Benefits of a high end action

[Pharmseller]

Usually five.

How available is the match ammo you’re talking about?

 

[HeavyAssault]

Reply:

High end rifle with factory ammo is like dating a hot stripper and making her wear baggy sweats all the time.

Well if your "high end rifle" NEEDS hand loads to get you to 0.4" well.......you got problems OR you are the problem.

I'll agree...if a user is good with MOA then so be it. Bet no one goes into a LGS asking for the cheapest rifle they can buy, dresses it with a Tasco, and dime store scope rings. Then sets out "cross country" on their elk hunt. I'd like to see that video unedited.

 

[Pharmseller]

I’m usually the problem.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

I've been around the horn on this one. Started with custom Remingtons, then moved on to other high-end actions. Then came the Tikkas, which have quite many of the perceived benefits custom actions tout (bolt throw, prefit barrels), and have a great factory trigger. As one who doesn't care for large magnum calibers, the Tikka action size is fine.

The largest negative for me is simply the lack of good stocks for the Tikka. The Manners EH1 is pretty decent mind you, but that's about it, and I've had a bunch of different stocks. Too much drop in the heel, or too low of a comb in almost all of them, and I personally hate adding a kydex cheek riser or stock pack to a $500-800 stock. Hate it. If Alterra starts making their stocks again though, I think I'd be happy to have 1 more options again.

The lack of stocks has made me start looking at building off an Origin, which I've had before and has a ton of bang for the buck.

Have you tried or looked at the Boyd's "At-One" for Tikka action? Tooless LOP and comb adjustment, swappable grip and fore end...

at-one

 

[vonb]

Custom actions are nice. However, I get just as much enjoyment out of shooting and hunting with a factory action. I have both. If you are looking for accuracy, get to know your gun no matter the type and get it shooting tight.

 

[Darryle]

My gunsmith says there is no real benefit. All these new, "high-end" actions are just a fad and don't warrant the price in his opinion.

Of course not, he wants people to pay him to lighten, true, correct extraction timing, install Sako or M16 style extractors, Bush firing pin holes, fit long mag boxes and overall blueprint a factory action.

It's silly to think there is no value in a $700 custom action like a Mack Brothers Evo II outfitted already for a DBM, pinned trigger hangers, M16 extractors, small firing pins, pinned scope mounts, tool less takedown and available prefit barrels so the average guy can build a custom rifle that exceeds anything Remington produced in the last 15yrs of existence.

To each his own, but from here on out, it will be custom actions/rifles only for me.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Of course not, he wants people to pay him to lighten, true, correct extraction timing, install Sako or M16 style extractors, Bush firing pin holes, fit long mag boxes and overall blueprint a factory action.

It's silly to think there is no value in a $700 custom action like a Mack Brothers Evo II outfitted already for a DBM, pinned trigger hangers, M16 extractors, small firing pins, pinned scope mounts, tool less takedown and available prefit barrels so the average guy can build a custom rifle that exceeds anything Remington produced in the last 15yrs of existence.

To each his own, but from here on out, it will be custom actions/rifles only for me.

Totally confused by this answer. Unless you’re a match shooter, there are several factory rifles with MOA guarantees, or better, for hunting rifles. If that’s not good enough, a guy can get a donor rifle or factory action and go semi custom to improve precision with a prefit barrel. Then a guy can go custom hand loads to get even further dialed in.

The value prop of a custom action for $800-1000+ vs. a Tikka, Savage, REM 700, or Remage 700 action and a prefit barrel isn’t there for a hunting rifle.

To each their own and buy what makes you happy.

 

[Darryle]

Totally confused by this answer. Unless you’re a match shooter, there are several factory rifles with MOA guarantees, or better, for hunting rifles. If that’s not good enough, a guy can get a donor rifle or factory action and go semi custom to improve precision with a prefit barrel. Then a guy can go custom hand loads to get even further dialed in.

The value prop of a custom action for $800-1000+ vs. a Tikka, Savage, REM 700, or Remage 700 action and a prefit barrel isn’t there for a hunting rifle.

To each their own and buy what makes you happy.

Have you had a custom action? Simple yes or no answer.

Factory actions, other than possibly a Tikka will not feed long COAL custom loads from the magazine, then it's still a crap shoot.

Case in point 25-280 Ackley with the new 133gr Elite Hunter loaded at 3.394", my new 26-280 Ackley will be right at 3.600" with the Berger 156gr EOL.



Show me any factory action that will reliably feed those from a factory mag.

My statement wasn't a slam on factory actions, I have plenty, my statement was about a gunsmith poo-pooing custom actions with a broad brush. If he truly feels that way and can't see the benefits, it's time to find a new gunsmith.

The Remington new Alpha is proof, custom actions as a whole have markedly changed the face of rifles and for the better. Go back 5 or 10 or 15yrs and you can see as custom actions evolved, so did factory actions just to be able to stay in the hunt.

Then look at Nosler, Bergara, Christensen, Seekins and Springfield just to name a few that sprang up a factory action with custom attributes.

This brings me to my second point, you spend $700 on a Tikka, sell the stock, barrel, buy aftermarket magazine/bottom metal, trigger spring, tools to remove and install a prefit, buy a prefit, add a Manners or Mesa stock, bedding/fitting work, steel recoil lug, chop and thread and whatever else you want.

Why not start with a Mack Brothers Evo II stainless action for $680ish, no peddling old parts, shipping old parts, you can accomplish the same result with a better foundation. I know the better foundation is completely subjective.

Benefits being the subject of this thread, here are just a few I can think of

Stainless
Trigger pins
Correct primary extraction
DBM bottom metal ready
Wyatt's mag box ready
Sako/M16 extractor
Threaded bolt handle
Pinned scope mounts (majority but not all)
8-40 screws (majority but not all)
Small diameter firing pin
One piece design (majority but not all)
Prefit ready (majority but not all)

 

[Reburn]

This brings me to my second point, you spend $700 on a Tikka, sell the stock, barrel, buy aftermarket magazine/bottom metal, trigger spring, tools to remove and install a prefit, buy a prefit, add a Manners or Mesa stock, bedding/fitting work, steel recoil lug, chop and thread and whatever else you want.

Why not start with a Mack Brothers Evo II stainless action for $680ish, no peddling old parts, shipping old parts, you can accomplish the same result with a foundation. I know the better foundation is completely subjective.

IME the tikka is a smoother action.

I dont have experience with the mack brothers specifically but about 8-11 other high end rem 700 footprint actions. The tikka action has been the smoothest and easiest to cycle fast without binding.

@Formidilosus has plenty to say about rem 700 triggers not being drop safe and not holding up well to dust and freezing so there is that too.

 

[Formidilosus]

@Formidilosus has plenty to say about rem 700 triggers not being drop safe and not holding up well to dust and freezing so there is that too.

The R700 trigger system eliminates any “custom” action for serious contention, or should.

For all- there’s nothing “custom” about any of the aftermarket actions. They are simply machined how actions should have been machined from the start. Custom denotes fitting and handwork for a specific person- a Deviant, Defiant, Origin, Surgeon, Mack Bros, etc, etc., are not custom- they are aftermarket.

Now can someone explain in actual objective use what is better about any of the aftermarket actions compared to a Tikka T3 or Sako S20(for true LA?) I’m speaking to action reliability, resistance to bolt bind, feeding, precision, concentricity, trigger reliability, durability, function in adverse conditions, etc., etc.

 

[WeiserBucks]

Integral rail and recoil lug is desirable for me.

 

[Formidilosus]

Integral rail and recoil lug is desirable for me.

Ok. Both of the actions I stated have integral rails. So how does an integral recoil lug effect function? Or better stated- what actual issue show up in high round counts and hard use of the Tikka and Sako S20 lugs?

 

[WeiserBucks]

No experience with the Sako, but I've seen factory Tikka lugs deform in factory stocks. I wasn't clear on the integral rail statement, I prefer an integral pic rail whenever possible.

 

[Formidilosus]

No experience with the Sako, but I've seen factory Tikka lugs deform in factory stocks. I wasn't clear on the integral rail statement, I prefer an integral pic rail whenever possible.

T3x steel lugs deform? And what problems did that cause?

I am around multiple extremely high round count tikkas, and while I have seen the old aluminum lugs deform, I haven’t seen it cause any functional issue if the action screws are torqued; and I haven’t seen any T3x issues at all.

 

[Formidilosus]

To be clear I am not saying Tikkas are perfect, it’s just that there can be no action that matches it in function especially in adverse weather while it’s using a R700 based trigger system.

It is absolutely ridiculous that there are no NA made actions or rifles that best a $600 Finnish rifle. The only one that is equal in function is the KRG SOTIC which is a direct copy of a TRG.

 

[WeiserBucks]

The Tikka lugs that I've seen deform were aluminum. Once it develops the lug can no longer do its job properly and then the action screws come loose. Retorque action screws, lug deforms further, rinse and repeat until the lug is dealt with permanently.

 

[Eastman528]

My minds made up, I'm selling my Remington 700 long action rifle it's in the classifieds right now. Will probably put my custom savage short action up for sale as well and use the funds to start a new build. Haven't decided 100% on action but will be one of the "aftermarket" brands. If I liked the stock options I had with Tikka wouldn't be upossed to that either. Once I did the math on getting the remington to where I personally wanted it I could buy a bighorn or simular or save a little and get a Defiance etc. I think the remington is fine if your happy with it as is. My custom savage shoots absolutely lights out but then again it's still a Savage and my biggest complaint is stock options although that's getting better.

 

[Samg1707]

My minds made up, I'm selling my Remington 700 long action rifle it's in the classifieds right now. Will probably put my custom savage short action up for sale as well and use the funds to start a new build. Haven't decided 100% on action but will be one of the "aftermarket" brands. If I liked the stock options I had with Tikka wouldn't be upossed to that either. Once I did the math on getting the remington to where I personally wanted it I could buy a bighorn or simular or save a little and get a Defiance etc. I think the remington is fine if your happy with it as is. My custom savage shoots absolutely lights out but then again it's still a Savage and my biggest complaint is stock options although that's getting better.

Hey can you pm me about that rem 700 lh you got