.30-06 175 grain Terminal Ascent for Moose

[ianpadron]

Can't think of a single hunting situation id ever find myself in where id second guess that combo.

 

[medvedyt]

From a purely bullet standpoint, the TA is the best constructed bullet on the market. Period.

its an uodated version of the Bear Claw and Trophy Bonded Tip, and Edge TRL.

Its a bonded bullet with a lead core, and a solid copper shank at the base with a polymer tip and a boat tail design to help wind drift.

Its the best combination of every bullet on the market and I shoot it out of my 30-06, my 6.5 Creed and anything else that groups best.

That said, if it doesnt shoot well out of a gun--I'll look for something different because accuracy trumps everything. But i have a few guns it shoots sub-MOA and its all I need.

It is by far my most favorite bullet.

as usual with a pinch of salt. cupro nickel process is known to foul the barrel when used in bullet and even if not the same think about the fouling done with the first x bullet from barnes.

a great bullet certainly in design but some issues may appear after some use.

 

[z987k]

From a purely bullet standpoint, the TA is the best constructed bullet on the market. Period.

its an uodated version of the Bear Claw and Trophy Bonded Tip, and Edge TRL.

Its a bonded bullet with a lead core, and a solid copper shank at the base with a polymer tip and a boat tail design to help wind drift.

Its the best combination of every bullet on the market and I shoot it out of my 30-06, my 6.5 Creed and anything else that groups best.

That said, if it doesnt shoot well out of a gun--I'll look for something different because accuracy trumps everything. But i have a few guns it shoots sub-MOA and its all I need.

It is by far my most favorite bullet.

If the front wasn't bonded, THEN itd the best bullet on the market.

 

[6mm Remington]

Go forth with the 30-06 and shoot a giant bull moose! It will work great.

 

[Jack321]

If the front wasn't bonded, THEN itd the best bullet on the market.

Ummmm....no.

Bonded bullets lead to better weight retention and no bullet fragmentation.

 

[Mike D Texas]

Ummmm....no.

Bonded bullets lead to better weight retention and no bullet fragmentation.

And smaller wound channels.


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[Jack321]

And smaller wound channels.


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Thats pretty subjective.

It all depends on a multitude of factors:
What range did you hit the animal? Closer and faster fps (all things being equal) lead to greater expansion and larger disruption. Longer shots and slower velocity leads to less expansion and smaller disruption. Thats not an absolute.
Did you hit bone? Or slip it through just soft tissue? Did it ricochet off something and cause it to tumble? Did you shoot something that was outside the bullets prefered distances.

That TA bullet will expand out to 1000+ yds depending on the caliber used.

Ive shot it at everything from "thin skinned" antelope to elk and everything inbetween. Antelope as close as 148 yds and elk as far as 350 yds.

Ive also used Winchester XPs, Federal Trophy Coppers, Rem CoreLoks, Hornady SSTs, Nosler Accubonds, Rem Accutips, Barnes Sabots and a host of others successfully. They all pretty much work if you do your job.

But I will stand by my opinion that the TA is a fantastic bullet. And all things being equal, my most favorite bullet and had just about everything you'd want in a bullet. (Again if it shoots accurately in your gun.)

Get it and go hunt anything in N. America with confidence.

 

[Mike D Texas]

Thats pretty subjective.

It all depends on a multitude of factors:
What range did you hit the animal? Closer and faster fps (all things being equal) lead to greater expansion and larger disruption. Longer shots and slower velocity leads to less expansion and smaller disruption. Thats not an absolute.
Did you hit bone? Or slip it through just soft tissue? Did it ricochet off something and cause it to tumble? Did you shoot something that was outside the bullets prefered distances.

That TA bullet will expand out to 1000+ yds depending on the caliber used.

Ive shot it at everything from "thin skinned" antelope to elk and everything inbetween. Antelope as close as 148 yds and elk as far as 350 yds.

Ive also used Winchester XPs, Federal Trophy Coppers, Rem CoreLoks, Hornady SSTs, Nosler Accubonds, Rem Accutips, Barnes Sabots and a host of others successfully. They all pretty much work if you do your job.

But I will stand by my opinion that the TA is a fantastic bullet. And all things being equal, my most favorite bullet and had just about everything you'd want in a bullet. (Again if it shoots accurately in your gun.)

Get it and go hunt anything in N. America with confidence.

Not subjective at all. All of the parameters apply to cup and core bullets that apply to bonded ones.

Wound channels will be larger due to more violent upset of the cup and core bullet.


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[glock233]

Use the rifle you’re more accurate with. Keep your range under control to ensure your impact velocity is above ~2000 fps. The terminal ascent is not a great bullet for reliable low speed expansion.

I’d check to see if Hornady Grey Box (precision hunter ELDX) shoots well in your 3006. Would extend your range a good bit by being able to have reliable expansion at 1600-1800fps.

Moose aren’t that tough when shot with rifles. Quicker expanding bullets will extend your range and lead to quicker death, all things being equal.

 

[Jack321]

Not subjective at all. All of the parameters apply to cup and core bullets that apply to bonded ones.

Wound channels will be larger due to more violent upset of the cup and core bullet.


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By your definition a bullet shot from a TA at 50 yds will be the same as a cup/core bullet shot at 1,000yds.

As I said--subjective.

Moreover, a cup and core is more likely to pancake and/or lead be completely separate from the jacket leading to minimal penetration.

Its why you dont shoot V-Max bullets at elk or tougher game animal.

 

[glock233]

By your definition a bullet shot from a TA at 50 yds will be the same as a cup/core bullet shot at 1,000yds.

As I said--subjective.

Moreover, a cup and core is more likely to pancake and/or lead be completely separate from the jacket leading to minimal penetration.

Its why you dont shoot V-Max bullets at elk or tougher game animal.

This is nonsense. No common 30-06 cup and core is pancaking or failing to penetrate an Elk with only a 4-6" slab of meat guarding the vitals. We're not talking about elephants or cape buffalo.

 

[Jack321]

This is nonsense. No common 30-06 cup and core is pancaking or failing to penetrate an Elk with only a 4-6" slab of meat guarding the vitals. We're not talking about elephants or cape buffalo.

Lots of anecdotal posts on various forms about 30-06 cup-n-core bullets failing to penetrate.

A simple google search can find lots of posts on other forums. Heres just one i found in less than 10 seconds.

30-06 Core Lokt Failure to penetrate

I forgot about posting this until now. This past year my father shot a spiked buck at roughly 100 yards with a 165 grain core lokt out of a .30-06. He hit it square in the ribs. The deer dropped. Kicked around a little bit on it's back then ran/stumbled off. He found it laying down with blood com...

fishingminnesota.com

Understanding Bullet Construction and Margin of Error | Boone and Crockett Club https://share.google/zDKHhTIvOSQ812Zra

From Boone & Crockett [see attached pic].

Moreover, I doubt anyone is going to adequately recommend someone use this for elk/moose when other suitable options occur, due to lack of penetration:

Hornady Custom Lite 30-06 Springfield Ammo 125 Grain Hornady SST

Hornady Custom Lite ammunition provides reduced recoil and muzzle blast from standard cartridges, and puts the fun back into shooting for kids, women,...

www.midwayusa.com

A 125gr bullet is shorter than a 150, 165, 180 or 220 and therefore MORE APT TO PANCAKE. This is physics! A fast moving projectile that is shorter than its longer counterparts and hits something flat is more likely to flatten just by sheer size of the projectile to other longer projectiles. Its why they have to lessen the charge otherwise it will be too fast and will pancake.

You want to shoot a 125gr Lite load for moose/elk, be my guest, good luck to ya!

All things being equal, cup-n-core bullets ARE more likely to pancake or separate.

Using a 165-180 gr Rem Core Lokt has killed TONS of game, up to an including moose, elk, and Kodiak Brown Bears.

I'm not arguing they CAN'T be effective.

I'm simply stating they are more likely to do so.

I've said my peace, not looking to continue this.

But I stand by my thoughts on the TA. Best current bullet design for N. American game. Not just in terms of construction but my own personal use. And given the option of similar groups I'd take the TA over any bullet design on the market today. By far my most favorite bullet (followed closely by the Trophy Bonded Tip, Bear Claw and the Nosler Partiton--which IS cup n core, as I'm sure you know.)

 

[glock233]

The best practice is long high BC bullets.

Still this pancaking nonsense is the product of imagination. Anything with the density of lead or copper at 125gr is doing a lot of damage at 2000fps.

 

[z987k]

Thats pretty subjective.

It all depends on a multitude of factors:
What range did you hit the animal? Closer and faster fps (all things being equal) lead to greater expansion and larger disruption. Longer shots and slower velocity leads to less expansion and smaller disruption. Thats not an absolute.
Did you hit bone? Or slip it through just soft tissue? Did it ricochet off something and cause it to tumble? Did you shoot something that was outside the bullets prefered distances.

That TA bullet will expand out to 1000+ yds depending on the caliber used.

Ive shot it at everything from "thin skinned" antelope to elk and everything inbetween. Antelope as close as 148 yds and elk as far as 350 yds.

Ive also used Winchester XPs, Federal Trophy Coppers, Rem CoreLoks, Hornady SSTs, Nosler Accubonds, Rem Accutips, Barnes Sabots and a host of others successfully. They all pretty much work if you do your job.

But I will stand by my opinion that the TA is a fantastic bullet. And all things being equal, my most favorite bullet and had just about everything you'd want in a bullet. (Again if it shoots accurately in your gun.)

Get it and go hunt anything in N. America with confidence.

The partition is an objectively a better terminal bullet than a TA. It's the best of both worlds. 60ish% weight retention is more than enough to get massive penetration against all north american game. But the non-bonded front half causes a much large wound channel than the bonded TA.

The partition just has a shit BC and what I hate most about it is the soft lead point in front that very easily is damaged and causes all kinds of accuracy and loss of BC issues where it's not terribly predictable at range. For closer stuff, it's good enough. If the TA was not bonded up front, I think they'd have the perfect lead bullet for everything. As it does both cup and core damage with copper like penetration.

 

[Mike D Texas]

By your definition a bullet shot from a TA at 50 yds will be the same as a cup/core bullet shot at 1,000yds.

As I said--subjective.

Moreover, a cup and core is more likely to pancake and/or lead be completely separate from the jacket leading to minimal penetration.

Its why you dont shoot V-Max bullets at elk or tougher game animal.

You should do some reading around here. There’s plenty of documented kills of large animals with match bullets and in very small calibers/cartridges.

Here’s a personal example of a tipped match king bullet kill from a 223. I’d say that’s pretty dang destructive. You won’t get that with a bonded bullet. You’ll have a caliber sized entry and maybe a golf ball to tennis ball size exit.

This example had a football size exit all the way through the body cavity. It was stopped by the scapula on the other side. But it literally destroyed everything in and around its path through the vitals.

 

[VernAK]

A few personal observations regarding much of the above: FWIW

Wound channels are not just measured in diameter but also in length. For that reason, I do like the TA and its predecessors for the very large or dangerous animals. I once had a medium grizzly coming at me and my 375 HH, 300 gr TBBC missed his head but entered the neck right behind the head and exited the back ham 4" from the tail.

I also like Nosler Partitions and have found the 160 gr NP in a 270 to be a very effective moose bullet. I suspect Swift A Frames would be similar but haven't tried them.

The desired shot on most of our big game is a broadside, double lung shot. There are bullets out there that don't reach that second lung. Not long ago, I shot a 60" bull at 60 yards broadside double lung. The 375 HH 270 gr TSX did NOT exit but stopped under the hide. Per usual, it stayed on its feet for a minute or two before collapsing. I have reviews several of my videos of double lung moose kills and there is no discernable difference of the rifle caliber used with proper bullets. I suspect most bullets in a reasonable caliber will work for that perfect shot, but when things don't go as planned, I'll opt for the stouter bullets.

If the first shot on the moose didn't go as planned, the pelvis shot is very effective although it's one we hate to do,

I've only seen one target bullet used on big game and it was a disaster. A VLD out of 7RM on a grizzly. I wish I had taken pics of that bullet.

 

[Pinewood]

I shot my bull this past season with a 168grain tsx out of my X bolt '06 from about 140 yards, quartering to. He died in seconds. My partner took his bull with a 300 Win with 180 grain TSX at 210 yards with a neck shot. Another quick kill. Moose seem to die pretty easy for us.

 

[Sako76]

I shot a 36” 752 lbs bull moose in Maine this year using a factory 180 grain Nosler Accubond out of a 30-06. I shot him at 40 yards, almost head on in the neck. He dropped at the shot, the butcher found the perfectly mushroomed bullet in the ham, traveled about 5 feet of moose!

 

[Waterfowler75]

Wow - step away for a few days and holy cow. Lots of response.

I’ll stick with the TA’s. Thank you everyone.

Note-

I did go to the range for giggles and trigger time. I have 6 other types of rounds from a previous rifle (loooong story). The TAs group the best. Sub moa. The second closest was federal partition 165 that are discontinued. All were minute-of-moose of course. I don’t know that I’ve ever been as comfortable and confident as I am in this combo though.

I’m going to do a bulk buy and sling some lead.

 

[Arcticmanak]

Excellent caliber and bullet for moose. A couple years ago my son shot a moose with that same caliber and bullet combination. It was a great story. We had hunted the better part of two weeks and called our bull in on the last night, at last light. A 135 yd shot, the faithful 30-06 did outstanding and the bull dropped at the water's edge. If you shoot it well, and the round performs well in your rifle, a well placed shot will have you eating tenderloin shortly thereafter. Good hunting!