AB raptor owners--POI shift between +reflex and no reflex?

[Macintosh]

I found a couple threads where folks asked this question, but as far as I could find there were no answers.

If you own or have used an AB raptor suppressor, how much (if any) point of impact shift have you seen when comparing suppressor+reflex, to only the suppressor? I’m NOT wondering about shift with and without the suppressor, Im only asking about shift with the suppressor without any reflex reflex, versus with only the suppressor but without the reflex.
Is the amount of shift between with versus without reflex different with a sporter contour barrel, as opposed to a moderately heavy barrel like a CTR or light palma contour? Thanks in advance for any info.

@Ryan Avery since I know you own one and like it.

 

[WyoWild]

I have used mine with medium and sporter contours. There was almost no measurable shift. In my experience maybe .25 MOA shift low when using a 3" reflex on a superlite Tikka barrel. Even less with my 0.750 barrel.

I ended up not using the reflex at all to save weight. It does add some further sound suppression but not much. YMMV.

 

[Mangata]

Have not noticed any shift between reflex and direct mount.

 

[SloppyJ]

I havent noticed any but truth be told I shoot it mostly with the reflex. However it's currently stuck on my 300prc soaking in kroil. I threaded on the normal back cap and let her rip a few different trips. Didn't notice any shift but theyre short carbon barrels.

 

[ElPollo]

I cannot recall seeing any significant POI shift after using it on rifles from 223 to 300, but I’ve rarely used it without the reflex. I bought the can thinking that the modularity would be a big benefit, but I almost always use it with the reflex and the 30 cal front cap. Guess I am just a creature of habit.

 

[Marbles]

I think I had a vertical POI shift with going from a 3 inch bull barrel reflex to flush mount, on a 17 inch Tikka lite barrel, but I don't remember well enough to swear by it.

 

[wyosam]

Have an r6 with 3”, no difference on the two rifles I’ve tried with and without on. Both light contours, one 16” one 20”. Something I was very curious about since a like the reflex at the range, but will skip the extra weight for any hunting where I’m carrying it far at all.


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[JGRaider]

I cannot recall seeing any significant POI shift after using it on rifles from 223 to 300, but I’ve rarely used it without the reflex. I bought the can thinking that the modularity would be a big benefit, but I almost always use it with the reflex and the 30 cal front cap. Guess I am just a creature of habit.

I know you've had your AB a while, and I finally found one at Silencer Shop. It comes with a 3" reflex bull barrel. Is it worth the hassle of swapping it for the regular barrel version? Any quieter, can you even tell the difference? I don't ever see myself needing the bull version. Thanks.

 

[ElPollo]

I know you've had your AB a while, and I finally found one at Silencer Shop. It comes with a 3" reflex bull barrel. Is it worth the hassle of swapping it for the regular barrel version? Any quieter, can you even tell the difference? I don't ever see myself needing the bull version. Thanks.

Unfortunately, I don’t have any experience with the bull barrel version. My gut feeling is that volume is important and the bull barrel version definitely has less of that. Given that I don’t use heavy or carbon barrels, I would probably switch it. If you use thicker barrels, it would make sense to keep it. Hope you enjoy the can. They are silly looking things, but they do work really well. I’ve been around multiple cans shot at the range and with friends in the field. The Raptor is still the most pleasant sounding can that I’ve found. It’s a purchase that I don’t regret.

 

[eric1115]

I have a 6 and an 8, with bull and standard reflexes (both 3").

My (half deaf) summary of my experience would be, reflex helps tone a bunch but not a huge dB difference vs flush. I keep reflexes on pretty much all the time. Easy to hear the difference between flush and reflex mount.

You would have to shoot them back to back and really be focusing on picking out the difference to tell between the bull and standard reflex. If they're on different rifles, probably would not be able to reliably call which is which from sound.

No poi difference between the two reflexes on the same can for me, and with 5 round zero groups well within cone of fire on a few different rifles (18" AR, med weight barrel 20" 6ARC, factory lite 19" .243AI) between flush and reflex for both cans (as well as between the 6 and 8). It's super nice to be able to mix and match anything from a very light flush 6 to a very quiet reflex 8 and any in between combo and not worry about zero.

 

[eric1115]

Also, for anyone wanting to put one on an AR, check this out. CGS Hyperion muzzle device threads to ½x28, protects threads/muzzle doing AR type stuff, has ⅝x24 threads outside, and fits perfectly inside a bull barrel reflex (or flush mount). I would not change a thing on my SPR-ish AR.



Edit to add: that is an 18" barrel and 15" hand guard. I'm not at all sure a 3" reflex would clear without the extra bit of length the adapter provides.

 

[ElPollo]

My (half deaf) summary of my experience would be, reflex helps tone a bunch but not a huge dB difference vs flush. I keep reflexes on pretty much all the time. Easy to hear the difference between flush and reflex mount.

I also have significant hearing loss and tinnitus. I have a hard time separating tone and dB. For me, higher pitched tone causes me more discomfort. I don’t have a dB monitor that’s worth a crap. But if you take two cans that are rated at similar dB levels and shoot them side by side, I will pick the one with the lower frequency or tone every time.

 

[eric1115]

@ElPollo Yep, same. Everyone says "lower dB, lighter weight" for a flush 8 vs reflex 6, but I think I prefer the 6 with reflex. Better tone, less length, weight to me is a wash in terms of how the rifle handles since the extra is all behind the muzzle.

My preference for "lighter/smaller than 8 with reflex" and "nicer to shoot than flush 6" which are the upper and lower limits for what I have, is a 6 with reflex.

 

[ElPollo]

@ElPollo Yep, same. Everyone says "lower dB, lighter weight" for a flush 8 vs reflex 6, but I think I prefer the 6 with reflex. Better tone, less length, weight to me is a wash in terms of how the rifle handles since the extra is all behind the muzzle.

My preference for "lighter/smaller than 8 with reflex" and "nicer to shoot than flush 6" which are the upper and lower limits for what I have, is a 6 with reflex.

All the discussion of the UM OTB suppressor has me wondering what a raptor 4 stack would be like with a 5” reflex.

 

[pattimusprime22]

All the discussion of the UM OTB suppressor has me wondering what a raptor 4 stack would be like with a 5” reflex.

Get one and report back!!

 

[jhm2023]

All the discussion of the UM OTB suppressor has me wondering what a raptor 4 stack would be like with a 5” reflex.

My buddy has a 5 stack Raptor with a 5" bull barrel reflex. We both have 7 PRCs with 20" proof barrels, and while shooting side by side, my 10 stack with flush mount is noticeably quieter, but a lot closer than I expected the sound to be. He was shooting factory precision hunter while I was shooting some pretty stout handloads which likely makes a difference as well.

 

[eric1115]

All the discussion of the UM OTB suppressor has me wondering what a raptor 4 stack would be like with a 5” reflex.

My gut says that's getting past the point of diminishing returns. Going from 4 to 6 has 50% more baffles, 6 to 8 has 33% more baffles. I bet the difference even with the bigger reflex is substantial.

 

[ElPollo]

My gut says that's getting past the point of diminishing returns. Going from 4 to 6 has 50% more baffles, 6 to 8 has 33% more baffles. I bet the difference even with the bigger reflex is substantial.

I think that’s what I’m wondering about; less baffle in front, more reflex behind. But the reality of suppressors in the US is that you own it forever, so experimenting is something I’m less prone to do.