bird dog caught in snare

[Sanchez]

There has always been a riff between trappers and bird hunters. I have caught a few dogs in leg hold traps. The bird hunters always got bent out of shape about it. Pull my traps, cuss me and just be jerks about it. They always failed to recognize that I had just as much right to be there as they do. If you don’t like it then hunt private. Your rights aren’t any more or less than trappers. Banning anything outdoors related is a loss and it’s just a matter of time before it affects something that you are passionate about.


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Posting signs is an awful regulation for trappers. Any signs posted inform others and it’s just a matter of time before someone moves in and steals your sets.

 

[JiminAZ]

I haven't read the whole thread but I have run bird dogs in the past. Never had trouble with snares or leg traps. I do know of guys who have lost dogs to conibear traps. Guys on the east coast in particular. They recommend educating yourself on how to release a conibear, and carrying the little wire tool that assists in the release.

My bird dog died a couple years ago so I am out of that game for now. Probably get another after I retire.

 

[BigNate]

I run tracking collars on them, so hopefully I can be to them in time with a snare.

If you're dogs have spent time on a leash with a collapse style collar or a "choke chain" they will sit and wait as if you stop with them at heal.

Releasing is quicker than cutting. They use a sliding tab on the cable, similar to the toggles used for tent tie downs. At the right angle there is no resistance and the cable can be pushed toward the neck making the loop bigger. Literally seconds.

 

[Sanchez]

I am only suggesting signs for conibears.

In locations where kill traps are set you should be getting away from people so I strongly doubt sets being stolen will be a significant problem. If your worried about theft, your vehicle or things in your vehicle is what will get stolen, not traps scattered across the woods.

Secretly setting kill traps on public land is not acceptable.

 

[Sanchez]

Not sure where you are at or what the laws are. We can't legally use conibears above the water line.
They are effective in what they do, that's for sure.

As for advertising where and when traps are in use - the trapper is on the line to lose a $25-$50 trap and the possibility of Joe Anti putting a road-killed cat or dog into the trap and calling F&G is pretty high.

I am in Oregon. I just read the regulations and did not see anything about only placing conibear traps below the high water line. It looks to me like they can be set anywhere.

 

[WCB]

I haven't trapped fur for many years now but when I was running a trap line the last thing I wanted to do was to advertise to the world with signage that I was working an area.
I did not use snares much back then, just legholds and conibears. I might get hammered a bit for this one but conibears should be limited to water sets to all but eliminate non target catches such as somebody's bird dog.

Conibears are absolutely lethal and should be used responsibly weather or not it is legal in their state to use on dry land.

how does a 220 or 160 in a box/bucket 5ft off the ground pose a threat to a dog? or even on the ground recessed back into said box or bucket? To me it is very very shortsighted to just say "conibers should be limited to water sets only" ever tried to catch a Marten or Fischer in the water?

 

[jmez]

In SD 330 conibears need to be in the water. 220 and 110 do not.

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[Erict]

I am only suggesting signs for conibears.

In locations where kill traps are set you should be getting away from people so I strongly doubt sets being stolen will be a significant problem. If your worried about theft, your vehicle or things in your vehicle is what will get stolen, not traps scattered across the woods.

Secretly setting kill traps on public land is not acceptable.

The regulations in my home state make it almost impossible for a dog to be caught in a legally set body-gripping trap ("conibear"). The idea of signs here would be ludicrous.

Several posters terminology indicates little to no knowledge of traps or trapping. (What exactly is a "kill trap"?) The Association of Furbearer Management has individual species recommendations and a good publication of Best Management Practices that may help y'all learn.

If I lose even one trap it is a significant problem to me, and, if I catch the thief, to them. If it ain't yours then don't touch it, don't do anything to any wild animal trapped in it and don't steal it. Do you know how much a trap costs? How much time and effort it takes to get a trap prepped?

Please educate yourself.

 

[packer58]

how does a 220 or 160 in a box/bucket 5ft off the ground pose a threat to a dog? or even on the ground recessed back into said box or bucket? To me it is very very shortsighted to just say "conibers should be limited to water sets only" ever tried to catch a Marten or Fischer in the water?

Sets off the ground pose no threat at all for obvious reasons, I probably should have been more clear about my comment for sure. But, a 330 conibear on the ground stuffed in a bucket, a box, a cubbie or a culvert is still rolling the dice on non target critters....... To me, thats where the responsible trapper part comes into play.

 

[sneaky]

Not sure where you are at or what the laws are. We can't legally use conibears above the water line.
They are effective in what they do, that's for sure.

As for advertising where and when traps are in use - the trapper is on the line to lose a $25-$50 trap and the possibility of Joe Anti putting a road-killed cat or dog into the trap and calling F&G is pretty high.

I wish it was $25 to $50 on wolf gear. A fully rigged wolf setup is $100-$175 depending on which trap you start with. I can start setting on Sept 10th here but I wait till after rifle deer because deer and elk hunters are the absolute worst about stealing traps and catches. Pretty sad that it's fellow hunters who are the biggest thieves of equipment. In Idaho if they steal a wolf out of a set and try to get reimbursed for it it's a felony, there's a couple of investigations going on for that right now. I hope they nail them.

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[sneaky]

how does a 220 or 160 in a box/bucket 5ft off the ground pose a threat to a dog? or even on the ground recessed back into said box or bucket? To me it is very very shortsighted to just say "conibers should be limited to water sets only" ever tried to catch a Marten or Fischer in the water?

We're talking about 330s. Elevated on leaning poles or on trees for Fisher and marten isn't what we're talking about. Its about the lazy dumbasses that set a 330 on the mouth of a bucket that kills dogs. Happens almost every year and kills any good will towards trappers in the public eye. If any conibear isn't recessed at least 7 inches it has the potential of catching a dog, that includes a 160 on the ground. Talked to IDFG about the recessed distance and that was the distance that all their studies had shown to reduce dog conflict while still catching target animals on flat sets. There's absolutely nothing in Idaho that we need to set a 330 on dry land for. But, it only takes one idiot to ruin it all.

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[sneaky]

Also, for goodness sake, they're foothold traps, not leg holds. Leg holds are what antis call them. Traps aren't cutting animals legs off like the antis billboards want everyone to think they do. Why would we want to cut their leg off? We lose the animal if that was the case. Bird hunters should appreciate the predator reduction effort from trappers. Every fox, coyote, skunk, possum, raccoon, bobcat removed helps the bird population.

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[WCB]

We're talking about 330s. Elevated on leaning poles or on trees for Fisher and marten isn't what we're talking about. Its about the lazy dumbasses that set a 330 on the mouth of a bucket that kills dogs. Happens almost every year and kills any good will towards trappers in the public eye. If any conibear isn't recessed at least 7 inches it has the potential of catching a dog, that includes a 160 on the ground. Talked to IDFG about the recessed distance and that was the distance that all their studies had shown to reduce dog conflict while still catching target animals on flat sets. There's absolutely nothing in Idaho that we need to set a 330 on dry land for. But, it only takes one idiot to ruin it all.

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Who is "we" the post I repkied to just said "conibear" so I pointed out that the blanket of banning them shouldnt be done. I am aslo familiar with recesses Ive set cointless box sets. If a guy is a lazy dumbass and doesnt follow trap size regs or recess regs banning will do nothing. Not sure of the point of you post

 

[Opah]

Maybe we should ban everything on public land

That is their plan, let us argue and help them Ban this and then that before long Hunting will be a thing of the Passed. Keep an eye on the Blue states, I have taught My grandson to trap Bunnies and small game. Now 12 year old's and up can get vaccinated without consent but cant learn to survive. give it time

 

[Redwing]

There was a dog killed in my area by a conibear. It was totally avoidable and I put the responsibility on the trapper. He was trapping bobcats on a small section of state surrounded by houses on acreage where everyone in the area walks their dogs. He would have been fine trapping bobcat with small snares or small leg holds but set up a conibear and killed the dog. There’s responsibility on both sides for sure. It hit the papers and along with some other poorly placed traps created a bit off a pr issue not to mention needlessly killing the dog. The fur trapper association took it upon themselves to push making it required to take a trapping class for anyone that had not had a trapping license dating back at lest 10 years. Trappers have to have some respect and common sense too. I’m a trapper and will never be in favor of banning any current trapping methods or more needless regulation but we need to be responsible with our trap placement. So many problems can be avoided with some common sense on where you place your trap and what type of trap you use depending on the area. Some sets are just not worth the risk of non target catches. The problem is 99 percent of trappers know this but the 1 percent hit the papers and give us all a black eye

This is exactly what worries me.

Setting 330s on land is going to kill pets. Killing pets is going to get trapping targeted or banned. "Only idiots set 330s on land" is what some people will say. Sure, but we all know how many idiots are out there. Snares and leg holds are one thing, Conibears on public land where there could be bird hunters or dog walkers is another thing entirely. Trappers are in the EXTREME minority in this country, and trapping could so be easily banned. It might be in the long-term best interest of trappers to give an inch to keep the mile. I grew up trapping and enjoyed it, but it WILL get banned state by state unless trappers get smart about self regulating or embracing some restrictions that protect the opportunity in the long run.

 

[packer58]

Who is "we" the post I repkied to just said "conibear" so I pointed out that the blanket of banning them shouldnt be done. I am aslo familiar with recesses Ive set cointless box sets. If a guy is a lazy dumbass and doesnt follow trap size regs or recess regs banning will do nothing. Not sure of the point of you post

Just to be clear, in the post of mine you replied to I used the word SHOULD a couple times and the word BAN exactly ZERO times. I thought i cleaned up my view in a following post but maybe not.......

 

[Trap]

This is exactly what worries me.

Setting 330s on land is going to kill pets. Killing pets is going to get trapping targeted or banned. "Only idiots set 330s on land" is what some people will say. Sure, but we all know how many idiots are out there. Snares and leg holds are one thing, Conibears on public land where there could be bird hunters or dog walkers is another thing entirely. Trappers are in the EXTREME minority in this country, and trapping could so be easily banned. It might be in the long-term best interest of trappers to give an inch to keep the mile. I grew up trapping and enjoyed it, but it WILL get banned state by state unless trappers get smart about self regulating or embracing some restrictions that protect the opportunity in the long run.

Idaho went the education route rather than the regulations route. I agree with what you’re saying on 330 but that’s a slippery slope as there are lots of land set use for conibears in general.
My experience is you give an inch they take it a mile, and even more, really education is key a 330 can be safer for dogs with the right set. Anyways I agree with you on being careful with how we trap and we need to weed out the idiots like the example locally of the conibear killing the dog on the state land surrounded by house’s.
There was zero reason for that trapper to set a conibear in that area for bobcat. From a catch standpoint I think he would have had a way better chance of catching with snares and foothold anyways. We can’t really give ground to the antis they just smell blood and push harder for more restrictions anytime they get a win. There is no compromise with antis they basically hate and want to eliminate our way of life.

 

[sneaky]

Who is "we" the post I repkied to just said "conibear" so I pointed out that the blanket of banning them shouldnt be done. I am aslo familiar with recesses Ive set cointless box sets. If a guy is a lazy dumbass and doesnt follow trap size regs or recess regs banning will do nothing. Not sure of the point of you post

The point of the post was all through this thread, if you had taken the time to actually read it, the discussion was around big conibear traps on dry land sets. You waded in half- cocked and for some reason you are now being defensive. No one singled you out so calm down. It's those lazy dumbasses that are ruining it for everyone else who follows the letter of the law. They'll also be the first to complain when things get taken away from them. Now, I'm off to check my cat walk throughs and marten boxes.

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[packer58]

Also, for goodness sake, they're foothold traps, not leg holds. Leg holds are what antis call them. Traps aren't cutting animals legs off like the antis billboards want everyone to think they do. Why would we want to cut their leg off? We lose the animal if that was the case. Bird hunters should appreciate the predator reduction effort from trappers. Every fox, coyote, skunk, possum, raccoon, bobcat removed helps the bird population.

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Good callout on terminology, they are in deed foot holds……..

 

[QuackAttack]

Predator control is the primary improvement to bird numbers for many of the birds we hunt. America has too many predators like raccoons, mink, skunk, coyote, fox, and so on.

If you like to bird hunt, you should fully support trapping.