.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.

[IDVortex]

“Right behind the shoulder” is way too far forward.

This one nicked the rear edge the scapula on exit, entrance was armpit in other side-
View attachment 712186


And it barely caught the front of one lung-

View attachment 712189


It also shows how small bears actually are in the body, this was a normal sized black bear, and its lungs compared to a soda can-
View attachment 712190

Never been around a bear, or seen a dead one. So needless to say, what I actually thought the size of the lungs are to this are a huge difference. I was under the impression of them being almost milk gallon sizes.

 

[RWT]

Curious who is the maker on the custom encore barrel. What is the twist rate ?

 

[rickyw]

This thread is for the good...and the bad.
I messed up. Black bear at 234 yards. Shot honestly looked good. He was biting right behind the shoulder so maybe I freckle forward?
Either way my gap was tiny and no following up shot happened. Even with extensive practice racking and shooting.lol
Thick brush and cliffs. No blood...nothing. hours of looking late last night and this morn.
77 tmk.
I'm confident this would have or could have happened with any rifle combination. I just figured it'd interest folks.

We’ve seen Forms posts with 308 caliber frangible bullet tissue destruction. A 308 frangible bullet likely would have damaged the lungs. The 375 ruger story by Luke shooting the bear behind the shoulder likely led to a poor outcome because he was likely using a stout controlled expansion bullet

And, I really don’t have a dog in this fight. Those are just my observations

 

[Formidilosus]

Never been around a bear, or seen a dead one. So needless to say, what I actually thought the size of the lungs are to this are a huge difference. I was under the impression of them being almost milk gallon sizes.

Hunters love to exaggerate how big/tough/hard to kill that animals are.

 

[Butcher8]

.223 is perfect for deer, with a few important points though. ..you have to use a slow expansion bullet. keep shots under 150 yards. obviously others here will debate but believe me. my picks are barnes tsx as mentioned above or better winchester deer season...the bullet has to be slow expanding.
what not to do...dont use varmint rounds up close, no penetrate
dont use fmj or matchkings far out. theyll wound but not good enuf
do not try headshots they nearly never work on deer anatomy
ok let flames start .

 

[Rich M]

Reading through this entire thread and checking out the various photos, the idea that anyone would want a cartridge that produced more devastation than the 22cal TMK is insane to me. The idea that a larger caliber would provide a "margin of error" is also laughable. One of the worse shots I ever made on a deer was with a 300 WM at 75 yards. Snap shot and placed it too far back, plenty of FP of energy there but that deer didn't drop it ran for miles before we caught up to it. A 223 FMJ through the heart/lungs would have given a better result.

Seems like you'd have had the same result no matter what caliber - a bad shot is a bad shot is a bad shot.

 

[RedRidge]

Curious who is the maker on the custom encore barrel. What is the twist rate ?

MGM. 20” 1-7 twist.

 

[mt100gr.]

.223 is perfect for deer, with a few important points though. ..you have to use a slow expansion bullet. keep shots under 150 yards. obviously others here will debate but believe me. my picks are barnes tsx as mentioned above or better winchester deer season...the bullet has to be slow expanding.
what not to do...dont use varmint rounds up close, no penetrate
dont use fmj or matchkings far out. theyll wound but not good enuf
do not try headshots they nearly never work on deer anatomy
ok let flames start .

This is your takeaway after reading this thread? Or your experience based on what? And what about using "match" bullets? Are they OK or too similar to "varmint rounds"?

 

[Shō[t]gun]

This is your takeaway after reading this thread? Or your experience based on what? And what about using "match" bullets? Are they OK or too similar to "varmint rounds"?

Careful with the hook set. We’ve lost a few good ones recently.

 

[IDVortex]

.223 is perfect for deer, with a few important points though. ..you have to use a slow expansion bullet. keep shots under 150 yards. obviously others here will debate but believe me. my picks are barnes tsx as mentioned above or better winchester deer season...the bullet has to be slow expanding.
what not to do...dont use varmint rounds up close, no penetrate
dont use fmj or matchkings far out. theyll wound but not good enuf
do not try headshots they nearly never work on deer anatomy
ok let flames start

I feel you read the thread, then decided you'll discredit everything in it and go the opposite of what the thread showed.

 

[IDVortex]

Hunters love to exaggerate how big/tough/hard to kill that animals are.

Well, it also goes back to me not actually looking into how big the vitals truly are on the animals I'm hunting. I'm just still living and following the way I was taught when I first started archery that as long as you put the arrow behind the shoulder you'll hit something because the lungs take up such a huge area.

Just learning something new and trying to be humble that in fact I don't know shit.

 

[Big T C]

DON'T HAVE TIME TO READ 176 PAGES? HERE'S THE CHEAT SHEET.

---

“Bullets matter more than headstamps.”

“Spent primers offer the supreme tutorial”.

I’ve read it here and elsewhere online. It got my attention. I started digging and asking questions and listened.

The 77gr TMK delivered by a .223 is where I ended up after many discussions and objective data regarding bullet performance and numerous pics of field results.

Now for the delivery system. Accurate. Repeatable. Reliable. Reasonable weight to afford steady shot placement and the ability to spot my own impacts yet packable. Tikka T3x, vertical grip, Sportsmatch rings, SWFA 6x MQ in mills. Replaced the trigger spring with a yo Dave, adjusted to my liking, then degreased everything and locked all of the screws down with loctite and got started.

The package checks all of the boxes. Plus, it’s FUN! Time at the range is spent learning to call wind, trigger control, spotting your own impacts and figuring out why a shot did or did not end up where you wanted it. No brake. No flinch. Inexpensive to shoot. The fun factor plus the ability to be able to afford to shoot a lot goes a long way to learning and understanding shooting, accuracy and precision.

With all of that said, I’ve decided to use 77 TMK out of a .223 from this delivery system for bear, deer and elk this season.

Opportunity presented itself a couple of days ago. I killed a mature, dry sow with the 77 TMK. Bullet performance exceeded all expectations! The terminal performance is on par with anything I’ve seen in a .284 or .30. Unreal performance. The bullet is a BEAST!

Practice will continue throughout the summer in preparation for the upcoming deer and elk seasons.

Based on my sample of one, the 77 TMK out of a .223 is truly a lethal combination well suited to a dedicated lower 48 big game rifle.

Would love to hear about others experiences with this bullet or similar bulletts!

About any caliber will kill I would not recommend using a 223.

 

[Axlrod]

About any caliber will kill I would not recommend using a 223.

I agree 100%. The only 223 caliber bullets available are 40 & 45 grain, intended for 22 Hornets that were originally a .223 bore. A much better option is .224 caliber in say a 223...

223 bullets - MidwayUSA

Shop MidwayUSA for the best 223 bullets

www.midwayusa.com

 

[mtnwrunner]

What would really be nice on this thread is for FNG'S or whoever to actually read the ENTIRE contents before they make a post.

Randy

 

[svivian]

What would really be nice on this thread is for FNG'S or whoever to actually read the ENTIRE contents before they make a post.

Randy

Gotta get those 10 posts for the classifieds….

 

[5811]

What would really be nice on this thread is for FNG'S or whoever to actually read the ENTIRE contents before they make a post.

Randy

I'm not sure that's a fair ask anymore. When it was sub 200 pages it was fair, but even that was a homework assignment most wouldn't have time for. I'm lucky I read it when i did. Now, it's at least 150 pages of reloading/ammo search/rifle selection/off topic drivel.

If there was a sticky post with the updated table of content, 100 pages of necropsy and kill photos/data, and maybe three or four redundant arguments by different fng/dissenters, that would be a fair assignment. Just enough to be like, "here's the data, here's photographs of proof, here's 5 people who already made the same argument you think might be new."

Tons of great info in here, but no way I'd read it start to finish at 360+ pages.

 

[IDVortex]

I'm not sure that's a fair ask anymore. When it was sub 200 pages it was fair, but even that was a homework assignment most wouldn't have time for. I'm lucky I read it when i did. Now, it's at least 150 pages of reloading/ammo search/rifle selection/off topic drivel.

If there was a sticky post with the updated table of content, 100 pages of necropsy and kill photos/data, and maybe three or four redundant arguments by different fng/dissenters, that would be a fair assignment. Just enough to be like, "here's the data, here's photographs of proof, here's 5 people who already made the same argument you think might be new."

Tons of great info in here, but no way I'd read it start to finish at 360+ pages.

Then I'd assume it would be fair to not respond to a thread that you haven't read.

 

[5811]

Then I'd assume it would be fair to not respond to a thread that you haven't read.

*In its entirety- that's all I was pointing out. I think someone could read half of it and have a fair right to post. I'm not sure how reading hundreds of posts about reloading data and sources for tmks would make a difference in what someone's opinion on hunting with 223 might be.

I get it. It's tiresome to see the same argument over and over by people who clearly haven't read any of it. But this thread has become quite the obese monster.

I'm partly pointing this out to try and nudge people to stay on topic instead of using it as a bin for anything 223 related. I love checking in and seeing the recent bear updates any any other proof of use posts.

 

[JPeters218]

What would really be nice on this thread is for FNG'S or whoever to actually read the ENTIRE contents before they make a post.

Randy

If only there was a way to lock commenting until you’ve viewed every page. Like those terms and agreements that you have to scroll through the whole thing before it lets you click the box.

 

[Pharmseller]

I'm not sure that's a fair ask anymore. When it was sub 200 pages it was fair, but even that was a homework assignment most wouldn't have time for. I'm lucky I read it when i did. Now, it's at least 150 pages of reloading/ammo search/rifle selection/off topic drivel.

If there was a sticky post with the updated table of content, 100 pages of necropsy and kill photos/data, and maybe three or four redundant arguments by different fng/dissenters, that would be a fair assignment. Just enough to be like, "here's the data, here's photographs of proof, here's 5 people who already made the same argument you think might be new."

Tons of great info in here, but no way I'd read it start to finish at 360+ pages.

I treat it like a girly magazine. Just look at the pictures.

P