.30 bullet selection

[robtattoo]

So.
I got drawn for my Wyoming elk & I'm as happy as a pig at a vegan cookout!

I asked for advice, earlier, about which of my rifles to take & between the advice here & talking to the guy I'll be hunting with, I've settled on my .308
He's hunted the unit I drew (97) for over 50 years & he tells me that in all that time he's never had a shot at over 300 & most have been between 50 & 200.

With that in mind, the .308 seems like a logical choice (I've restocked it & installed a lighter scope, so she's down to the magical 7lb mark) but I'm stumbling on bullet selection. For whitetail down here all I've ever used is 165gn Gamekings, but I've never been 100% happy with them. Performance isn't spectacular, but the accuracy I can get from them at 2700fps makes up for the occasional jacket separation. I've been mildly happy shooting VLDs in my 6.5, average recovery has been 40yds with 4 double lunged deer + 1 antelope this season, but only 1 'bang-flop' (antelope) & only one recovered bullet (fragments) out of 2 deer with no exit wounds, although none of these deer were taken beyond 80yds with velocity around 3000fps. I'm thinking they may be better suited to shooting past 3-400

I'm open to any & all suggestions. Deep penetration & good expansion, I'm guessing, are more important here.

 

[6mm Remington]

Sounds like you reload obviously so that helps. I would use a 165 gr. bullet and two very fine ones that I have had a lot of experience with are the 165 gr. Nosler Partition and the Accubond. Both are excellent bullets up close and far away. You most likely will not be shooting this far, but at 500 yards both of these bullets will reliably open up and hold together very well and penetrate nicely. The same thing holds true for a 50 yard shot. Both of these bullets will penetrate and hold together while mushrooming very nicely. The 165 gr. Partition or Accubond are the ONLY bullets I shoot out of my 30-06!

165 gr. Accubond or Partition - I'd use the one my rifle shot the best. Congratulations on a great tag and best of luck to you.

 

[6mm Remington]

Here are two Accubonds at 400 & 500 yards. I was shooting into gallon water jugs. The 30-06 at 400 yards I hit just a touch low and it hit the particle board the jugs were sitting on and then went into the water jugs. It had a pretty rough test but still opened nicely and penetrated very well.







Here is an Accubond, Partition, and E-tip out of my 6mm Remington at 400 yards into water jugs. Each one of these did a great job and opened nicely. My son used a 90 gr. E-tip out of his 6mm Remington to take a very large cow elk with one shot at 350 yards. She went 20 yards after he drilled her right behind the shoulder.



Here is what they looked like from the top.

 

[6mm Remington]

Here are 100 gr. Nosler Partitions out of a 6mm Remington at 25 yards, 100 yards, and 400 yards. I for some reason did not do the 300 yard test of I lost the bullet. It's been a while since I did these tests.

The 90 gr. E-tip is from the same 6mm Remington at 25, 100, 300, and 400 yards. I'm very impressed with this bullet also and how it has performed. My son has taken several antelope, a couple deer, and the cow elk as mentioned. It too would be a very good bullet to use.



Here is a brutal test of the three bullets out of my 6mm Remington at 25 yards. Each one did very well. I was impressed!

 

[6mm Remington]

Here's a picture of another one of my son Jeff's elk. This cow he shot at 100 yards with his 300 WSM using a 180 gr. Nosler Accubond. He hit her tight behind her right shoulder. The bullet angled up slightly and clipped the bottom of the spine and then angled back down and went into her left shoulder breaking the shoulder right in the middle. The bullet was recovered under the hide on the left shoulder. Nothing like the real thing for a test.



Recovered Accubond.

 

[rayporter]

180 speer grand slams recovered from elk. most shots were pass throughs, but a few were recovered. shot from a 30-06 at 308 velocity. the longest shot was 200yd

some where i posted this before with the weights. i think the lightest one was 162 and the average was 168 gr

take note of the right hand bullet that was recovered from an that was very healthy until meeting the speer. on the offf side i found a patch of hair gone and a bullet underneath the missing patch of hair where my bullet had stretch the hide and almost exited. i cut my bullet out and could still feel a lump. i cut out the other bullet which was at least a year old and healed . it is 30 cal and weighs 150 gr. i would guess it is a standard cup and core sierra or hornady.

one other note slightly related. in 1984 my pard shot the first elk we had ever seen with a 308 and a hornady bullet. the bullet shattered and a small piece hit near the spine and took out the back end. it was finished with a head shot. we never used a standard cup and core type bullet again.

 

[6mm Remington]

rayporter looks like those Grand Slams worked very well for you. There is not much to not like about a 30-06 either! Okay we can say the 308 Win as well!

 

[5MilesBack]

I load my daughter's .308 with 165gr Accubonds and they shoot really well. The best accuracy I got was with TAC powder.

 

[GKPrice]

Sounds like you reload obviously so that helps. I would use a 165 gr. bullet and two very fine ones that I have had a lot of experience with are the 165 gr. Nosler Partition and the Accubond. Both are excellent bullets up close and far away. You most likely will not be shooting this far, but at 500 yards both of these bullets will reliably open up and hold together very well and penetrate nicely. The same thing holds true for a 50 yard shot. Both of these bullets will penetrate and hold together while mushrooming very nicely. The 165 gr. Partition or Accubond are the ONLY bullets I shoot out of my 30-06!

165 gr. Accubond or Partition - I'd use the one my rifle shot the best. Congratulations on a great tag and best of luck to you.

You asked for advice and just received the best anyone could give you - Of those two the Accubond gives a slight edge in BC and possibly accuracy although your rifle will have the final word on that

Good Luck !

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

Personally I've had good success with the 168 TTSX in 30cal and 145 LRX 7mm. I personally want my impact velocity over 2200fps (so I factor that into my imposed maximum shot distance) for these types of bullets to get a good amount of expansion (they still expand going slower but not as much as I desire). Again its all personal preference but I like the fact they don't fragment as much thus less meat tends to get trashed and also I'm not looking for pieces of lead/jacket in the meat as I butcher, I've came across an occasional copper petal but that's a pretty big piece (won't make it through a fine grinder plate for instance).

I'm not recommending these for everyone/every shot, just saying I like them. They are poor for a slow impact velocity double lung for instance where a bullet that fragments more will work better. BUT they also won't destroy an entire shoulder at high velocity either which some bullets will do. Basically they seem to limit the major trama channel to about 3" and punch through is my impression.

 

[T43]

I really like the 165 Acubonds out of my 308 and my 30'06 and 180s out of my 300. A good quality bonded bullet in the 165 to 180 range should put a smile on your face once you get an elk in range.

 

[rayporter]

testing

be conscious of conditions when testing. i say this because a friend decided to test bullets one day and he came to the conclusion that the grand slam was a poor bullet that disintegrated. he shot into wet phone books at 25 yd and high velocity. one of the bullets in the pic above was recovered from a 30 yd shot and a stout powder charge.

my conclusion is, wet phone books are a poor medium for testing



.

 

[handwerk]

I load for 12 different BG rifles and all but one loves the barnes TTSXs. We've had great luck with them on antelope, deer and elk.
For a .30 I'd choose a 168 as an all arounder.

 

[rileybassman]

I load for 12 different BG rifles and all but one loves the barnes TTSXs. We've had great luck with them on antelope, deer and elk.
For a .30 I'd choose a 168 as an all arounder.

100% back this statement. I shoot 168s out of my 06 at around 2830 fps. Just developed a second load that shot 130 ttsx into half moa... need to run them over a chrony, but should be 3250 or so...

Good bullet, retains great weight. Super accurate in every gun I shoot them in.

 

[robtattoo]

Well, I just put an order in for a box of 168gn TSXs to see how they fly.
I spent Wednesday at the range trying to get a box of 180 partitions to group well, but they were having none of it. So I figured I'd give Mr Barnes some money. Turns out my scope rail had shot loose, I could've sworn I'd loctited the bastard.....
SO next Wednesday, I'll be trying the other box of Noslers, plus the TSX. I'd be happy with either, I think, but getting an extra hundred fps out so out of the 168s would be nice, since retained weight should be the same or better anyway.

Thanks guys!

 

[rileybassman]

Nice! Either bullet will be great. I think you will find that a 168 mono will retain even more weight then a 180 cup and core... not that weight retention is everything, but it will defiantly contribute to penetration. What I like about either, is shoot em through the shoulder and you don't have to worry about the bullet breaking apart. let us know your finding!

Just a heads up for reloading, the 168s are a little longish, should be fine, but just FYI... the 165s are shorter if OAL is an issue you find.

 

[luke moffat]

Have shot more game animals with a 308 than any other cartridge. Growing up I used el cheapo core lokts and killed a bunch of moose and caribou and even a couple grizzly. One year only used 130 ttsx and it killed goats caribou and moose. Likely been using 165 accubonds in he 308 with good results. That said once I get more time I think the sweet spot is gonna be the 150 sciroccos for weight retention, velocity, and BC. Sure it's only .430 BC given we never shoot much over 400 yards with a 308 at game animals I don't feel limited and like that bullet a bit better than a Berger for up close bear protection if needed.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

FYI back off your powder charge a bit if trying to use lead core 168gr data, the monos are long for their weight and often take up more case capacity (unless your rifle has a long throat). Not sure what powder you like to burn but looks like Hodgdon has data for the 168ttsx in the 308win up on their site, should be looking for around 2700fps from a 24".

Also play with the seating depth that will really suck in the groups with these in my experience. One of mine likes 0.050" off, one likes 0.120" off, another likes 0.010" off.

 

[rileybassman]

Barnes has some good load data on their website for the ttsx. Seems pretty accurate to max when I was testing 130s.

 

[bbrown]

Went through the same process with my Tikka T3 Superlite in .308 with a 22-1/2" barrel. The rifle would be used on backcountry hunts chasing deer and elk when I did not feel like lugging around my 9+lb 300 WM. I broke in the barrel and dialed in the scope with some cheap FMJ ammo. Since I am not set up to reload (yet) I picked up some factory loads from Hornady, Barnes, Nosler and Federal then added a cheaper option like the Rem Core-lokts to see how they would compare. I was pretty set on 150 gr for this rifle but couldn't find the ABs in a 150 so I ended up with 165s. A buddy had some of the Federal Trophy Bonded Bearclaws (I think that's what they were - all copper with an orange tip) in 180s that did not shoot well out of his tikka so I threw them in as well. I wanted to try the Hornady GMXs but could never find any to shoot.

This target was set up at 100 yards and after this I stretched it out to 200, 300 and 450 to see how each round grouped. The chrono was set up 10' from the end of the barrel at roughly 5000' above sea level and the temps were in the 50's on this morning. I like 4 shot groups so I can eliminate a flyer if I pull one. One thing that surprised me was the POI change between the different loads but to keep things fair for comparison I did not make any changes to the scope until after I selected the round I would hunt with.

*The orange dots are 1" I believe and excuse the crappy hand writing.

The SSTs shot the best at all distances but I had a bad experience with them coming apart on doe antelope out of my .243 win so I was reluctant to use them (especially on elk) and the Federal Trophy Bonded Bearclaw really started to open up at the longer ranges. The ABs didn't group great at 100 but did much better at distances so they made the final cut along with the TTSX and Partitions - which I have always had great luck with in my 300 WM.

Long story short, I had some quality issues with the TTSX and was not quite sold on the all copper bullet especially at the speeds I was getting so they got shelved. I was able to find a box of 150 ABs after this shooting session and they group much better than the 165s out of my rifle averaging 2735 FPS. Between the ABs and Partitons it was pretty much a toss up so when I found a deal on "blem" ammo through SPS it was a no brainer to run the Accubonds especially since the blemish is the ammo has finger prints on them. One thing I noticed with the Nosler Trophy grade ammo is it seems to be a bit slower than similar ammo from the other manufactures.

I was able to take a bull at 110 yards and a cow at 75-80 yards with them this past fall and was very happy with the results. The bull dropped hard at the first shot but put another one in the neck to make sure he stayed down. The first shot was a pretty steep down hill shot and was able to recover the first shot just under the hide on the off side. The cow was slightly quartering to me and I pulled the shot back a bit behind the near side leg but recovered the bullet in the offside hind quarter almost to the ball socket.

This one came from the cow and weighed 115.6 gr so 77% retention which is right where it should be and pretty good considering the path and distance it traveled inside her.

I don't have a picture of the bullet recovered from the bull but it looks very similar and weighed about the same. I am more than happy with the performance of these and don't plan to change anything up before this fall.