.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.

[OneRingTrTa]

I've seen 55 grain .223 spire points bounce of a wild russian boar at 70 yards. I am not an animal finatic or anything, but a .223 will be nothing but a wasp sting to an elk. Don't want to risk wounding one and having em get away!

 

[Ryan Avery]

I've seen 55 grain .223 spire points bounce of a wild russian boar at 70 yards. I am not an animal finatic or anything, but a .223 will be nothing but a wasp sting to an elk. Don't want to risk wounding one and having em get away!

Haha!


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[JWP58]

I've seen 55 grain .223 spire points bounce of a wild russian boar at 70 yards. I am not an animal finatic or anything, but a .223 will be nothing but a wasp sting to an elk. Don't want to risk wounding one and having em get away!

Those "Russian" boars must be tough s.o.b.s because I've seen more than a few feral pigs killed with a .22mag....and 5.56 rounds. Have yet to witness any "bounce off".

 

[justinspicher]

I think they are called Russian boars because they are always in a hurry......

 

[OneRingTrTa]

Those "Russian" boars must be tough s.o.b.s because I've seen more than a few feral pigs killed with a .22mag....and 5.56 rounds. Have yet to witness any "bounce off".

Buddy you need to hunt in Europe. it has to be on your bucket list.

 

[brushape]

I have a nice accurate 65 Sierra gameking load worked up for my AR. Couple years ago I attempted a lung shot on a good size boar here in California and he ran after the shot leaving no blood or sign of any kind to track. Two weeks later I killed the same boar with my 30-06 and found the Sierra stopped outside of the ribs by the cartilage shield


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[JWP58]

Buddy you need to hunt in Europe. it has to be on your bucket list.

No way, I'm not getting roped into the collusion plot!

 

[Formidilosus]

This is reason I wouldn't recommend a small caliber for elk. Good on you for passing. I'm not sure that a lot of guys have that level of composure

I don’t think many would have shot the elk at the range he did with any round. Every cartridge/rifle has its limit.

I've seen 55 grain .223 spire points bounce of a wild russian boar at 70 yards. I am not an animal finatic or anything, but a .223 will be nothing but a wasp sting to an elk. Don't want to risk wounding one and having em get away!

Sweet Jesus....

 

[Formidilosus]

If you would, what is your opinion on max distance and what twist to stabilize the 77TMK?

We have .223 that is stupid accurate, but 1/9.

1-8” to stabilize the 77gr TMK.

Max distance for what?

 

[Montana Slim]

I don’t think many would have shot the elk at the range he did with any round. Every cartridge/rifle has its limit.

I think we are saying the same thing? I was basically saying good for him for knowing the limit of the platform and not shooting if the right shot wasnt there.
I do think antlers cloud the shoot/no shoot decision for some (many?) hunters, and shooting a lighter caliber will (should) put more limits on distance/angle of acceptable shot.
I don't think I would use a .223 for elk, but don't own one so it is a non-issue... He seems to know the limits and is choosing shots carefully so that's good right?
I'm not saying it shouldn't done, just that it's out of my comfort zone, and .223 is not the caliber I would recommend to a new hunter.

 

[Fatcamp]

1-8” to stabilize the 77gr TMK.

Max distance for what?

Reliable function of the bullet.

 

[Missahba]

http://www.mlefiaa.org/files/ERPR/Terminal_Ballistic_Performance.pdf

There’s plenty of objective information out there. Just one example. Offered for your edification.

 

[Formidilosus]

http://www.mlefiaa.org/files/ERPR/Terminal_Ballistic_Performance.pdf

There’s plenty of objective information out there. Just one example. Offered for your edification.

While that is a very good primer on rifle caliber terminal ballistics, it does not address the 77gr TMK.

Reliable function of the bullet.

Again- for what? Maintaining stability for hitting a target? Reliable expansion/fragmentation threshold? Wound channels in big game?

Not trying to be flippant, genuinely not sure what you are looking for.

In any case, the 77gr TMK-

Is generally stable through transonic when fired from suitable twist rates. Consistent and wide upset should be expected to +-/ 1,900fps impact velocity. Minimum (read minimal) upset down to 1,600’ish FPS.
Wound channels in big game (deer and bigger) are... extreme to around 2,300fps impact. From 2,200 or so down to approx 2,000fps impact wounds will be similar to conventional bullet from 270/30-06/etc class rounds. Below 2,000fps wounds will be similar to solid copper monolithic bullets such as Barnes TSX.


In laymen’s terms, from 20-24” barreled 223’s with MV’s of 2750+ FPS, the 77gr TMK is an emphatic killer inside of 300 or so yards. Most would consider it too much on even big deer. From 300+/- yards to 450 yards or so, it is a solid performer terminally generally giving exits on normal sized deer, and is 50/50 on being caught under the skin on the offside on big deer or major bones being hit. Past 450 to around 550-600 yards, it will kill, but effects on animals is similar to a good broadhead, I.E.- 10-20 seconds before succumbing.

 

[Missahba]

While that is a very good primer on rifle caliber terminal ballistics, it does not address the 77gr TMK.








Again- for what? Maintaining stability for hitting a target? Reliable expansion/fragmentation threshold? Wound channels in big game?

Not trying to be flippant, genuinely not sure what you are looking for.

In any case, the 77gr TMK-

Is generally stable through transonic when fired from suitable twist rates. Consistent and wide upset should be expected to +-

While that is a very good primer on rifle caliber terminal ballistics, it does not address the 77gr TMK.








Again- for what? Maintaining stability for hitting a target? Reliable expansion/fragmentation threshold? Wound channels in big game?

Not trying to be flippant, genuinely not sure what you are looking for.

In any case, the 77gr TMK-

Is generally stable through transonic when fired from suitable twist rates. Consistent and wide upset should be expected to +-/ 1,900fps impact velocity. Minimum (read minimal) upset down to 1,600’ish FPS.
Wound channels in big game (deer and bigger) are... extreme to around 2,300fps impact. From 2,200 or so down to approx 2,000fps impact wounds will be similar to conventional bullet from 270/30-06/etc class rounds. Below 2,000fps wounds will be similar to solid copper monolithic bullets such as Barnes TSX.


In laymen’s terms, from 20-24” barreled 223’s with MV’s of 2750+ FPS, the 77gr TMK is an emphatic killer inside of 300 or so yards. Most would consider it too much on even big deer. From 300+/- yards to 450 yards or so, it is a solid performer terminally generally giving exits on normal sized deer, and is 50/50 on being caught under the skin on the offside on big deer or major bones being hit. Past 450 to around 550-600 yards, it will kill, but effects on animals is similar to a good broadhead, I.E.- 10-20 seconds before succumbing.

A very good primer usually isn’t a bad thing.

 

[Fatcamp]

I think I'll get some and try it in the 1/9. We are having our . 308 rechambered to 6.5 Creedmoor for my wife to hunt with this year. She is an excellent shot with her . 300WM, but it is no fun to shoot. Waaay overkill on deer sized game.

 

[PNWGATOR]

I think you’ll find the 77TMK may be WAY overkill for deer too. Lol. Stay off the shoulder and put it in the crease.

 

[Fatcamp]

I think you’ll find the 77TMK may be WAY overkill for deer too. Lol. Stay off the shoulder and put it in the crease.

I highly doubt that. We bought a pile of closeout Browning 155grn ammo. It is apparently explosive in nature as it really destroys stuff. Like, dramatically. Her antelope last year was a perfect heart shot that blew the entire bottom of the chest out.
We will shoot up what we have and transition to a larger, faster load in that rifle. It's just so accurate we hate to get rid of it.

 

[Seeknelk]

Any more 223 data points from this fall? How about the 88 eld m out of a 22 Creed? Form? Does it act like a 77tmk from 223?

 

[BAKPAKR]

Any more 223 data points from this fall? How about the 88 eld m out of a 22 Creed? Form? Does it act like a 77tmk from 223?

I got a doe at 237 yards with a 14.5” barreled 5.56 and a 77 TMK. It was not a bang flop but she didn’t go far and I watched her drop. I hit her behind the shoulder and there was quite a bit of damage in the chest cavity. A fairly large portion of the jacket, peeled back around the intact boattail section, was recovered just under the skin on the opposite side of rib cage.

I thought the TMK worked very well.

 

[howl]

Kid hasn't found a deer that will stop a 62gr Fusion yet. Blood trails are slow to start, though. As her brother has moved up to 30/30, which provides an immediate and useful blood trail, I'm considering getting devious and letting her think the 6.5G is a .223 next year. The difference is I don't have to cut circles to find the start of the blood trail.

I'd try the 77gr TMK on CNS shots, but practice on x-ray style targets shows she misses the vertebrae 25% of the time. I highly recommend such targets, btw. They tell you what you can and can't hit. This may sound negative on the face of it, but the confidence they gain from knowing with certainty that they can make particular shots means they only want to take those shots on game.

Bear? Elk? Are you starving? Set some snares.