Better "stock" up boys

[veganhunter]

America's abnormally high rate of mass shootings is a complex problem to which I won't pretend to have the solution. No one single variable is wholly responsible...its not a gun problem, nor a mental health problem, nor is it a video game problem. Its cumulatively these things and many more. Until we as a society decide we will no longer tolerate the murder of young children, things will never change. We'll just keep pointing fingers at one another with both sides refusing to give an inch.

Why does the USA have the second highest (behind only Yemen) rate of mass shootings? I don't know why. I do know that guns aren't the problem...but its not fair to think they aren't part of the problem.

 

[541hunter]

Uhhhh.... Care to elaborate?

Skickat från min G8142 via Tapatalk

Freedom of speech is used as a vehicle to propagate ideas and belief systems from one person to another. This is both good and bad. There are many instances in history where one person with radical views targeted certain types of people in an effort to recruit them to a cause. And in some cases these groups have attempted or executed mass casualties events. Speech is probably one of the most effective weapons when in the hands of an articulate person regardless of their intentions.

Please don't take me as one who is for regulation of speech, because I am far from it.


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[gelton]

Any Questions?

Murders in US very concentrated: 54% of US counties in 2014 had zero murders, 2% of counties have 51% of the murders

Murders in US very concentrated: 54% of US counties in 2014 had zero murders, 2% of counties have 51% of the murders - Crime Prevention Research CenterCrime Prevention Research Center

 

[5MilesBack]

Our rights are a bundle, not alacart:

Rights Are Bundled, Not A La Carte

If that was the case, 18 year olds would be able to buy handguns legally. If that was the case, ALL rights would be restored to felons upon serving their sentences........not just their voting rights so they can vote for the liberals.

 

[5MilesBack]

Huh?? I'm pretty sure parents and kids fear another school shooting. I'm not sure how you educate them to not fear this when there is about a 100% chance that it will happen again in the next few months. I'd recommend they all get their eternal state settled ahead of time then. Once you do that, everything becomes clear in perspective and sacrificing one's life to preserve and protect our nation and Constitution doesn't quite seem like a sacrifice anymore.

But hey, enjoy your toys. Be sure to thank the kids that gave their lives to preserve your right to own a 30 round magazine.

It shouldn't just be kids, it should be EVERY American preserving ALL our rights.......including the scary ones. There are plenty of folks in the country willing to give their lives to preserve and protect the Constitution in its entirety. Are those that want to tear it down, take it away, or infringe on the 2nd Amendment willing to give their lives to do that?

 

[Nomad]

I can translate the murder map into written words...

Breakdown of the family unit in inner city (aka, lack of father or father figure) + illegal immigrants

 

[5MilesBack]

I do know that guns aren't the problem...but its not fair to think they aren't part of the problem.

Why would they be part of the problem when 99.99% of all Americans don't have any problems acting responsibly with them? Just looking at the facts TELLS you that guns aren't the problem, they aren't even part of the problem. The problem in its entirety lies with a very minute subsect of our society that can't handle responsibility......period.

Hundreds of millions of guns are kept and used responsibly every day in America by millions of Americans. Just because a very small few of those guns are used in crime every year, doesn't make them part of the problem. I don't think they volunteered for the irresponsible behavior.

I am so sick and tired of hearing folks blame everyone and everything for their issues, their problems, their irresponsibilities, their failures, and everything else. It's the same for society......it's always something else's fault. If everyone would take 100% responsibility for themselves and their actions, this would be a much better country to live in than it has become.

 

[nrh6.7]

why would they be part of the problem when 99.99% of all americans don't have any problems acting responsibly with them? Just looking at the facts tells you that guns aren't the problem, they aren't even part of the problem. The problem in its entirety lies with a very minute subsect of our society that can't handle responsibility......period.

Hundreds of millions of guns are kept and used responsibly every day in america by millions of americans. Just because a very small few of those guns are used in crime every year, doesn't make them part of the problem. I don't think they volunteered for the irresponsible behavior.

I am so sick and tired of hearing folks blame everyone and everything for their issues, their problems, their irresponsibilities, their failures, and everything else. It's the same for society......it's always something else's fault. If everyone would take 100% responsibility for themselves and their actions, this would be a much better country to live in than it has become.

Amen!!!

 

[sndmn11]

What I learned from a handful of years in law enforcement is that there is evil in every community big or small, and that it will overrun those who expect to be shielded from it by those who are prepared to battle it. Some of that time was spent as a School Resource Officer, yes there are armed folks in some Colorado schools, and the kids who were involved in shootings CHOSE to do so away from school grounds because they knew the SROs responded quicker than the typical patrol units.
School shootings have been happening since the 50s, the same with what is now termed as "mass" shootings. They are not new, but are made notorious by the way information spreads relative to even 20 years ago. A common theme with all of these shooters who are committing their crime just for the sake of doing so, is that once they meet any sort of competent resistance, they give up.
A few posts up someone asked for a solution; mine is that society recognizes that these things are happening because society is soft and allows it (my opinion), and that a change in attitude of society to not accept it happens. If the next few instances of this were to end with no loss of life but the suspect is steam rolled by a tenacious armed citizen or two, and that became the norm, these would stop I believe. There have been a few "would be" shootings that have been stopped at the onset by either LE or private folks, but they are never publicized. I believe that our society has gotten too soft, and evil is taking advantage of that. I have witnessed my 90 year old grandfather have more fight in him than the typical 20 year old male....
Also, on the previous page someone mentioned interviews with the "students" of the FL school....a lot of accounts backed by very plain evidence are pointing to those "students" being paid actors.

 

[Beendare]

So Trump is having a 'Listening session' today where all sides are chiming in....whatever you think about Trump, its a good concept.....

i caught bits and pieces today while driving; Very interesting comment from a dad of a columbine student that started an organization [didn't catch the name]

He was saying that creating a sense of community in the schools is a key deterrent to these shootings. He went on to say that teaching Diversity causes less sense of community. He said they identified something like 3 kids a day that were considering suicide in schools due to feeling left out.

Wow,...this whole diversity thing promoted by liberals in the US is one of the roots of the problem....what do you know.....

then there is this....[not sure if its the same guy]...father of a columbine student shot says banning guns IS NOT THE ANSWER

He makes reference to religious beliefs going by the wayside as part of the problem
"In the days that followed the Columbine tragedy, I was amazed at how quickly fingers began to be pointed at groups such as the NRA. I am not a member of the NRA. I am not a hunter. I do not even own a gun. I am not here to represent or defend the NRA - because I don't believe that they are responsible for my daughter's death. Therefore I do not believe that they need to be defended. If I believed they had anything to do with Rachel's murder I would be their strongest opponent.

"I am here today to declare that Columbine was not just a tragedy-it was a spiritual event that should be forcing us to look at where the real blame lies! Much of the blame lies here in this room. Much of the blame lies behind the pointing fingers of the accusers themselves. "I wrote a poem just four nights ago that expresses my feelings best. This was written way before I knew I would be speaking here today:

Your laws ignore our deepest needs, Your words are empty air. You've stripped away our heritage, You've outlawed simple prayer. Now gunshots fill our classrooms, And precious children die. You seek for answers everywhere, And ask the question "Why?" You regulate restrictive laws, Through legislative creed. And yet you fail to understand, That God is what we need!

"Men and women are three-part beings. We all consist of body, soul, and spirit. When we refuse to acknowledge a third part of our make-up, we create a void that allows evil, prejudice, and hatred to rush in and reek havoc. Spiritual presences were present within our educational systems for most of our nation's history. Many of our major colleges began as theological seminaries. This is a historical fact. What has happened to us as a nation? We have refused to honor God, and in so doing, we open the doors to hatred and violence. And when something as terrible as Columbine's tragedy occurs - politicians immediately look for a scapegoat such as the NRA. They immediately seek to pass more restrictive laws that contribute to erode away our personal and private liberties. We do not need more restrictive laws. "Eric and Dylan would not have been stopped by metal detectors. No amount of gun laws can stop someone who spends months planning this type of massacre. The real villain lies within our own hearts. Political posturing and restrictive legislation are not the answers. The young people of our nation hold the key. There is a spiritual awakening taking place that will not be squelched! We do not need more religion. We do not need more gaudy television evangelists spewing out verbal religious garbage. We do not need more million dollar church buildings built while people with basic needs are being ignored. We do need a change of heart and a humble acknowledgment that this nation was founded on the principle of simple trust in God!

"As my son Craig lay under that table in the school library and saw his two friends murdered before his very eyes-He did not hesitate to pray in school. I defy any law or politician to deny him that right! I challenge every young person in America, and around the world, to realize that on April 20, 1999, at Columbine High School prayer was brought back to our schools. Do not let the many prayers offered by those students be in vain. Dare to move into the new millennium with a sacred disregard for legislation that violates your God-given right to communicate with Him. To those of you who would point your finger at the NRA - I give to you a sincere challenge. Dare to examine your own heart before casting the first stone! My daughter's death will not be in vain! The young people of this country will not allow that to happen!"

[video=youtube;kgvcgydAIJk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgvcgydAIJk[/video]

 

[dotman]

Yeah I listened to it, it was a pretty good conversation from all sides.

 

[veganhunter]

Better "stock" up boys

Why would they be part of the problem when 99.99% of all Americans don't have any problems acting responsibly with them? Just looking at the facts TELLS you that guns aren't the problem, they aren't even part of the problem. The problem in its entirety lies with a very minute subsect of our society that can't handle responsibility......period.

Hundreds of millions of guns are kept and used responsibly every day in America by millions of Americans. Just because a very small few of those guns are used in crime every year, doesn't make them part of the problem. I don't think they volunteered for the irresponsible behavior.

I am so sick and tired of hearing folks blame everyone and everything for their issues, their problems, their irresponsibilities, their failures, and everything else. It's the same for society......it's always something else's fault. If everyone would take 100% responsibility for themselves and their actions, this would be a much better country to live in than it has become.

HAHAHAHA so your solution for a very real problem is to wish for something that will never happen.

I too wish to live in a world in which people took responsibility for their actions. I also think it’s a bit of a stretch to wish for all of humanity to fundamentally change its behavior. How Ayn Rand of you.

 

[mtnwrunner]

Some really good information and thoughts in this thread. And some bad.
These mass murders are horrendous and as others have said, the solutions are complex. Banning anything isn't going to help as the majority of us know. I've got AR's, shotguns, pistols, rifles and have no plans of not having them.
I was a LEO for 22 years in a large sheriffs department, (kcso) Seattle area and went to a many many shootings, homicides etc and never once did any of them involve an AR. They get used in very little shootings, it's just they are involved in the most emotional ones. I get it.....it makes me sick to see and even think about kids, friends or loved ones getting killed.
People get murdered every day and those killings for the most part, go by the wayside. I sure don't know what the answers are but compromise somehow has to happen and what I mean by that, our way of life is going to be different. And taking away guns won't solve anything......I actually think mass murders and crimes would go WAY up.
This photo is from a local school district.....god bless idaho.

Randy

 

[Nomad]

A few posts up someone asked for a solution; mine is that society recognizes that these things are happening because society is soft and allows it (my opinion), and that a change in attitude of society to not accept it happens.

"Softer than baby shit"... according to Aron Synder. He's right of course. What would the attitude have been to a school shooting in the late 1800s horse and buggy days? I'm pretty sure Dr Quinn, Medicine Woman is the only one who would have thought about banning guns as a viable solution.

 

[204guy]

Haven't read all the posts but this issue isn't all that complicated to me. We ABSOLUTELY DO NO HAVE TO DO SOMETHING, there have been more stupid laws and regs passed under that pretense than anything else. Fact is we have far more freedoms in this country than any other. There are some dangers that come with that freedom but I'm not willing to trade any freedom whatsoever for what is simply a feel good solution. How stupid is that? Yet that is all that is ever proposed.

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[IdahoElk]

America's abnormally high rate of mass shootings is a complex problem to which I won't pretend to have the solution. No one single variable is wholly responsible...its not a gun problem, nor a mental health problem, nor is it a video game problem. Its cumulatively these things and many more. Until we as a society decide we will no longer tolerate the murder of young children, things will never change. We'll just keep pointing fingers at one another with both sides refusing to give an inch.

Why does the USA have the second highest (behind only Yemen) rate of mass shootings? I don't know why. I do know that guns aren't the problem...but its not fair to think they aren't part of the problem.

We also have a extremely high teen suicide rate and teens on depression medication,think there is a connection?

 

[dotman]

Yeah they never bring up the legal pharma drugs heavily used on our youth.

 

[tracker12]

Kid could have killed a lot more people with a shotgun and a bag full of buckshot, but I don’t want either of those banned either. While I agree that bump stocks are not needed, nor do I wish to own one, banning them will not prevent the next school shooting. Where there is a will there is a way.

And you cannot appease the anti-gun crowd, they simply move onto the next thing.

I do not agree we should ban anything to appease the anti's. But I'm ll for doing something that keeps our kids safe.

 

[KBC]

Yeah they never bring up the legal pharma drugs heavily used on our youth.

This is a side effect of for profit health care. Drugs make people rich, other things not so much.

 

[colersu22]

What about changing the age to purchase these semi-auto rifles to 21? they already do it for handguns.

A local gun store in Wa is in the news this week for this, he said his new store policy is to no longer sell long guns(as he kept referencing an AR15) to anyone under 21 unless you are military. I was wondering if he was just talking about AR platforms or if that means a bolt action rifle or shotgun. As of yesterday there was another gun dealer that said he is going to do the same.

The thing I am confused about is if it is legal in Wa to own a long gun when your 18 and he wont sell it to you how it isn't age discrimination, I mean if a cake baker gets sued for not selling a wedding cake to a gay couple for discrimination how can this guy not sell you a rifle when you are the legal age in Wa to own it.