Basic survival items

It may help make good kits if you start to separate survival and emergency items for the kits.

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Emergency candle tins-larger 3 wick weighs around 50 grams, smaller tin is considerably less.
I keep some good stormproof matches and a striker in the larger tin.

Emergency- quick, e-z, fast and light shelter. Heat source/flame extender. Trauma treatment-tq, tape, and ect. Signaling items (signal panel-road flares). Water treatment tablets & one gallon zip lock bag.
Light wrist compass-cammenga.
Small-simple kit for an 'emergency'.
JMO-YMMV
 
@txtransplant @Pilsner @sierracharlie338
@justinspicher

On the tq (or 2). Ive always been with Justin on this, in that I think for what I do in the backcountry—including hunting—the odds of a wound requiring a tq are so low that I havent even considered carrying one, let alone 2. But I grew up long before cell phones, gps’s, sat phones, and other such things were even available, and its been a while since I was carrying a fa kit for work, so its entirely possible I’m just set in my ways and not seeing a scenario that makes it a likely must-have. Could you guys outline some of the scenarios you see a tq (or two) being necessary OTHER than being shot or shooting someone?
 
Anytime you use a knife or posses broadhead tipped arrows you can have an accident which may produce profuse bleeding. Israeli bandage and tq to be safe but the tq needs to be easily accessible.
YMMV
 
Fire starter. A little Leuko tape and Duct Tape.

I don’t carry a tourniquet but I’ve transported a couple people to the hospital at the fire department that accidentally stabbed their legs hitting major arteries while field dressing animals and would have died had they not had one.
 
@txtransplant @Pilsner @sierracharlie338
@justinspicher

On the tq (or 2). Ive always been with Justin on this, in that I think for what I do in the backcountry—including hunting—the odds of a wound requiring a tq are so low that I havent even considered carrying one, let alone 2. But I grew up long before cell phones, gps’s, sat phones, and other such things were even available, and its been a while since I was carrying a fa kit for work, so its entirely possible I’m just set in my ways and not seeing a scenario that makes it a likely must-have. Could you guys outline some of the scenarios you see a tq (or two) being necessary OTHER than being shot or shooting someone?
Blade accidents always have that potential. Even worse if you’re archery hunting - a lot more opportunity for a blade to catch you. Somebody on Alone a year or two ago put a broad head into their thigh - could have died quickly if it hit a main artery.

If you’re not aware, the trauma guidance on TQs has changed over the years. In the 90s, it was “apply a TQ as a last resort.” They found that a lot of people that needed a TQ were not getting it and bled out as a result.

It really only takes a few seconds to lose consciousness from blood loss, and several more to lose a pulse. You can find plenty of videos online of folks getting cuts and passing out moments later.

You need to have a TQ somewhere that you can deploy and apply it QUICK.
 
Thats correct, in the 90’s we were absolutely taught that you’re as likely to do more harm with a tq than you are good, and they were actively discouraged even for folks with a reasonably decent amount of training. And it was in the 90’s when I last re-upped my more-involved fa training.

I remain skeptical. Been using knives and arrows for 40+ years without more than a superficial cut. Worst Ive seen is a few cuts to hands requiring a few stitches, certainly nothing id use a tq on. BUT as you said a tq is very light and takes up little room, so the cost to have it is low. I keep one in the med kit in my truck. I’ll chew on it.

Why 2 tq’s? Are you carrying two in case one isnt sufficient to stop heavy arterial bleeding? Or for ambidextrous access? Im thinking two is excessive, but if im going to consider it might as well actually understand the why.
 
Thats correct, in the 90’s we were absolutely taught that you’re as likely to do more harm with a tq than you are good, and they were actively discouraged even for folks with a reasonably decent amount of training. And it was in the 90’s when I last re-upped my more-involved fa training.

I remain skeptical. Been using knives and arrows for 40+ years without more than a superficial cut. Worst Ive seen is a few cuts to hands requiring a few stitches, certainly nothing id use a tq on. BUT as you said a tq is very light and takes up little room, so the cost to have it is low. I keep one in the med kit in my truck. I’ll chew on it.

Why 2 tq’s? Are you carrying two in case one isnt sufficient to stop heavy arterial bleeding? Or for ambidextrous access? Im thinking two is excessive, but if im going to consider it might as well actually understand the why.


TQ has been a big pendulum swing, and it's coming back around to being recommended less:


 
Regarding superglue: Any old SG will do? Or go with medical grade SG?

Also, no SG I've ever used will survive a pack so you folks must put the SG tube in a small tin of some sort?

Thanks,

Eddie

This has been one of the best super glue purchases I've made: Single-Use Minis.

They're tiny metal-foil tubes, sealed, and are pretty tough to being in your gear. I went to these because large bottles kept going bad after being used even once, with just a month or two on the shelf afterward. In my pack, I keep them in the same small plastic box I keep a selection of band-aids in. And 9 times out of 10, the super glue has turned out to be the better choice for anything I would otherwise put a band-aid on. Especially in the field. Seals things right up, and gets you back to work.
 
Thats correct, in the 90’s we were absolutely taught that you’re as likely to do more harm with a tq than you are good, and they were actively discouraged even for folks with a reasonably decent amount of training. And it was in the 90’s when I last re-upped my more-involved fa training.

Why 2 tq’s? Are you carrying two in case one isnt sufficient to stop heavy arterial bleeding? Or for ambidextrous access? Im thinking two is excessive, but if im going to consider it might as well actually understand the why.
The war in the Middle East has changed a lot of theories in trauma medicine and TQs specifically. For instance we know now that a proper TQ can be applied and left in place for 6-8 hours without any damage to the limb. There are even documented cases where a soldier sustained a blast injury and was kept alive due to the use of a TQ despite losing a limb.

Aside from impalements, crushing injuries (rock slide or timber fall) or broken bones can also cause an arterial bleed. I know of an instance where a guy stood on his brake pedal in an attempt to prevent hitting another vehicle. Impact broke both femurs, cutting his femoral arteries, and he bled out sitting in the driver seat of his vehicle. Same impact could potentially occur from a fall?

Just because you never have had a knife slip doesn’t mean it won’t ever happen.

Yes carrying two can be for leg injuries as sometimes one is not enough. Also once you place a TQ generally it only gets removed by medical professionals so in the event your injury doesn’t stop bleeding you will need a second.

The weight penalty for a North American Rescue CAT tourniquet is negligible even if you never need it IMO.

The only wrong answer is taking medical supplies you don’t know how to use 😂 other than that, it’s all personal preference.
 
@txtransplant @Pilsner @sierracharlie338
@justinspicher

On the tq (or 2). Ive always been with Justin on this, in that I think for what I do in the backcountry—including hunting—the odds of a wound requiring a tq are so low that I havent even considered carrying one, let alone 2. But I grew up long before cell phones, gps’s, sat phones, and other such things were even available, and its been a while since I was carrying a fa kit for work, so its entirely possible I’m just set in my ways and not seeing a scenario that makes it a likely must-have. Could you guys outline some of the scenarios you see a tq (or two) being necessary OTHER than being shot or shooting someone?
The #1 reason for backcountry injury currently is cuts to the hunters non-dominate hand via a scalpel blade knife. This surpasses twisted ankles, dehydration, etc.
Add in broadheads, bullets, and blades and I can stop naming examples there...
So, if the #1 cause of injury is self-induced cuts, then being able to deal with the worst type of cuts seems a prudent measure to have available right?
Bad cuts = tourniquets.
Followed by gauze, pressure, et all.
Plan for the worst, hope for the best.
I am a retired military combat medic and IF you need a tourniquet then there isn't much that will make a good substitution for a tourniquet. At least not that will be useful to you this lifetime.
Torniquets are cheap, lightweight, and easy to apply.

I can hear the folks now - I can improvise a TQ from my belt or whatever. No, you can't get the same effect from an improvised item as you get from the real thing. Sad but true.
If you don't have one the gimme your address and I will send you one at my own expense.
What is YOUR excuse for not carrying one and having the training necessary to use one?!
 
I have one in my car where I'm most likely to encounter a catastrophic event but I'm not convinced in a back country event that someone would be evacuated within that small time frame where a TQ would be truly beneficial.

Sent from my SM-S926U using Tapatalk
 
Here’s my basics and then some. The idea is to have options on surviving, fire, shelter and warm clothes. Considering taking my stove instead off all the fire starting stuff as it can make hot drinks and food while being a great torch.
Meds

-Tylenol, aspirin, allergy, pepto, tums

1st aid and general use items

-Vaseline

-gauze

-duct tape

-luekotape

-OE knife w/ 3 blades

-2’x3’ foil for signaling, keep fire area dry, reflect heat

-trash bag

Fire

-mini bic

-lightning strike ferro rod with tinder discs

-bag of small tinder for a birds nest

Shelter

-rope 50’ bank line for shelter

-tarp

-bivvy

-pad

Misc

-compass

-paper maps

-aqua tabs

-power bank

-spare head lamp

-tp

Not stored in the kit but with me

-Zoleo satellite messenger

-puffy top & bottom

-socks

-puffy gloves

-game bags for more insulation/pillow.

-phone that can sos via satellite, has offline maps and a decent compass.
 
TQ guys, @Pilsner , Im chewing on it. I have one, so thanks for that offer but no need, but as noted I was trained +\- to NOT use it, so thats probably the biggest reason. Apart from that, as far as why I dont carry it, I carry fa and emergency gear for common things, and I act paranoid to avoid the uncommon stuff. And thats where I often choose to plan for improvising, because it is uncommon. That approach obviously works until it doesnt, I just cant pack everything so its truly a calculated risk based on probabilities. Risk= consequence * probability, and I think the probability is low enough that Im comfortable with the risk. Ive been hunting for almost forty years, I was a climbing guide, spent summers leading backpacking trips, etc. every step along the way, I’ve built my life to spend more time outside. I’ve probably spent more cumulative time in the backcountry than some of the 20-somethings here have been alive. I’ve seen a handful of pretty bad injuries, including several involving helicopter rescues, but Ive never seen any backcountry injury even remotely close to requiring a tq. Plenty of off-hand cuts, but none even close to needing a tq. Stitches, yes. Bleeding-out, no. BUT they’re light so I’ll consider it, although I think Id need some practice and further training first, its been a long time.

Basically I carry for:
Getting caught out after dark
Getting lost or unexpected route change
Unexpected Bad weather
Minor to moderate injury (minor to moderate cuts, abrasions, sprains/strains, minor to moderate burns, etc), possibly slowing or stopping travel
Dehydration
Hypothermia
Frostbite (traditionally Ive been out a lot in winter wx)

In all my time in the backcountry Id say BY FAR the most common actual first aid problems Ive run into are burns from boiling water, hypothermia, dehydration, sprains/strains, and minor-ish cuts and abrasions, (not in any order). Sometimes in combination. Ime “dramatic” stuff just doesnt come up if you are careful, so I choose to improvise there rather than carry extra gear that—even if “light”— takes up some extra space and weight. I truly think this covers me for 99.9% of the addressable issues I will run into. And as-said, Im aware of some areas where if an issue comes up I would be left improvising to address it, or where Im not prepared. Rockfall is something that I’ve run into climbing, I’ve seen a few pretty bad injuries from it, but I don’t bring a helmet when I’m hunting, even though I’m sometimes in terrain where rockfall can happen. This is by choice. I don’t even own an Inreach, and I routinely hunt where there is zero cell reception. I cut my teeth in the era when no one even had a cell phone, because they didn’t exist yet, so I’m very used to not having any way to communicate with the outside world if something happened. Some of my not owning an Inreach is simply obstinance, because to a degree I resent technology in the backcountry, but this is another conscious decision. There was a saying when I was climbing a lot, “ if you carry Bivy gear, you’ll use it”. People were saying that if you bring something for a contingency, the fact that you have it will CAUSE you to “need” it. I think there is some falsehood to that and Im sure theres confirmation-bias, but there is for sure truth to it as well. To at least a degree, that part of my upbringing informs my first aid kit decisions, right or wrong.
And there are many, many times when I have turned around and gone home because I found myself in a situation that I had decided to not be prepared for. Unlike a battlefield situation, I have the option to go home pretty much whenever I want, and I have nothing to prove so thats a realistic option for me at any time. In a situation where I can’t control that part of it nearly as much, obviously my calculus would look different.
I’m not advocating that other people should think about it this way, but that’s the direction I’m coming from.
 
-2’x3’ foil for signaling, keep fire area dry, reflect heat

That's a great idea. It also brought up a long-forgotten memory from a SAR class I had as a kid: use samples of aluminum foil to imprint your or your kids' shoe treads before heading out, especially if camping or in places where there will be a lot of people.

You basically lay a square of foil down over a folded towel, and just step down onto the foil to leave the shoe's imprint. Those get kept at camp if camping, or at home if you're out hunting or hiking, and can be used by SAR personnel as quick reference to cut through the noise early on in a search.
 
I don’t even own an Inreach, and I routinely hunt where there is zero cell reception. I cut my teeth in the era when no one even had a cell phone, because they didn’t exist yet, so I’m very used to not having any way to communicate with the outside world if something happened. Some of my not owning an Inreach is simply obstinance, because to a degree I resent technology in the backcountry, but this is another conscious decision.

Same, almost exactly.

My thinking on this changed entirely with this though, just recently. From two, maybe three specific things: my stable, calm wife getting surprisingly unsettled at me missing a check-in (unexpectedly went long in a no-service area), and what happened with those two elk hunters that went missing in Colorado last week. Specifically, how much faster the search would have happened if they'd had an in-reach pinging steadily - whether assisting in rescue, or recovery. A surprising thing that came up in the thread about that here was how important it is even for just quickly resolving the legal, bureaucratic, and insurance/estate issues involved in finding an actual body, instead of it being an eternal "missing person" case, and closing that chapter conclusively.

Between all that, and the family fun bonus of having a young kiddo be able to be more involved in dad's hunt by tracking me online, my thinking pulled a 180. If I were single and no kids, I might not care as much. But at this point, despite my personal tastes, it's become one of those things where it seems more irresponsible than just a personal choice not to have a tracker on. That thread on the missing elk hunters was something of an illuminating wakeup call, on things I just hadn't considered before.
 
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