Why the NR HATE?? Let's fix it!

[Elkangle]

Raise your hand if you don't want your kids to have opportunity to hunt and appreciate other states of this great country.

I really don't think people understand the direction hunting will be going in the next 20 years after a good portion of hunters age out. Most of you can't get your kids out if the house, let alone spend huge portions of there disposable income just to have zero opportunities. As the non res hunter goes so will the opportunities for the resident. 15-20% of tags seams like a small price to pay for nation wide support and future opportunities for you kids

 

[mlevimadden]

If you can't increase the size of the pie with conservation, then what's the point in funding it all together?

Either it does something, or it doesn't.

Even if we lower our expectations to just maintaining the current number tags, an increased population of lions in Colorado from a ban on hunting definitely isn't going to increase the number of deer and elk tags CPW is issuing.

The unit I hunt elk in gave 35% of tags to non-residents last year. I agree with @CorbLand's post above. If 35% isn't enough of a split for nonresidents, what is a realistic split?

I've donated a measly $100 to CRWM personally and have never hunted lions, nor plan to. I do care deeply about hunting in Colorado and am willing to support fellow sportsmen and do my best to ensure hunting is available to future generations.

 

[Mojave]

The real problem is the idea that hunters residing in a state with less opportunities want a piece of the pie from the hunters residing in a state that have more opportunities.

Some of this is entitlement.

Some of this is a feel of missing out.

Some of this is a MISTAKEN belief that an animal residing on federal public land belongs to all Americans. It doesn't the courts have established this over and over.

New Mexico for residents is a challenge as 100% of all hunting for most species is on a draw. New Mexico has a strong hunting culture, a lot of wildlife but not enough to fill up the mostly desert environment. New Mexico also has a lot of private land.

Non-residents in New Mexico get 16%. From the outside when compared to Alaska or Wyoming is considered to be "not fair". When compared to Montana, Utah, Idaho and others at 10% is considered to down right wonderful.

 

[sndmn11]

As the non res hunter goes so will the opportunities for the resident. 15-20% of tags seams like a small price to pay for nation wide support and future opportunities for you kids

Are people only allowed to hunt in a state they don't live in?

 

[S.Clancy]

The real problem is the idea that hunters residing in a state with less opportunities want a piece of the pie from the hunters residing in a state that have more opportunities.

Some of this is entitlement.

Some of this is a feel of missing out.

Some of this is a MISTAKEN belief that an animal residing on federal public land belongs to all Americans. It doesn't the courts have established this over and over.

New Mexico for residents is a challenge as 100% of all hunting for most species is on a draw. New Mexico has a strong hunting culture, a lot of wildlife but not enough to fill up the mostly desert environment. New Mexico also has a lot of private land.

Non-residents in New Mexico get 16%. From the outside when compared to Alaska or Wyoming is considered to be "not fair". When compared to Montana, Utah, Idaho and others at 10% is considered to down right wonderful.

You forgot seeing opportunities diminish to an unbelievable increase in demand due to, primarily, economics and a flooding of hunting media.

 

[goathunter]

As the non res hunter goes so will the opportunities for the resident. 15-20% of tags seams like a small price to pay for nation wide support and future opportunities for you kids

Are people only allowed to hunt in a state they don't live in?

Ya WTF? Lots of fear mongering in this thread in the name of more NR tags. "Give me 20% or hunting is gone" Nice try. The way - IMO - to combat these dark threats, is through getting behind well-funded pro hunting organizations. The Wyoming BHA chapter is sounding pretty good..

 

[CorbLand]

Good post.
What I'll add is:
1. Just because you read one or even a handful of posts of an NR complaining about this or that tag, its just one guy. That person doesn't speak for everyone. We all need to remember that. Resident or Non.
I donated to CRWM and so did alot of other people that don't live in Colorado. I love that state and I'm not going to give it up without a fight. I don't care if I ever draw a tag there.
I like Rokslide, I've gotten a ton of info from here, but sometimes the only posting being done is by the lowest common denominator. And its making things seem worse than they actually are. Its no secret that people engage more on social media when they are angry, and tag reductions make people angry.

2. With charity usually, you can donate time or money. Generally, residents are %1000 better at donating their time, and NR are, generally good at donating money in lieu of donating time. Good or bad, its always been that way. Its not very realistic to expect someone from Ohio or the Carolinas to travel to western Wyoming for a weekend habitat project. People need to help whatever way they can. And for most NR, that will be donating cash. Even if it 5 or 10 bucks like you said, just do something!

One problem I see is these orgs do a terrible job getting the word out on these projects. Most time you don't hear about habitat projects until after the fact. Unless you follow/are a member of these orgs or go to the meetings, you will never know they are going on. And social media "influencers" certainly don't give a crap to get the word out. If social media is this great tool for uniting hunters behind causes like "influencers" claim, they better start using it for that purpose.
A bigger pie is benefits everyone.

Only responding to this to clarify a few things in my post that you brought up.

1. I would never expect someone from the east coast to come out west to help for a weekend. I would expect them to be willing to send some funds to help with it though. There's something like 14 million hunters in the US. Could you imagine if every single one sent a dollar, a freaking dollar, to organizations when they need it?

2. I agree that organizations could be better about getting their projects out there but there has never been an easier time to stay in the loop than today. Following them via social media or signing up for their email newsletter is pretty simple.

 

[Dos Perros]

Donate your money, and then **** off!

 

[CorbLand]

Donate your money, and then **** off!

*Sarcasm, I dont want you to **** off, unless you are complaining about tag allocation and not doing anything to help it.

 

[Dos Perros]

*Sarcasm, I dont want you to **** off, unless you are complaining about tag allocation and not doing anything to help it**.

** - other than paying increasing prices for diminishing opportunities at a degrading hunt experience

 

[goathunter]

Locals only!!!

No kooks!

 

[robby denning]

This is kind of a funny take on the situation in my opinion because quite frankly, a state could give 50% to NR and I really dont think they would show up to help. The most generous state in the west to NR asked for people to donate to CRWM to help fight the wolf and lion issues. There was a thread started about it and the first post was someone bitching and asking why they should help when they dont give tags? This state gives out over double the percentage of most other western states and has for decades. It wasnt enough. How many do they have to give out before people will send 5 bucks? What about 10?

I live within an hour of two borders and have helped with a handful of projects. One nonresident has showed up to help with those.

I really just don't buy it.

If NR want more tags, the number one thing you should be doing is supporting habitat and projects to help increase herd sizes. 10% of 100,000 is still double 10% of 50,000. The single biggest loss of hunting opportunity in Utah has come from tag cuts. We are down nearly 75% of deer tags in less than 40 years. If we could get back to giving out even half those tags, nearly all NR that applied for a 2023 general season deer tag here would have drawn.

@Schoolhousegrizz, if you want your kids to be able to hunt all over the west, the split isnt what will prevent them from it. The loss of tag allocation is what will do it. I have ran the numbers for average Utah general season deer units. If we dont change the trend we are on, and you have a kid that is between about 0-5 years old, you can all but count on them not getting a general season rifle deer tag before they are 21.

The biggest battle NR are always going to fight within most western states is, there isnt enough tags to supply residents with what they want, let alone NR. You are looking at someone that lives there, and saying "you should wait a little longer so I can come hunt your state and you should be thankful for that." Good luck.

These threads are always interesting and every time I read them, I generally think that the part that isnt being said out loud is that we all recognize things are not looking up for hunting regardless of where we live. Between legislative attacks and tag numbers, its probably not getting better and the solution we have all silently decided is to get what we can, while we can.

Maybe what we should be talking about instead of the split, is how do we increase the pie as a whole? Changing the split doesnt benefit everyone, increasing the pie does. Changing the split is nothing more than taking 20 bucks from your left hand, putting it in your right and thinking you are richer. But the simple truth of that is, it would take effort on every ones part and people would have to spend some time and/or money. Its easier just to bitch.

good post Corb

but after I read it, I reached out to Dan Gates of CRWM, about where are donations coming from NR v R:

"approximately 65% (NR) on the the grassroots side (individuals) but with the industry, NGOs (non-governmental orgs like RMEF & SCI) and such, it is all over the place.

"the podcast outreach has really helped on the national side....heading to Bozeman for the Newberg then Rinella....this sort of outreach is what we are riding the wave on...thanks to guys like you...hopefully we can keep the momentum going and continue to educate and fundraise"

"While the opposition has big out of state funding, we do as well but the difference is ours is coming from folks that hunt & fish in Colorado and the West and they buy licenses to contribute to the conservation of all species. The antis don't and won't"


NRs are certainly stepping up. And when I worked the HOWL booth at Expo, the NRs were all over this issue. They're worried about losing opportunity just like the residents.

@Travis Hobbs

 

[180ls1]

After reading this whole thread, a few things are certain. I will keep donating, I will keep volunteering and I will keep growing my income.

 

[CorbLand]

good post Corb

but after I read it, I reached out to Dan Gates of CRWM, about where are donations coming from NR v R:

"approximately 65% (NR) on the the grassroots side (individuals) but with the industry, NGOs (non-governmental orgs like RMEF & SCI) and such, it is all over the place.

"the podcast outreach has really helped on the national side....heading to Bozeman for the Newberg then Rinella....this sort of outreach is what we are riding the wave on...thanks to guys like you...hopefully we can keep the momentum going and continue to educate and fundraise"

"While the opposition has big out of state funding, we do as well but the difference is ours is coming from folks that hunt & fish in Colorado and the West and they buy licenses to contribute to the conservation of all species. The antis don't and won't"


NRs are certainly stepping up. And when I worked the HOWL booth at Expo, the NRs were all over this issue. They're worried about losing opportunity just like the residents.

@Travis Hobbs

Glad to see/hear that things are picking up.

3 more days and my donation will go through again.

 

[Schoolhousegrizz]

Raise your hand if you don't want your kids to have opportunity to hunt and appreciate other states of this great country.

I really don't think people understand the direction hunting will be going in the next 20 years after a good portion of hunters age out. Most of you can't get your kids out if the house, let alone spend huge portions of there disposable income just to have zero opportunities. As the non res hunter goes so will the opportunities for the resident. 15-20% of tags seams like a small price to pay for nation wide support and future opportunities for you kids

Yes exactly, well said.

 

[Schoolhousegrizz]

good post Corb

but after I read it, I reached out to Dan Gates of CRWM, about where are donations coming from NR v R:

"approximately 65% (NR) on the the grassroots side (individuals) but with the industry, NGOs (non-governmental orgs like RMEF & SCI) and such, it is all over the place.

"the podcast outreach has really helped on the national side....heading to Bozeman for the Newberg then Rinella....this sort of outreach is what we are riding the wave on...thanks to guys like you...hopefully we can keep the momentum going and continue to educate and fundraise"

"While the opposition has big out of state funding, we do as well but the difference is ours is coming from folks that hunt & fish in Colorado and the West and they buy licenses to contribute to the conservation of all species. The antis don't and won't"


NRs are certainly stepping up. And when I worked the HOWL booth at Expo, the NRs were all over this issue. They're worried about losing opportunity just like the residents.

@Travis Hobbs

Thanks for sharing that data!

 

[robby denning]

Glad to see/hear that things are picking up.

3 more days and my donation will go through again.

another NR stepping up.

Thanks Corb

 

[CorbLand]

another NR stepping up.

Thanks Corb

If I am going to call people out like I do, I better put my money/time where my mouth is.

 

[Chucklehead]

If I am going to call people out like I do, I better put my money/time where my mouth is.

View attachment 679778

Heck with it, I'm in again too.


Lets keep this rollin'.

 

[Gobbler36]

LOL. I found this to be the funniest line yet with the location on your profile set to "none of your business". Noting to do with the thread, but still funny

Haha very true
even i shoulda caught that!

would have been better if he answered with that