WY Corner crossing update

[4cMuley]

just wait, Aziak will be coming out with a carbon fiber ultralight ladder soon

 

[cuerro viejo]

I agree, but until this is more firmly settled I wouldn't rely on any GPS-related "proof points" at all. Typical GPS accuracy is anywhere from 5-30' horizontally and that's only if it's been going long enough to get enough data points to average together. That error alone could be the difference between "ok" and "trespassing." It also assumes the boundaries in the GPS are accurate, and as much as OnX and others work on this (to their credit) they aren't 100%. The burden is on YOU to NOT trespass, so it's not a defense to say the GPS was wrong.

But as others said, the "burden of proof" is on the plaintiff/prosecutor. Let THEM show that their boundaries are accurate, and prove that you were on the wrong side. Until then, given how this original case landed, I'd personally just take a photo of the ladder (or whatever) used in the crossing.

Fences are also not property boundaries in a lot of states as they are lines of convenance. With that said I had discussion with Capt GW in NM, and I’m sure it’s reciprocal in a lot of states, but Onx is valid as a defense as it’s best technology and easiest access tool to determine boundaries for the general public, and GW use it also.

 

[Misawa]

Great news!

 

[Coveyleader]

Antelope hunting in WY just got alot better.

 

[ScreamingPotato]

Antelope hunting in WY just got alot better.

I'm actually thinking about applying specifically because of this, wanna get in on the first year before all the good bucks get shot.

 

[WCB]

Oh, I agree. There should not be one square inch of public land that isn’t legally accessible by the public, IMO. Land that is public that is surrounded by private should have an easement or the government and the property owner should have to come to some type of swap agreement to exchange land that is accessible.

100% against a forced easement. There are "public" pieces miles inside private lands. This is the governments issues for setting up/defining those pieces where they are not the surrounding land owner. If an appropriate land swap was initiated ok but forcing a landowner to open potentially miles of their land up to general travel 100% no.

 

[Laramie]

100% against a forced easement. There are "public" pieces miles inside private lands. This is the governments issues for setting up/defining those pieces where they are not the surrounding land owner. If an appropriate land swap was initiated ok but forcing a landowner to open potentially miles of their land up to general travel 100% no.

I get you point but in most instances the land swaps will dramatically favor the private land owner. For that reason, I am against them 99% of the time.

 

[mad_angler]

100% against a forced easement. There are "public" pieces miles inside private lands. This is the governments issues for setting up/defining those pieces where they are not the surrounding land owner. If an appropriate land swap was initiated ok but forcing a landowner to open potentially miles of their land up to general travel 100% no.

I agree. The idea is allow walkers to go over the corner and step from public to public.

The private landowner has not right to prevent people from crossing through the airspace above the corner.

BUT... the landowner has every right to keep people off of his property. Adding an easement forces him to allow people to walk (and drive?) over his land. That (IMHO) would be an abuse of this ruling...

 

[WCB]

I agree. The idea is allow walkers to go over the corner and step from public to public.

The private landowner has not right to prevent people from crossing through the airspace above the corner.

BUT... the landowner has every right to keep people off of his property. Adding an easement forces him to allow people to walk (and drive?) over his land. That (IMHO) would be an abuse of this ruling...

Yep...and my comments were obviously beyond the corner issue as there is a definite murmuring or desire for many PuBLic LanDOwnErs to demand access to all PuBLiC LaND even within private boundaries.

 

[MikeDeltaFoxtrot]

I agree. The idea is allow walkers to go over the corner and step from public to public.

The private landowner has not right to prevent people from crossing through the airspace above the corner.

BUT... the landowner has every right to keep people off of his property. Adding an easement forces him to allow people to walk (and drive?) over his land. That (IMHO) would be an abuse of this ruling...

The court specifically held that it was not creating an easement. That would be a taking, and it would require compensation.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

Antelope hunting in WY just got alot better.

I wonder if it will inspire alot more landowners to enroll their properties as walk in areas, they can define which portions of their property are off limits. Might was well get paid if folks are going to be hop scotching through your ranch anyways.

 

[TaperPin]

Looking through 1:100,000 BLM maps to see if there was anywhere new I’d go, nothing stands out. I’m sure there’s some good hunting to be found, but we’ve already found good hunting on unbroken public land, so it’s not going to effect us.

Many of the areas that look checkerboard where we hunt were abandoned years ago and might as well be public land. Leaving an undivided interest in property to an ever expanding family is a sure way that nothing will ever get done with it. I bet some of these areas are shared by 50 or 100 heirs. I share a few with 20 relatives who will never agree on anything and reproduce like rabbits so the next generation will be even less likely to use it.

It will be fun watching video montages from trail cams catching guys missing corners.

 

[actionshooter]

It doesn’t “officially” but I guarantee you that the “gates will be open” in Montana after this ruling. No county attorney would want to touch a case like this, especially after this ruling.

A hunter will still need to do his part in insuring that he is accurately going from corner to corner.

I agree that some of the western states judges that aren't part of the 10th district will pay attention to this ruling... In your home, your AG Austin Knudsen is great, but here in Washington state, this will likely be a fight.

 

[mad_angler]

I looks like there will be a rush on buying these...Pool Ladder

 

[JFK]

I’m guessing that the ranch owner who drug this out in court wishes he just made nice with these hunters, told them to stick to the public checkerboard, be respectful, and keep quiet about it. Whole thing could have been worked out with a handshake.

 

[manitou1]

I’m guessing that the ranch owner who drug this out in court wishes he just made nice with these hunters, told them to stick to the public checkerboard, be respectful, and keep quiet about it. Whole thing could have been worked out with a handshake.

No, he is too narcissistic for that.

He is King, remember? The rest of them are peasants.

 

[Spence1875]

I am curious to see if a ladder will even be required based on the ruling. Seems stepping corner tip public to corner tip public meets the ruling. Additionally as to the point of knowing the exact corner. Unless already marked with marker or t posts how can the land owner argue it?

Have been a Leo for 25 years. Retired now. I doubt any Leo or prosecuted would touch one for these cases unless blatant destruction or trespassing is done, a waste of resources.

 

[mtwarden]

I can only speak to Eastern Montana, but many of the corners of concern there are unfenced. The ones that are fenced, the BLM, USFS or State Lands put up a lot of the fence.

That narrow the need for a ladder down a bit.

 

[nodakian]

Being a land surveyor, i see a lot of opportunities for land surveyors, both private and government, to help everyone comply with the spirit of this ruling.

The case-by-case implementation of this ruling will be tricky, and I would caution non surveyors about deciding whether a corner monument is valid. Just because you see an aluminum or brass cap or a stone, that doesn't mean you are seeing the true property corner. Even as a licensed surveyor, I very often need to do some homework and field survey to determine whether a monument marks the true corner. For instance, I am working on two projects right now that have double corners, and half of the brass cap monuments are not the true corners.

I am very much in favor of the ruling. It is a step in the right direction, in my opinion. Just be careful out there, and happy hunting.

 

[3forks]

Being a land surveyor, i see a lot of opportunities for land surveyors, both private and government, to help everyone comply with the spirit of this ruling.

The case-by-case implementation of this ruling will be tricky, and I would caution non surveyors about deciding whether a corner monument is valid. Just because you see an aluminum or brass cap or a stone, that doesn't mean you are seeing the true property corner. Even as a licensed surveyor, I very often need to do some homework and field survey to determine whether a monument marks the true corner. For instance, I am working on two projects right now that have double corners, and half of the brass cap monuments are not the true corners.

I am very much in favor of the ruling. It is a step in the right direction, in my opinion. Just be careful out there, and happy hunting.

Question for you… How much does a survey typically cost?