Why the NR HATE?? Let's fix it!

[Schoolhousegrizz]

Yep. What’s funny about the OPs post is that the OPPOSITE is true.

If we had 100% resident only hunting, it could be easily argued we would have more hunters in Colorado. Easier access, better hunting, easier hunting = more resident hunters. The wolf initiative passed by around 1%, at one point it was less than 1%. More hunters would have led to more people voting against the wolves. So I contest that NR hunters caused the wolf initiative to pass.

Prove me wrong…


Explain how nonresident hunters helped keep the wolf initiative from passing?

I'm not saying they had anything to do with the wolf initiative. What I am saying/asking is don't you want to hunt all around the West not just in your home state? Let's share what we have with others instead of limiting others.

 

[Elkangle]

Does anyone know exactly how many hunters in the woods is acceptable? Or what an acceptable success rate is ? How hard should it be ? With instagram making things so easy but with the reality of hunting being very hard, I think alot of people are just slapped in the face with failure alil harder then they were a decade pluss ago.

This seems like an ever revolving door with guys literally never being happy even on extremely controlled units. This is the mind set you would need to battle in order to mitigate the loss of our culture.. you could use social media to push it but selling personal accountability.. the reason your hunt sucked is because of YOU...not a very popular opinion

Good luck, I see this thread is on its way to fixing alot of core issues

 

[Flyjunky]

Yep. What’s funny about the OPs post is that the OPPOSITE is true.

If we had 100% resident only hunting, it could be easily argued we would have more hunters in Colorado. Easier access, better hunting, easier hunting = more resident hunters. The wolf initiative passed by around 1%, at one point it was less than 1%. More hunters would have led to more people voting against the wolves. So I contest that NR hunters caused the wolf initiative to pass.

Prove me wrong…


Explain how nonresident hunters helped keep the wolf initiative from passing?

I’m guessing the f&w depts would not be too happy losing all that NR money in their budgets.

Any resident not hunting because it’s not easy enough isn’t all that interested in hunting in the first place.

 

[The_Jim]

Not exactly.
I used to hunt Nebraska - OTC deer and OTC turkey.

It became an absolute zoo. When the Neb Game & Parks sent me my yearly survey, I [as a NonRes] repeatedly mentioned there were too many NonRes taking part in the Neb hunting seasons.

Guess what - it musta been heard by me and others.
Now Nebraska has OTC with Caps for NonRes for deer and turkey.

I do the same for my Colorado surveys - I can’t understand why having a quality hunt every few years is less appealing than the circus that’s happening every year.

 

[sndmn11]

Sweet...then I assume you'll have no problem sharing your waypoints with everyone here since you could care less if others share it with you.

Ninja please.

Absolutely. If I run across you in the field I would be eager to share what we have learned about the area because I believe it would lead to better success and more fun for each of us. I can't think of any scenarios where coordination is bested by pulling in different directions.

If you are hunting a bedding area near a wallow calling and another hunter comes in, are you happy or sad? What if you talked with that other hunter earlier in the day and they then understood those rippin bugles were you and not a bull? What if you both understood what was going on and coordinated your efforts so that the real elk thought there were a whole lot of elk having a rut fest and it was more realistic than a bull/cow/calf/rake/repeat all coming from the same 1 sq/yd?

I scratch my head when folks will march into the woods with their "team" of helpers, but turn their nose up at being cordial with other hunters and sometimes even coordinating. Especially when they conclude that the woods are crowded because of another hunter, while ignoring the four trucks they and theirs brought.

 

[idahodave]

Absolutely. If I run across you in the field I would be eager to share what we have learned about the area because I believe it would lead to better success and more fun for each of us. I can't think of any scenarios where coordination is bested by pulling in different directions.

I'm nice to the people I run into as well. Nobody is arguing that. It's a red-herring discussion topic. That's not the issue.

What I'm saying is that if you're honest with yourself (and the rest of us), you'll admit it's preferable to not have to have share that theoretical wallow you referenced at all...or have to give you a lecture on how thermals work to ANYONE...resident OR non-resident.

That notion is what all of this is rooted in. I don't think most of us dislike non-residents. Most of us just don't like sharing a limited resource...and non-residents are the only group that "we" have the ability to limit.

It FEELS personal to NRs, but my contention is that it's not. Most residents would like to limit resident competition just as much. If that weren't the case, then draw-hunts wouldn't be so popular with ALL of us hunters...resident and non-resident alike.

 

[87TT]

 

[Jason Snyder]

Remember, it’s only whining if someone else is doing it. Fact.

 

[mtnwrunner]

Maybe we should just stop talking about it.

Randy

 

[KenLee]

I think non-res hunters are fine... As long as there not f'n Texans. ( I survived the Tomato Wars of the 1980's and will never forget!)

Tell us more bout these mater wars

 

[Elkangle]

That notion is what all of this is rooted in. I don't think most of us dislike non-residents. Most of us just don't like sharing a limited resource...and non-residents are the only group that "we" have the ability to limit.

I get what your saying that non res are an easy group to point the finger at but this isn't true... there's a ton of segments that hunters are attempting to limit.. look at tech restrictions, motor vehicle restrictions, resident tag restrictions

You could take any given state, reduce non res hunting to zero...and the very next year people would be pushing for long range rifle restrictions or maybe we should go to trad bows only...or maybe we should go back to trad muzzles...or maybe we should go 4 pt only...you know what...it's the dang radios !! Or the trail cams ! OMG THE QUADS

It literally never ends until hunters get some accountability

 

[idahodave]

I get what your saying that non res are an easy group to point the finger at but this isn't true... there's a ton of segments that hunters are attempting to limit.. look at tech restrictions, motor vehicle restrictions, resident tag restrictions

You could take any given state, reduce non res hunting to zero...and the very next year people would be pushing for long range rifle restrictions or maybe we should go to trad bows only...or maybe we should go back to trad muzzles...or maybe we should go 4 pt only...you know what...it's the dang radios !! Or the trail cams ! OMG THE QUADS

It literally never ends until hunters get some accountability

I know. I already said as much in my first post about this....

You see it to a lesser extent within the resident population with archery v muzzleloader v rifle hunters all jockeying for more opportunity for themselves and less for the "other guy".

My point is that residents (largely) don't hate non-residents...which is what many non-residents seem to believe. I'm trying to point out that is just a reflection of the human condition whereby NONE of wants to "share" our limited resource(s) if we're being honest. Non-residents are simply the easiest way to affect that thought process. Nothing more, and nothing less.

 

[S.Clancy]

I get what your saying that non res are an easy group to point the finger at but this isn't true... there's a ton of segments that hunters are attempting to limit.. look at tech restrictions, motor vehicle restrictions, resident tag restrictions

You could take any given state, reduce non res hunting to zero...and the very next year people would be pushing for long range rifle restrictions or maybe we should go to trad bows only...or maybe we should go back to trad muzzles...or maybe we should go 4 pt only...you know what...it's the dang radios !! Or the trail cams ! OMG THE QUADS

It literally never ends until hunters get some accountability

As a resident of MT I would rather see technological restrictions of rifles/bows before NR tag restrictions, personally.

 

[squid-freshprints]

Tell us more bout these mater wars

The Tomato Wars were an awesome tradition here in Twin Lakes/Leadville area. As a child combatant one would mostly just help with ammo/mato crates and yell insults at the Texans that would drive by Black Wolf Inn. (every once in a while someone with Texas plates would pass through during the festivities unaware of what was going on .Oh to see the look of horror as women and kids yelled at them to "go back home" and worse.) The wars were started by a family friend to poke fun at the long standing tradition we have in Colorado of being somewhat rude to our ever pervasive Texas visitors, all in good fun. There were a lot of open containers and smoke in the air those days, and as anyone who has seen the 4th of July Water fight in Prescott AZ will tell you these wild small western town traditions were total madness and totally fun!

 

[Flyjunky]

As a resident of MT I would rather see technological restrictions of rifles/bows before NR tag restrictions, personally.

I think that’s a slippery slope we don’t want to head down.

I can see the anti-2A using that against us. Headline “Even hunters banned these weapons from use”….a la Australia

 

[Schoolhousegrizz]

Well I'm glad I started this prouct

I get what your saying that non res are an easy group to point the finger at but this isn't true... there's a ton of segments that hunters are attempting to limit.. look at tech restrictions, motor vehicle restrictions, resident tag restrictions

You could take any given state, reduce non res hunting to zero...and the very next year people would be pushing for long range rifle restrictions or maybe we should go to trad bows only...or maybe we should go back to trad muzzles...or maybe we should go 4 pt only...you know what...it's the dang radios !! Or the trail cams ! OMG THE QUADS

It literally never ends until hunters get some accountability

Well said

 

[S.Clancy]

I think that’s a slippery slope we don’t want to head down.

I can see the anti-2A using that against us. Headline “Even hunters banned these weapons from use”….a la Australia

Well, then you deal with less opportunity, and that prob means that NR opportunity goes first.

 

[Mojave]

A friend of mine is a lawyer in Kentucky, he hates the fact that people from Elk Country put in for elk tags in his state.

I know lots of other people from states that have limited drawings on very limited public land. They rely on the their own very limited draw system, other eastern draw and public lands. They hate that non-residents can draw the same tags. I have drawn a non-resident tag in many eastern states many times.

I could give two cans of horse crap where someone lives. I apply for and draw tags in a lot of states and I hunt as much as I can. I am thankful when I draw a tag. I understand the numbers problem when I don't. I still apply.

I also buy OTC tags, military only opportunities, and landowner vouchers when I can or need to.

Growing up in Wyoming and Montana I am tired of hearing about how non-residents are treated. I fully do not care. Even as a current non-resident of what people deem to be hunting Shang-ri-la. Even when I don't draw a tag.

This is the current North American model.

You can apply for draw hunts, hunt areas that are OTC, buy land owner vouchers, not hunt, bitch about not hunting or all of the above.

All these non-Elk State living whiners are welcome to come enjoy our $500,000-700,000 3 bedroom 2 bath houses, property taxes, and booming economies.

We don't want to live in Florida or Ohio. We don't give two craps what you do there, so stop bitching about living there.

 

[Pony Soldier]

I find serious similarity to how the Indians felt as the settlers invaded their hunting grounds. Before that was the warfare between differant tribes in competition over hunting grounds.

There is just as much antimosity between residents over easily accessible hunting grounds and reliable game populations. When you have to start stepping over each other in the field the antimosity increases.

Growing up everyone had self defined hunting grounds. The closest we came to conflict was helping your neighbor load their game into the truck. In the 70s it seemed like every NR that moved to Montana, opened an outfitting business. Instead of focussing on the remote areas that outfitting was originally planned for , these folks drug their NR pigeons into the walkin areas that the locals had access to. The locals could only hunt on the weekends but these unlicensed hunting pimps pounded it every day until a really good day was finding squirrel tracks. The land was hunted to death literally.

Then everyone had to do more and more recon to find a population to hunt. Out of state plates aren't much of an issue until there is nothing left to hunt on the weekends then the invading tribes become the focus. In my country it isn't the NR invasion but the Helena or Bozeman invaders. I don't have much of an issue at this point because I hunt beyond the motorized access. When the population density gets so much that opening day resembles a 4th of july pe-rade, the NR will take the first hit because it's a variable and controlable population.

My father described the early elk seasons after the depression when the game was just starting to recover, as you didn't need a rifle as much as a knife, a tag and running shoes. If you weren't willing to shoot someone to claim your elk, you got to shoot but didn't get to take meat home. Similar stories persisted in the Gardiner area where elk were herded out of Yellowstone across land and back into Yellowstone. The shooting gauntlet stories persisted into the 80s.

As the herds decline and the pressure increases, I see the prices increasing and the tag availability declining - including the resident tags.

 

[Jason Snyder]

I’ve lived and hunted both sides of the coin and neither is immune from selfishness and inability to see another perspective. Yeah, I am a guest in another state. It’s a privilege, and I completely back complete preference towards resident hunters And, I’m paying a pretty penny for the privilege so I don’t think it’s unreasonable to express an opinion.