Avery vs. JvB - Podcast Back and Forths

[Stearinlys]

Actually not at all. I have zero problem with small calibers. In fact I will likely re-barrel my 6.5PRCs with 6PRC barrels after they are shot out this summer. The above is all about internet warriors trying to impose their view point on others regardless of their limited knowledge and experience. Let's use the example of Form, for whom I have great respect. Form has earn respect through extensive personal experience, far more than most anyone could ever hope for, yet Form goes out of his way to tell you that he isn't telling anybody what to do or what is right for them. Form conveys his experience and observations without prejudice (in fact he even tells you he loves shooting big guns), you make the decision of what is right for you. That is something I can respect.

Sorry, this wasn't a response to you directly, it was in response to @mparks270 earlier on lol.

Aside from that, I would agree with what you wrote, and am glad you did.

 

[mparks270]

Sorry, this wasn't a response to you directly, it was in response to @mparks270 earlier on lol.

Aside from that, I would agree with what you wrote, and am glad you did.

 

[sneaky]

Am I the only one who's noticed this? The two keep taking shots at each other every week. I think it's hilarious and I wish that they would get together on a podcast and sort it out.

It started a month or so ago. I know that he was brought up on the S2H podcast in terms of "authority" on game in relation to cartridge selection. Then I heard JvB talk some smack about "so called experts" using the 77tmk out of a 223. Then it was mentioned on S2H just recently within the past couple episodes.

The most recent release of the backcountry podcast JvB was reading viewer questions and read one about "a guy taking a giraffe with a 6 creed".

I for one would love to hear the podcast when these two hash it out. Let's make it happen!

JVB is too scared to have a conversation with Ryan or Jake. He's going to say whatever his sponsors tell him to. If I never heard his voice again I wouldn't mind.

Sent from my SM-S918U using Tapatalk

 

[Quandary]

I think it would be excellent podcasts, think a home & home podcast version of a football rivalry. The S2H guys should reach out. I think anyone that dismisses the knowledge base of either the S2H team or JVB is sadly mistaken.

 

[WTFJohn]

I think it would be excellent podcasts, think a home & home podcast version of a football rivalry. The S2H guys should reach out. I think anyone that dismisses the knowledge base of either the S2H team or JVB is sadly mistaken.

JVB has told Ryan he will not come on S2H. JVB may have an incredible knowledge base, but he will not debate anyone to prove/share what he knows vs what he's told to say by sponsors. He is supposed to be coming on the EXO podcast, not sure if that is still happening after he lied about the EXO guys' experience hunting with 6mm though.

He (and his brother) are both clowns.

 

[Quandary]

JVB has told Ryan he will not come on S2H. JVB may have an incredible knowledge base, but he will not debate anyone to prove/share what he knows vs what he's told to say by sponsors. He is supposed to be coming on the EXO podcast, not sure if that is still happening after he lied about the EXO guys' experience hunting with 6mm though.

He (and his brother) are both clowns.

I spend a lot of truck time between driving west for hunts and back and forth from Wisconsin to Colorado. As a result I listen to everyones podcast. An observation and a couple of questions. JVB's sponsor's sell every caliber gun, make every caliber bullet, triggers work on all tthe actions and the optics work on every caliber. Consequently from a sponsor standpoint they likely would prefer he embrace the small cartridge movement as it would lead to more sales as people need to replace their existing hunting rifles. That's basic business. Consequently I find it highly unlikely that they are controlling his opinion on this subject. Are they telling him to say the Browning X-bolt is fantastic, or the Weatherby 6RPM is a dream, or the Leupold whatever is all you need, absolutely. But we all need to feed our families and that's the nature of his business. I view it as the listeners responsibility to filter the BS. If the listen is to stupid to do that, it's on them.

Second I don't recall him having "lied" about the EXO guy's experience hunting with a 6mm. I would be interested in listening to that. Please let me know which podcast and the time stamp in that podcast.

Finally, please point me to the post, podcast whatever where Ryan has said they invited JVB to appear on the S2H podcast and he refused. I would like to read/listen to that discussion as well. I apparently missed that.

 

[WTFJohn]

I spend a lot of truck time between driving west for hunts and back and forth from Wisconsin to Colorado. As a result I listen to everyones podcast. An observation and a couple of questions. JVB's sponsor's sell every caliber gun, make every caliber bullet, triggers work on all tthe actions and the optics work on every caliber. Consequently from a sponsor standpoint they likely would prefer he embrace the small cartridge movement as it would lead to more sales as people need to replace their existing hunting rifles. That's basic business. Consequently I find it highly unlikely that they are controlling his opinion on this subject. Are they telling him to say the Browning X-bolt is fantastic, or the Weatherby 6RPM is a dream, or the Leupold whatever is all you need, absolutely. But we all need to feed our families and that's the nature of his business. I view it as the listeners responsibility to filter the BS. If the listen is to stupid to do that, it's on them.

Second I don't recall him having "lied" about the EXO guy's experience hunting with a 6mm. I would be interested in listening to that. Please let me know which podcast and the time stamp in that podcast.

Finally, please point me to the post, podcast whatever where Ryan has said they invited JVB to appear on the S2H podcast and he refused. I would like to read/listen to that discussion as well. I apparently missed that.

JVB pulled the episode down within a day or so, I believe it was the second part of his small caliber rantings.

You can go find the timestamp and episode yourself, maybe one of the Q&As. Or just ask @Ryan Avery directly.

 

[WyldGoose]

S2H mentioned I believe twice that they reached out to Von Benedikt for a discussion and he declined.
Steve from Exo mentioned recently he’s supposed to be a guest on JVB’s podcast to defend his 6mm kill but doesn’t know when.

 

[gabenzeke]

I spend a lot of truck time between driving west for hunts and back and forth from Wisconsin to Colorado. As a result I listen to everyones podcast. An observation and a couple of questions. JVB's sponsor's sell every caliber gun, make every caliber bullet, triggers work on all tthe actions and the optics work on every caliber. Consequently from a sponsor standpoint they likely would prefer he embrace the small cartridge movement as it would lead to more sales as people need to replace their existing hunting rifles. That's basic business. Consequently I find it highly unlikely that they are controlling his opinion on this subject. Are they telling him to say the Browning X-bolt is fantastic, or the Weatherby 6RPM is a dream, or the Leupold whatever is all you need, absolutely. But we all need to feed our families and that's the nature of his business. I view it as the listeners responsibility to filter the BS. If the listen is to stupid to do that, it's on them.

Second I don't recall him having "lied" about the EXO guy's experience hunting with a 6mm. I would be interested in listening to that. Please let me know which podcast and the time stamp in that podcast.

Finally, please point me to the post, podcast whatever where Ryan has said they invited JVB to appear on the S2H podcast and he refused. I would like to read/listen to that discussion as well. I apparently missed that.

He definitely lied about the exo guys and form in the deleted episode.

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

 

[Quandary]

Interesting, so this is not his 12/5 episode that is still up? In that episode the only reference to the EXO is that he was on their podcast a few years ago to discuss building an Elk gun and in a letter some New Zealand guide wrote regarding Form's appearance on the EXO podcast. That's it. I just looked through the transcript to make sure I am not misstating this. Frankly I would be surprised if he actually posted another podcast on this topic and took it down. I can not find any reference to this doing a search. Frankly I am skeptical that it ever existed but would certainly be open to actual evidence rather than hearsay.

It would be great if the EXO guys went on his podcast. The Caribou kill was a nice shot. The rifle/bullet combo certainly did the job.

 

[WTFJohn]

Interesting, so this is not his 12/5 episode that is still up? In that episode the only reference to the EXO is that he was on their podcast a few years ago to discuss building an Elk gun and in a letter some New Zealand guide wrote regarding Form's appearance on the EXO podcast. That's it. I just looked through the transcript to make sure I am not misstating this. Frankly I would be surprised if he actually posted another podcast on this topic and took it down. I can not find any reference to this doing a search. Frankly I am skeptical that it ever existed but would certainly be open to actual evidence rather than hearsay.

It would be great if the EXO guys went on his podcast. The Caribou kill was a nice shot. The rifle/bullet combo certainly did the job.

Form struck someone’s nerve

I listened to it. He completely contradicted himself in the first 10 minutes by talking about a Buffalo that took ten minutes to expire when shot through the vitals with a 6.5 creed and how it was borderline unethical. Then almost immediately telling a story about a 300 win mag shot through the...

rokslide.com

Read away. Here is Steve from EXO's post.

Hey guys weighing in here. I am working on a plan to get myself on JVB’s podcast to argue where I’m coming from / share my experiences and then vice versa for him to come and argue his points on ours. I think that will be a very good platform for both parties to discuss their viewpoints.

Admittedly this is all fun for me, everything kills and can kill well in the right hands. The shooter, way more than not, is going to be the limiting factor. Place any bullet into the vitals of any animal and it will die very quickly.

The entire point of doing the original podcast with Form was to become better informed and discuss potential ways we can become even more efficient and ethical hunters. We are debating not between black and white facts but gray areas that take nuanced thinking to decipher what is best over a large sample size. Not just one off, cherry picked examples.

My general philosophy is the Hunter / the shooter is almost always the problem whether that’s archery, rifles etc. and if we can find ways to make more accurate shots, more animals will die quickly and cleanly. A big problem is getting someone to even admit that they don’t shoot heavy recoiling rifles as well as lighter recoiling ones. You have to step aside from pride / emotion and just look at facts.

After his last podcast, that did piss me off. The first 10 minutes where he talks about how the 6 Creed performance was for us this season, the shots we took and their accuracy is at best extreme exaggeration and worst him just outright lying and distorting the facts. We killed 2 giant bodied Caribou and a 66” and 68” Bull Moose with extreme effectiveness. He tried to walk it back a little saying something along the lines of “maybe I got it wrong” but to even make public statements about how something happened with very little knowledge is highly irresponsible. Not something I could ever imagine doing on a podcast that goes out to thousands of listeners. It was frankly disgusting. I will address that as the very first topic when we chat.

I am confident by the end of both discussions he will at the very least have to admit smaller calibers, in the hands of an ethical and smart hunter, can and are extremely effective at killing large game.

Steve

A little fuel for the fire. Photo attached of the 66” Bull Moose front shoulder Justin shot at 404 yards. The 108 “just barely” got through the bone . This is just one random, cherry picked sample based on a real experience and maybe would never happen again but it absolutely destroyed a 3/4 thick bone and shattered it into pieces. Damage beyond the bone was indecipherable. There was nothing but mush all the way into the heart and lungs. Once I deboned it I tried to get all the parts / fragments back together to take this photo.

 

[SloppyJ]

Oh I didn't know that he took that podcast down. What a little puss. It's easy to see that he's bought and paid for. Unfortunately, the whole industry is. I think what a lot of these companies are missing is that I imagine they would sell more components if they embraced the small cartridge talk due to people shooting more. If more short barreled, threaded .223s, 6 creeds, and the like were available I have to imagine that ammo sales would increase. Lord knows I've increased my practice rate exponentially. I've been guilty of being the guy who goes to the range to zero and then goes hunting. My practice didn't consist of much more than that until recently and last year I was well north of 1k rounds shooting out to 1200yds which I thought I couldn't do previously.

If you want to see the proof, check out the 7mm backcountry podcast that JVB did with Spomer. It's cringeworthy to say the least. He's always touted federal's loading components even though it doesn't seem he's directly sponsored by them on the podcast. It's in his best nature selling articles that he doesn't piss anyone off. The small caliber guys are the minority in the space for sure so he doesn't want to rock the boat. Just sad that there can't be intelligent conversations held supported by science and facts instead of hundreds of years of misinformation shoved down our throats.

The fact of the matter is for those hundreds of years, the bullet and powder technology isn't what it is today. I have a science background and if you're being honest with yourself, you should never be stuck in a way of thinking if new evidence is available. Continually learning and growing as a person is healthy. It's crucial as a human to possess the ability to exhibit humility in the face of new information in all aspects of your life.

 

[Quandary]

At least he was smart enough to pull it down…..