2022 Bows

[Coveyleader]

Thanks, that's the kind of reasoning I was looking for. Just looking at specs a guy would expect 5-6 fps difference between them.


How so? Is it slower than any other smooth drawing 7" brace bow? It could have a rated speed that is 10 fps overstated on average and still be in line with most similarly spec'd bows.

Let's say you're upgrading bows as the RX7 Ultra fits the bill. When you shoot it, no doubt, there is a wow factor, but its a bit subdued by the speeds using normal hunting weight arrows. It's hard pill to swallow for some (maybe myself included) when you're paying a pretty generous price for a bow, and with a normal hunting arrow weight at say 60lbs @ 29 inches barely break 250fps. In this case, I'm not gaining anything really from what I had.

To add, I've shot it about 4 different times now, and it's funny, a couple of the shops went back to check DL and poundage as they too didn't expect such low velocities.

 

[jmez]

Most that would buy the Ultra do no have speed as a priority.

 

[wind gypsy]

Let's say you're upgrading bows as the RX7 Ultra fits the bill. When you shoot it, no doubt, there is a wow factor, but its a bit subdued by the speeds using normal hunting weight arrows. It's hard pill to swallow for some (maybe myself included) when you're paying a pretty generous price for a bow, and with a normal hunting arrow weight at say 60lbs @ 29 inches barely break 250fps. In this case, I'm not gaining anything really from what I had.

To add, I've shot it about 4 different times now, and it's funny, a couple of the shops went back to check DL and poundage as they too didn't expect such low velocities.

Bows haven't gotten any faster in the past decade as far as I can see one shouldn't expect a bow to be fast because it's new. It's a 7" brace smooth drawing bow. It's not going to be fast and expecting that it magically does something that no other similarly spec'd bow has done isn't reasonable criticism. If the only thing you're looking to gain with a new bow is speed you should be looking at bows at the opposite end of the spectrum.

 

[doc holiday13]

The same can be said for all the big boys. When was the last time any of them came out with something truly revolutionary? Minor improvements to last year's platform is the name of the game. But in their defense, bows are so good now it'd be hard to make a major improvement every year.

So true.

Partly the reason why I'm shooting a 12 year old Mathews Z7... The improvements made in the last 10 years are hardly a reason to upgrade

 

[3forks]

So true.

Partly the reason why I'm shooting a 12 year old Mathews Z7... The improvements made in the last 10 years are hardly a reason to upgrade

Not trying to be contentious, but when was the last time you shot new bows back to back against your current bow and how good is your form and shot process?

I agree that year after year changes are not dramatic, but would argue there’s been significant improvements to bows made 12 years ago compared to what’s being made today.

 

[doc holiday13]

Not trying to be contentious, but when was the last time you shot new bows back to back against your current bow and how good is your form and shot process?

I agree that year after year changes are not dramatic, but would argue there’s been significant improvements to bows made 12 years ago compared to what’s being made today.

Mathews Z7

• Brace Height: 7″
• ATA Length: 30″
• Draw Length: 25-30″ (half sizes from 25.5″ to 29.5″)
• Draw Weight: 40-70 lbs
• IBO Speed: 332 fps
• Weight: 4 lbs
• Let-Off: 80%

Mathews V3X
Brace height 6"
ATA: 29"
Draw 25-30″
IBO: 340
Weight: 4.5
Let off- 80 or 85%

Yup you got me.. 8 fps faster and slightly higher let-off..

Draw cycle will be slightly different because of cam design. But the way it feels is user dependent.. Yes new bows are easier to change draw length and they've improved vibration controls but whats the measurable difference in performance? Z7 vibrations are near non existent but I'm also not looking for them. More importantly its certainly the furthest thing from my mind when i punch the trigger on a deer. I shoot heavy arrows so they soak up any noise created by the bow.

My last bow was a used bow from 1990 something and was 10+.lbs... and vibrated your teeth out of your head. Going to the Z7 was a massive step up. Wanna impress me? Add another 20-40 fps and keep the vibration at the same level as my Z7

 

[3forks]

Mathews Z7

• Brace Height: 7″
• ATA Length: 30″
• Draw Length: 25-30″ (half sizes from 25.5″ to 29.5″)
• Draw Weight: 40-70 lbs
• IBO Speed: 332 fps
• Weight: 4 lbs
• Let-Off: 80%

Mathews V3X
Brace height 6"
ATA: 29"
Draw 25-30″
IBO: 340
Weight: 4.5
Let off- 80 or 85%

Yup you got me.. 8 fps faster and slightly higher let-off..

Draw cycle will be slightly different because of cam design. But the way it feels is user dependent.. Yes new bows are easier to change draw length and they've improved vibration controls but whats the measurable difference in performance? Z7 vibrations are near non existent but I'm also not looking for them. More importantly its certainly the furthest thing from my mind when i punch the trigger on a deer. I shoot heavy arrows so they soak up any noise created by the bow.

My last bow was a used bow from 1990 something and was 10+.lbs... and vibrated your teeth out of your head. Going to the Z7 was a massive step up. Wanna impress me? Add another 20-40 fps and keep the vibration at the same level as my Z7

Didn’t mean to touch a nerve, and I stand corrected as I can see that for you, there are no improvements worth pursuing.

 

[Coveyleader]

So true.

Partly the reason why I'm shooting a 12 year old Mathews Z7... The improvements made in the last 10 years are hardly a reason to upgrade

I agree. I'm at 20 years, and am struggling. The draw cycles for me have actually got worse. I still shoot 65% let off, and the draw is smooth all the way though no matter when drawing or letting down. The Hoyt is the best this year (for me) I'm just struggling with the "Gains"

 

[doc holiday13]

Didn’t mean to touch a nerve, and I stand corrected as I can see that for you, there are no improvements worth pursuing.

You didn't touch any nerves. You just didn't present any evidence that would have changed my mind. You're the one I think that needed convincing that nothing really great has happened in the last decade.

If I could pick something "performance" I guess it could be the advances in carbon bows but I didn't draw a comparison with a carbon bow

 

[3forks]

You didn't touch any nerves. You just didn't present any evidence that would have changed my mind. You're the one I think that needed convincing that nothing really great has happened in the last decade.

If I could pick something "performance" I guess it could be the advances in carbon bows but I didn't draw a comparison with a carbon bow

I don’t need convincing that there are appreciable differences between a bow produced 12 years ago compared to one produced today. But, I can understand that for you the gains aren’t perceivable or significant enough for you to justify wanting to buy a new bow.

 

[MattB]

I don’t need convincing that there are appreciable differences between a bow produced 12 years ago compared to one produced today. But, I can understand that for you the gains aren’t perceivable or significant enough for you to justify wanting to buy a new bow.

Absolutely, and many of those improvements are going to be ignored by people who are just comparing specs. Forgivingness, quietness, smoothness, reduced vibration, tunability, adjustability - just to name a few. Some people don't value these things which is perfectly fine, but many do.

 

[coyotecreek]

I think the biggest advancement in bows over the past 10-15 years has been in adjustability and tunability. Adjustable mods, deadlock cams, SET limbs. Switchweight cams.

I've got an old wood limb Darton from the 80's that draws to something like 32", I'd take my ear off if I shot that thing! Used to be the shooter would have to adjust to the bow, but now bows will adapt to the shooter.

 

[bojangles808]

Absolutely, and many of those improvements are going to be ignored by people who are just comparing specs. Forgivingness, quietness, smoothness, reduced vibration, tunability, adjustability - just to name a few. Some people don't value these things which is perfectly fine, but many do.

I dono my backup bowtech experience is about 95% of the bow my V3 was in these areas. Just as dead and almost as quiet, just as smooth. Just as forgiving. Doesn't quite have the speed, efficiency or adjustability with switchweight but I actually prefer tuning the BT with the od binarys vs the top hats. Also prefer the Mathews grip. I still like the Mathews platform and wanted a shorter ata to complement the experience so I sold the v3 before 2022s dropped, got most of my money back, and got a mint vertix to play around with. String angle prob fits me a touch better than the experience.

moral of the story is if you have something you like from the last 10 years, bring it with you and shoot it side by side with any of the new bows if you're thinking about upgrading before you make the jump. Def don't upgrade sight unseen you might just be surprised with ol' reliable

 

[Billy Goat]

I mean, since wheels got put on a bow, nothing huge has changed.


But I can tell a lot of difference from bows ten years ago til now.


Does a new bow kill a deer deader than a Jennings Carbon Extreme???

Nope, not even the bows that still have carbon in the name.


Are they easier to shoot and tune?
Yeahup.

 

[Marble]

I shot the RX7 tonight. It was the Pro model, 60-70, set at around 60 pounds.

The draw cycle reminded me of the Carbon spider ZT cam. At the beginning of the draw cycle it had pretty good amount of pressure which then smoothed out immediately and maintained it until the end, very smooth/consistent, until the end where pressure increases. Then the standard Hoyt backwall. Felt good and as expected. I shot it at 85 and 80% let off and preferred the latter. I also shot it at 29, 29.5 and 30 inches. 30 felt the best, but it was also at 60 pounds. Sometimes bottoming out the limbs will change that a bit so I suspect I would shoot it at 29.5.

The best way I can describe how the bow shoots is similar to shooting a rifle with a muzzle brake and silencer on it at the same time. I could hear the bow go off and see everything as normal, but I couldn't feel anything throughout the shot. Kind of weird in a really good way. Haven't ever shot a bow like that.

The bow esthetically looks okay. I'm not wild about how it looks but I really don't care about that. My last bow I got in dark charcoal/gray and will never do that again. The solid dark color shows everything. Ill be getting some type of camo pattern for sure if I decide to get one.

I was impressed with its function, feel and hold. I'll be bringing in my Axius Ultra and shooting both side by side and through the chronograph for giggles. Probably do that later this week. I did have limited time as I needed to shoot my other bow before tomorrow night

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[Tmorg52]

Not with this redneck accent.

I remember someone telling me awhile back that #2 was a failed design so they scrapped it along with the # Maybe 6 was the same and then got it right with the next attempt. Who knows! Doesn't really matter #7 seems to be my next bow if i can just get my hands on one to try it. My local Archer store says a few more days and if i like it i can battle it out with the wife on the cost LOL . No Hunny it's a good investment, really!!

 

[LONE HUNTER]

Let's say you're upgrading bows as the RX7 Ultra fits the bill. When you shoot it, no doubt, there is a wow factor, but its a bit subdued by the speeds using normal hunting weight arrows. It's hard pill to swallow for some (maybe myself included) when you're paying a pretty generous price for a bow, and with a normal hunting arrow weight at say 60lbs @ 29 inches barely break 250fps. In this case, I'm not gaining anything really from what I had.

To add, I've shot it about 4 different times now, and it's funny, a couple of the shops went back to check DL and poundage as they too didn't expect such low velocities.

You know that buttery smooth draw people are talking about with that bow? Yeah that's why it isn't a speed demon. Bows have pretty much hit their theoretical limits of efficiency in transferring energy between the limbs and cams back to the string and into the arrow. In other words. If you want a faster bow, chances are the draw cycle isn't going to be fun. Faster bows require more energy input from the user. Conservation of energy........

Every persons nervous system is different so perceived draw cycle is going vary between users but from a pure physics standpoint, the point I made the the previous paragraph this is an inescapable truth.

 

[MattB]

You know that buttery smooth draw people are talking about with that bow? Yeah that's why it isn't a speed demon. Bows have pretty much hit their theoretical limits of efficiency in transferring energy between the limbs and cams back to the string and into the arrow. In other words. If you want a faster bow, chances are the draw cycle isn't going to be fun. Faster bows require more energy input from the user. Conservation of energy........

Every persons nervous system is different so perceived draw cycle is going vary between users but from a pure physics standpoint, the point I made the the previous paragraph this is an inescapable truth.

I agree, “smoothness” seems to be as much about familiarity/similarity to one’s current bow as anything.

 

[clintdeatherage]

Coming from a vxr 31.5, hamskea, 2 pin spott hogg and 1 peice tight spot

Thought I was sold on a long Ata bowtech, though handled and shot a v3x 33 today.

Looks like in order to run the new quiver on the v3x, you have to run a railed sight into the riser and integrate rest. My spott hogg 2 pin was too fat to bolt to riser and hit the arrows in the tight fitting quiver. Hamskea would obviously stick out too far as well.

If you commit to the v3x system, it seams it would be much more clean and tidy compared to a bowtech that has a hamskea and tight spot hanging off the side of it.

Thinking not needing a back bar for side balance would be handy belly crawling on a stalk, let alone just a cleaner looking setup.

All specs between revolt xl and v3x 33 very similar, I think I'm sold on the mathews system, unless the bowtech shoots laser beams.

Only problem is the $2,000 for whole new setup, bow, quiver, rest, and bar sight.

I was able to mount a sword dovetail, and original QAD HDX and an apex 5 arrow(tight spot look alike) on my v3x tighter than the new Mathews detachable

 

[Marble]

I shot the RX7 Ultra again tonight. I don't like the cam. I don't like how it loads up on the front and back end. Valley is great, 80% is great, the shot is the best I've ever felt. But shooting next to my Axius I like it better. Mostly because of the draw cycle.

With the RX7 @30" and the Axius @29", the RX7 shot a 525 grain arrow at 265 and the Axius was 259. I don't get how there could be such a large discrepancy on the draw length. My Axius I shoot 29", the Invicta 29.5 (it's 40 ATA) and the RX7 33 I believe. Maybe it's because the cams are so different.

So for me, I'll be waiting to upgrade and enjoy my current set up.

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