145 LRX vs 150 TTSX in 280 AI

[Art Fern]

Hi all,

New to reloading and trying to work up a load for my new-to-me Kimber Montana in 280 AI. I’d like to stick with copper and the Barnes options are at the top of my list. They seem to have a good track record.

Anyone have experience with the 145 LRX and 150 TTSX in this loading? Looking for best combo of near and far performance. I hunt deer, moose and elk from 20 yards out to 400ish. Nothing against shooting further than that, but I’ve never had to shoot more than 400 yards.

Any load and powder recommendations?

Thanks,
Art

 

[A382DWDZQ]

I’d go with whichever of those two shoots the best. You could probably even go with the 175gr TSX and only be a little lower than the 150 TTSX at 400yds. I’ve had good luck with Barnes’s published load data.

 

[rcook10]

Velocity is king with copper so play with a calculator and see what various bullet weights and BCs will give you at your comfortable end range and decide from there. Remember that most copper monos need an additional 200fps over advertised minimum expansion velocity to get a comfortable window for real expansion and not just open the tip.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

139LRX or 145LRX, forget the TTSX imho. They have better BC and lower expansion requirements. The 145LRX has been very effective in my 280AI, this load work was before the 139LRX came out. I am planning to try the 139 in the 284WIN barrel I ordered.

 

[Art Fern]

I’d go with whichever of those two shoots the best. You could probably even go with the 175gr TSX and only be a little lower than the 150 TTSX at 400yds. I’ve had good luck with Barnes’s published load data.

Do you still have enough velocity for expansion? I’ve read it’s best to go lighter with coppers. No experience myself, though.

 

[Art Fern]

Velocity is king with copper so play with a calculator and see what various bullet weights and BCs will give you at your comfortable end range and decide from there. Remember that most copper monos need an additional 200fps over advertised minimum expansion velocity to get a comfortable window for real expansion and not just open the tip.

Do you know what velocity Barnes recommends? I’ve looked but have found several different numbers.

139LRX or 145LRX, forget the TTSX imho. They have better BC and lower expansion requirements. The 145LRX has been very effective in my 280AI, this load work was before the 139LRX came out. I am planning to try the 139 in the 284WIN barrel I ordered.

How do the LRX perform at close range? Do they fall apart?

 

[Jfjfrye]

Go with the one your barrel likes most. But with monolithic copper speed is for friend to help with expansion…..GO FASTER!

 

[Art Fern]

Any powder recommendations to start with?

 

[BrBa]

Any powder recommendations to start with?

On the 'faster' burning end of the spectrum you can try H4350, N555 or RL16. Those are all temp stable. On the 'slower' end, try RL23, RL26 or H4831SC, which are also temp stable. Best velocity will probably be with RL26. You'll see a lot of recommendations for H4831SC for the best groups albeit with a bit less velocity. Still plenty fast for a 400 yard shot on elk.

 

[Montana Slim]

The 280ai and 139gr LRX with H4350 could be a really nice thing...

I shoot them out of a 7mmRM and wish I had a 280. They will definitely not 'fall apart'.

 

[A382DWDZQ]

Do you still have enough velocity for expansion? I’ve read it’s best to go lighter with coppers. No experience myself, though.

I've heard that too. I think generally speaking, that is true, but the minimum impact velocity on the TSX is generally 1800, but you'd have to check with Barnes support on that 175 flat bottom to be sure. At 400 yards, if you are running it about mid-velocity for the load data, 2600fps, then you will be impacting at 1855fps. I've seen a lot of folks say you need to add 200fps to the manufacturer's minimum. I don't think that is a bad idea, but I also find it odd that they would say that is the minimum for terminal performance, and then have it not be. On the 150 TTSX, I don't have verified minimum velocity on that one, but I believe it is 2000 fps. (Barnes said 1500fps). Email Barnes support for that info. On the 140 TTSX, it is 1800, 145 LRX 1500, and 139 LRX 1400. I thought someone said it already, but the Barnes don't come apart at short range, so using an LRX at short range should be fine, and for most of them, your velocity will still be over 2000fps up and including 300 yards. All that said, I've worked up loads in various 30 cals, 708, and several 270s. In all of them they tend to not like all of those bullets, they like one or maybe two. First rifle I loaded for was a 270 and I started with 130 TSX with like IMR4350 or something. It was submoa for several 3 shot groups on the first ladder, but I wanted it to shoot 129 LRXs. I tried the LRXs with all kinds of powder and I could not get them to group up. I didn't even realize what I had with the TSX until I had loads for a few other rifles and it just kind of clicked.

 

[Art Fern]

I've heard that too. I think generally speaking, that is true, but the minimum impact velocity on the TSX is generally 1800, but you'd have to check with Barnes support on that 175 flat bottom to be sure. At 400 yards, if you are running it about mid-velocity for the load data, 2600fps, then you will be impacting at 1855fps. I've seen a lot of folks say you need to add 200fps to the manufacturer's minimum. I don't think that is a bad idea, but I also find it odd that they would say that is the minimum for terminal performance, and then have it not be. On the 150 TTSX, I don't have verified minimum velocity on that one, but I believe it is 2000 fps. Email Barnes support for that info. On the 140 TTSX, it is 1800, 145 LRX 1500, and 139 LRX 1400. I thought someone said it already, but the Barnes don't come apart at short range, so using an LRX at short range should be fine, and for most of them, your velocity will still be over 2000fps up and including 300 yards. All that said, I've worked up loads in various 30 cals, 708, and several 270s. In all of them they tend to not like all of those bullets, they like one or maybe two. First rifle I loaded for was a 270 and I started with 130 TSX with like IMR4350 or something. It was submoa for several 3 shot groups on the first ladder, but I wanted it to shoot 129 LRXs. I tried the LRXs with all kinds of powder and I could not get them to group up. I didn't even realize what I had with the TSX until I had loads for a few other rifles and it just kind of clicked.

The minimum velocity difference between the 150 TTSX and 145 LRX is incredible. That 500 fps is pretty significant in hunting situations I’d say.

I’ll try both. Hopefully my rifle likes the 145 LRX.

 

[A382DWDZQ]

Here is a ballistic comparison of some of the Barnes bullets in .284 and .270 I did a little while back. This was for the 708, but you can still get a good idea of it.

View attachment 367498Here is the data...

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

How do the LRX perform at close range? Do they fall apart?

Not at all.

I am using IMR7828SSC in mine because H4831SC wasn’t instock at the time. When I burn through the IMR I’ll likely try a load with the H4831SC cause I use that in another caliber also.

I wouldn’t go anywhere near the manufacturer minimum by the way, I don’t want minimal expansion so I won’t hit with minimal velocity. My MV with the 145LRX is 3130fps so I have plenty of velocity quite a ways out there.

 

[Fotis]

Any powder recommendations to start with?

RL 22 23 IMR 7828. Whenever practical I always choose the LRX

 

[Gynaroo]

I love the 145 lrx out of my 7 rem mag. I use MagPro but have also had good results with H4831sc. My rifle does best with 145 lrx or 160 accubonds. I’ve shot elk anywhere from 85yds out to 700 yds with the LRX with same results. Love the bullet. Slowly switching all my rifles to LrX.

 

[Art Fern]

On the 'faster' burning end of the spectrum you can try H4350, N555 or RL16. Those are all temp stable. On the 'slower' end, try RL23, RL26 or H4831SC, which are also temp stable. Best velocity will probably be with RL26. You'll see a lot of recommendations for H4831SC for the best groups albeit with a bit less velocity. Still plenty fast for a 400 yard shot on elk.

I have some H4350 handy. I’ll try that. RL is impossible to find near me right now. I think I can find some H4831 locally. I’ll grab that, too.

Not at all.

I am using IMR7828SSC in mine because H4831SC wasn’t instock at the time. When I burn through the IMR I’ll likely try a load with the H4831SC cause I use that in another caliber also.

I wouldn’t go anywhere near the manufacturer minimum by the way, I don’t want minimal expansion so I won’t hit with minimal velocity. My MV with the 145LRX is 3130fps so I have plenty of velocity quite a ways out there.

Are you getting 3130 fps with a 280 AI?

 

[jjwise97]

I got a Kimber Hunter this year in 280Ackley. Worked up loads for it shooting 150TTSX and 55.5gr of IMR4350. Getting a MV of right at 3000fps.

Shot my first antelope this year with that load, 345yd frontal (slightly quartering) shot and that bullet exited just in front of the back hip. Have shot a few whitetails with it as well and also had great results, as I’ve always seen from any Barnes load. TBH unless you’re shooting very far I don’t think you’ll see any difference between the 145LRX and the 150TTSX. At 500 my TTSX should still be going over 2,000fps which is plenty to expand, though to be honest I would’ve probably went with the LRX if they hadn’t been sold out everywhere at the time.

 

[Fotis]

Take a look at this

This has proven to be a deadly combination for North American big game. Your 280 can launch it faster!

 

[2Stamp]

I use the 145 LRX out of my 280ai. Load is H4831sc at the Barnes book max. Average velocity out of my 22" barrel is 3080.