Broken Points System Rambling

[ReaptheHeat]

That is the 2025 secondary elk draw

Thanks for the correction but those stats don't paint the full picture. What that doesn't tell you is all the decent tags were pulled by youth. And yet again, why are res youth competing with NR youth? That was the premise of my original argument on page 1.

Yes of course adults are pulling tags because there are a ton still left. Those numbers include a lot of NR archery tags this year as well. Youth arent putting in for EM029O2 or whatever. They are pulling decent tags that took multiple points in primary. They shouldnt be competing with youth and res should have preference over NR youth at this stage.

Seems a lot of NR adults are upset I don't want their kids taking tags that should be prioritized to res youth and res adults. Grab them on leftover or a nice OTC hunt.

 

[wyosam]

Wyoming F&G is a disaster. Ling in the lakes, putting Lake Trout into the Flaming Gorge destroying what arguably was the best Brown trout fishery in the States. Back in the early 80's yes it was a great department, now it's a joke. Look at these limits on sport fish. This is an obvious failure of epic proportions. Even Burbot(Ling) are limited and it is harmful to trout fisheries. The last 4 times I hunted Wyoming I saw no less than 4 wolves on each trip. I also saw at least one Grizzly bear. Wyoming could do more to reign in predators.

Wyoming is as good as it gets for residents. If you cant kill elk in Wyoming, that’s a you problem. Same with fishing. Bears and wolves exist, have for a long time now. If you can’t find elk to kill in Wyoming, bears and wolves are the least of your problem.


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[KsRancher]

Thanks for the correction but those stats don't paint the full picture. What that doesn't tell you is all the decent tags were pulled by youth. And yet again, why are res youth competing with NR youth? That was the premise of my original argument on page 1.

Yes of course adults are pulling tags because there are a ton still left. Those numbers include a lot of NR archery tags this year as well. Youth arent putting in for EM029O2 or whatever. They are pulling decent tags that took multiple points in primary. They shouldnt be competing with youth and res should have preference over NR youth at this stage.

If we break it down by just youth since they got first pick. Resident youth pulled 74% vs NR 26% of all youth that applied. Not much different than primary draw resident vs nonresident allotment. Seems fair to me

 

[ReaptheHeat]

If we break it down by just youth since they got first pick. Resident youth pulled 74% vs NR 26% of all youth that applied. Not much different than primary draw resident vs nonresident allotment. Seems fair to me

An example showing resident youth getting screwed (and clueless adults).



Here's an example of tags that adults are getting, which heavily skew that total recap report. The stats at a high level just don't matter in the secondary since there are now non-resident archery tags and its really a youth vr nr youth draw. It was much the same in 2024. Youth (their parents) aren't applying for the easy to draw tags that will be popping up on LO anyway.



Once again my original point was not that youth or nr youth shouldnt hunt. We should be giving ALL the tags to resident youth in the secondary since the premise of that draw is to allow youth more opportunity in the woods. Prioritizing NR youth over res youth and res adults goes against that intent. They are already hunting their home state and at that point are making cross-country trips to hunt somewhere else. Seems a little disingenuous to put NR youth over Res youth and res adults.

 

[KsRancher]

An example showing resident youth getting screwed (and clueless adults).
View attachment 919359


Here's an example of tags that adults are getting, which heavily skew that total recap report. The stats at a high level just don't matter in the secondary since there are now non-resident archery tags and its really a youth vr nr youth draw. It was much the same in 2024. Youth (their parents) aren't applying for the easy to draw tags that will be popping up on LO anyway.

View attachment 919346

Once again my original point was not that youth or nr youth shouldnt hunt. We should be giving ALL the tags to resident youth in the secondary since the premise of that draw is to allow youth more opportunity in the woods. Prioritizing NR youth over res youth and res adults goes against that intent. They are already hunting their home state and at that point are making cross-country trips to hunt somewhere else.

We can do this forever. But here is an example of NR youth "getting screwed".
That's a joke BTW. We look at it differently for sure. This is like arguing with guys that the weighted points for moose in Colorado doesn't give you an advantage. It does, just hard to see it when you see someone with 3+1 draws the tag and the person with 3+20 got a goose egg.

The total percentage that R vs NR youth get in the secondary draw seems fair to me. Will there be anomalies in individual hunt codes. Yes, for sure. But at the end of the day the R youth got a good share of the tags that they applied for in my opinion.

 

[MallardSX2]

Prioritizing NR youth over res youth and res adults goes against that intent. They are already hunting their home state and at that point are making cross-country trips to hunt somewhere else. Seems a little disingenuous to put NR youth over Res youth and res adults.

NR youth are NOT being prioritized over Resident youth……..that’s just a false, idiotic statement.

 

[FredH]

Wyoming is as good as it gets for residents. If you cant kill elk in Wyoming, that’s a you problem. Same with fishing. Bears and wolves exist, have for a long time now. If you can’t find elk to kill in Wyoming, bears and wolves are the least of your problem.


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I wish that were true. I have had three elk dead on the ground that were confiscated by Grizzly bears. Two near Saint Mary's peak and one near Labarge creek. Grizzly's are at record numbers presently and wolves have only been in Wyoming in any numbers since that whore Bill Clinton was in office. And yes all were on public land. That said the wolves have caused a lot of elk to move onto private property, this is great for landowners charging thousands for tresspass fees but nobody else.

 

[IdahoBeav]

No one wants that if they truly dig into it. Random draws are not your friend and certainly are not fair. You could have points and draw guaranteed every several years, move that same tag to random and you may never draw. A true bonus draw with a wait period after drawing may be just what we need up here in Wyoming.

Also, lots of folks bitching about Colorado, but 2028 can’t come soon enough.

A random draw with a multi-year wait period would be better, and a handful of deer and elk tags should be OIL.

 

[wyosam]

I wish that were true. I have had three elk dead on the ground that were confiscated by Grizzly bears. Two near Saint Mary's peak and one near Labarge creek. Grizzly's are at record numbers presently and wolves have only been in Wyoming in any numbers since that whore Bill Clinton was in office. And yes all were on public land. That said the wolves have caused a lot of elk to move onto private property, this is great for landowners charging thousands for tresspass fees but nobody else.

We’re coming up on 30 years of wolves in Wyoming, there are still plenty of elk on public land in Wyoming. Seasons are long, cow tags are plentiful, success rates for people that know how to hunt elk are really high. Hunting in grizzly country does require some planning and execution on retrieval, and some times they’ll still take them away. Sounds like you either have really bad luck, or unrealistic expectations on how long an elk can lay before bears are likely to become a problem.


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[FredH]

We’re coming up on 30 years of wolves in Wyoming, there are still plenty of elk on public land in Wyoming. Seasons are long, cow tags are plentiful, success rates for people that know how to hunt elk are really high. Hunting in grizzly country does require some planning and execution on retrieval, and some times they’ll still take them away. Sounds like you either have really bad luck, or unrealistic expectations on how long an elk can lay before bears are likely to become a problem.


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I never said elk were not plentiful. None of those elk were down longer than it took me to get to them. One I shot whil sitting on a ledge and it ran into some scrub cedar. I got down to it and a front quarter was torn of the elk. I smelled bear and backed out carefully. Another I had gutted and went to get the 4 wheeler, when I got back 20 minutes later there was a big Grizzly laying on top of it smiling at me. I had already tagged it so I was out of luck that year. Near Daniels Junction it is common for grizzly's to come when they hear a shot and investigate your marksmanship. The realistic expectation is that WGAF (perfect) should manage predators. They can't even manage a fishery.