, and I shall have one. I'm sure I'll hate it. But as Form says, the Bullpup is a seductive concept.

I shoot Ruger No.1s but what is a bullpup carbon version?

 

[NSI]

I shoot Ruger No.1s but what is a bullpup carbon version?

I think this is where my head was

-J

 

[thinhorn_AK]

I have an old keep Tec bull pup 308. It’s pretty fun but it’s weird, it dumps shells out the front of the gun rather than the side.

 

[Mojave]

There are at least 3 or 4 here in Europe. Dentler makes a new one. They are $5500.

 

[StupidLightweight]

Reap Weaponries offers a bullpup chassis for AR lowers. It’s a clever idea, sort of a poor man’s Desert Tech that’s infinitely modular. The trigger linkage adds less than a pound, so if you use a lighter trigger, it can be a sweet pull. This upper is from Uintah Precision and it’s a pistol lower, hence no stock.

 

[wind gypsy]

Back when the DE LRKM was new and exciting around here I picked up a desert tech SRS A1 for a more versatile option with 6.5x47 and 300 Norma conversions. Very convenient cartridge swaps and both conversions were very accurate but the whole thing was a compromise as has been discussed. The ergos were less desirable for basically everything - less stable for shooting, bolt/mag manipulation, and even carrying was cumbersome compared to a traditional bolt rifle.

 

[Nine Banger]

Here's what I was getting at with Desert Tech SRS and the big magazines...you have to go all the way back to fit a magnum sized cartridge. 6.5 CM and 223 sit way forward and the bolt stops do the work.

 

[Nine Banger]

Here's one more photo. The big stable heavy set up.




I currently have an ATACR on this desert tech because I was going to take it moose hunting but now I have a field rifle in hand so I intend to put the Desert Tech back in this configuration with the thermal scope soon to call coyotes at night from structure or field edges. The thermal is on my PCC right now that I've been carrying for armadillos on my moose trip training hikes.

The rifle is probably 15 lbs as shown with the optic and full arca rail but it and the tripod will be in gun holders in a SXS while hunting so weight is inconsequential for the purpose.

 

[SDHNTR]

WTH is all this nonsense about? I wouldn’t hunt with a single thing posted on this thread. I like hunting guns, not something that belongs to Boba Fett.

 

[Nine Banger]

I found a couple more just to show anyone that's curious how tiny the SRS A2 Covert is.

OAL is what it really boils down to.

Dude in photo is 4 at the time and probably 36" tall.

Deer is a 77gr TMK death...just sayin'

 

[Elmer J. Fudd]

The kid bears a striking resemblance to another poster on this forum. I always thought a bullpup was interesting but curious how the ergonomics were. I figured a kit for a 10/22 could be a fun plinking gun. After reading this I don’t think it would make a good hunting rig for me.