Backcountry Rifle Scope

[Doc Holliday]

Did Form run his test on the Credo ?

I have my eyeballs on one and would like to save some cash on it over the Tenmile.

Trijicon 2.5-15x42mm Credo HX SFP Field Evaluation

This is a field evaluation of the Trijicon 2.5-15x42mm Credo HX SFP, Red MOA Center Dot Reticle scope. This scope was sent to Ryan Avery for an evaluation. It was personally purchased. The ammunition used was my personal purchased 175gr SMK. The baseline 30 round group with the lot of...

www.rokslide.com

 

[Quicksilver]

Thanks guys, you just forced me to buy a credo

 

[SDHNTR]

Trijicon 2.5-15x42mm Credo HX SFP Field Evaluation

This is a field evaluation of the Trijicon 2.5-15x42mm Credo HX SFP, Red MOA Center Dot Reticle scope. This scope was sent to Ryan Avery for an evaluation. It was personally purchased. The ammunition used was my personal purchased 175gr SMK. The baseline 30 round group with the lot of...

www.rokslide.com

Was that eval ever formally completed?

 

[Doc Holliday]

Was that eval ever formally completed?

Doesn't look like it

 

[amassi]

Did Form run his test on the Credo ?

I have my eyeballs on one and would like to save some cash on it over the Tenmile.

If you decide that's the scope for you I have an extra 2.5-15x42 credo hx in moa I'm about to list

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

 

[amassi]

I heard a rumor that NF is discontinuing the NXS 2.5-10x42. It still shows in their catalog online, however.

If this were true I’d be very disappointed, as I have put that scope on every backpack hunting rifle I own…

To be replaced with the 4-16x44 in ffp or sfp.

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

 

[SouthPaw]

4-16x44 in ffp

I hope that's true.

 

[Desert Hntr]

I looked at the credo but would like to stick with a FFP. I’m pretty rough on my gear and want it to function when I bust my ass on the mountain which happens often. So I’m leaning more toward the NF NX8 now. Discounts aside I want to put my money where it counts. I wish I could justify a 10x scope but I just feel like it’s going to leave me wanting a little more.

 

[Rob5589]

Was that eval ever formally completed?

He said in the eval thread that the owner sold the scope before he could finish.

 

[pwrdbycotn]

I looked at the credo but would like to stick with a FFP. I’m pretty rough on my gear and want it to function when I bust my ass on the mountain which happens often. So I’m leaning more toward the NF NX8 now. Discounts aside I want to put my money where it counts. I wish I could justify a 10x scope but I just feel like it’s going to leave me wanting a little more.

I felt the same way about wanting my scope to hold zero and track properly, even if it takes a hard fall, so I went Tangent Theta.

 

[ResearchinStuff]

I felt the same way about wanting my scope to hold zero and track properly, even if it takes a hard fall, so I went Tangent Theta.

so how did it do in your drop tests?

 

[pwrdbycotn]

so how did it do in your drop tests?

Bought three of them in the summer of 2021. Unfortunately my wife couldn’t deer hunt last fall due to a surgery, but I dropped like five doe and one buck whitetail and then in August (2022) my wife and I both dropped caribou on the north slope of the Brooks, my shot at 420 and hers at 664.
So yeah, drop tests went well

 

[amassi]

Every Tangent Theta is drop tested (along with several other tests) at their facility in a controlled, standardized, and repeatable environment. It's not backyard bubba silliness.

Drop test (100 drops @ 1,000 G's)
https://www.instagram.com/p/Bw-D6ykn9PV/?utm_medium=copy_link

Whip test

Tangent Theta on Instagram: "We call it the “WHIP” combine that with our drop test machine, aka the “equalizer” and you can see pretty quickly if if anything’s floating around in the tube! 😉 🇨🇦👁 #tangenttheta #armamenttechnology"

103 likes, 3 comments - tangent_theta_inc on February 5, 2019: "We call it the “WHIP” combine that with our drop test machine, aka the “equalizer” and you can see pretty quickly if if anything’s floating around in the tube! 😉 🇨🇦👁 #tangenttheta #armamenttechnology".

www.instagram.com

Click test

Immersion (pressure) Testing

Cold Room Testing
View attachment 460478

Their drop tester looks more like a recoil tool made out of paint shaker, Unless they tipped that table over?
Leupold has the same tests, probably zeiss, swarovski and vortex as well but...

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

 

[ResearchinStuff]

TT explicitly says the purpose of the equalizer is see if there is anything floating around in the tube. It's right in the post.

Debris in the tube is an optical performance issue, not a zero retention validation, unless the debris happens to be pieces of lens or tube. Is there additional information where they explain how the equalizer is used to verify zero retention?

 

[amassi]

Can you post up links to the tests by leupold, zeiss, swarovski, and vortex?

Did your Google break after you simped up the theta test?

Lifetime Guarantee

We’ve been making world-class optics that bear our family name for over 100 years. We honor that legacy every day as we design, machine and assemble…

www.leupold.com

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

 

[nobody]

I think the point is that Form's testing is real life. Cool, a company can perform a test in a controlled environment, but how does that shaking, rattling, and rolling relate to a fall or a dropped weapon? Call it "bubba" all you want, it's real life. Sheep hunts and backcountry mule deer hunts don't happen in a "facility in a controlled, standardized, and repeatable environment." They happen in the hills, at weird angles and in less than desirable conditions. I don't care what happens in a vacuum or in some company's factory, I care what happens when it's strapped atop my rifle and tips over or tumbles. That's what these optics companies aren't understanding, we don't care that their optics are "tested to 50,000 G's of force," that means nothing to your average mouth breather. What I wanna know is will the freakin' thing hold zero when it gets bumped or rides in a case across the country or slips from my hand on a stalk. Period. That's what matters. They're designing them to survive their specific tests, not actual use. I'll never own a 50 BMG, so I don't care if my scope won't survive the recoil from one. What I DO care about is that they hold zero under use and occasional accidental abuse.

What would be real interesting would be to take a Vortex optic and give it to Leupold to run through their testing protocol, and vice-versa. I bet both companies break their competitors' scopes. Why? Because Leupold build's them to meet Leupold's standards and "tests," and Vortex does the same with their own. You can replace Leupold and Vortex with any of the major optics manufacturers in the world, the outcome would probably be identical. The problem is there's no global standard, nobody is designing their scopes to survive anything but their own small subset of "tests," and those "tests" don't equate to anything in real life.

But hey, I'm just some random guy on the internet...

 

[ResearchinStuff]

no, the mean radius is not actually relevant for POI shift, which is the most common failure in the scopes tested. Mean radius is relevant for the scopes that fail to hold zero outright, like the one that had some rounds landing several feet from the point of aim. You did not include any examples of that.

Anyhow, identify the the geometric center of the group for the zero check, and the geometric center of the group for the drop tests, and that difference is the POI shift. when it's large enough to merit making a scope adjustment, that's a failure in my book.

there's math, and then there's data interpretation, and then there's operationalizing that data, and then there's testing your own theories, which at the end of it all is the only thing that matters.

 

[Formidilosus]

I get it that there are folks on here that have fully bought into the backyard bubba drop tests. For those folks, here's data straight from those drop "tests". More than one were said to have passed and more than one were said to have failed. Tell me why.

As a hint, and because the average American has a 6th grade understanding of mathematics, you should be looking at the mean radius with this itty bitty data set from each scope.
View attachment 460486

I'm all ears....

Let’s have @Ryan Avery set a range up. You show up with any rifle you want that’s 10’ish plus pounds, your current TT and two more, zero them yourself and drop it from any spot and height/angle you want 10x. Then I will buy 3x NF from the local store with you standing there, mount on a rifle, and do the exact same thing you do with the TT. If the TT’s holds zero for those impacts and the NF’s don’t, I’ll pay for your trip, and buy you a new TT. If the NF holds zero, then it’s on you and you come back and say so.

 

[nobody]

 

[ResearchinStuff]

well, you've pulled half the data. the zero groups for the same scopes are the other half. It's the difference between those matched pairs that gives the ability to make a judgement call on whether a scope passed or failed. And yes, it is just a judgement call at the end of the day, based on the data that is available. Put it out for peer review, and some people will like it, some won't, just like every other peer reviewed thing on the planet.

On the topic of statistics: the testing Form has done is just a sample of 1. Basically useless unless it happens to fail, which does indicate a likely problem unless the problem is rampant/inherent. I'm sure your math education is sufficient to figure out why, but if not feel free to ask. Anyhow, that is why I'm intentionally dropping my own crap, and encouraging others to do the same.

So here's my encouragement to you: You're very confident in the outcome, why not go get a free TT? There's a great opportunity provided on the previous page. At the same time, you could double or triple the TT sample size. Pretty good opportunity for ya IMO.