Why so much emphasis on super fast prone shots?

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

It does amaze me, how with all the practicing and "training" yall do. How little, if any offhand shooting is done. Seems like that would be one of the more important ones to be freshed up on..?

Absolutely it’s something to train up on.

But there is no arguing that more stable positions are going to have a tighter aim so unless it’s a chip shot (which archery distances are) I’m gonna take the more stable position when shooting an animal if it’s available. It’s just the highest probability of hitting where I want and lowest probability of wounding something. It feels the most ethical to me, for me.

Would you ignore a tree next to you to brace your 200yd shot off in favor of purely offhand? Ignore the rock you can kneel behind? I presume no, so why ignore the ground?

Should one who has belly crawled into muzzleloader range of a pronghorn jump up to shoot offhand?

AND to reiterate, YES more positions including offhand should be regularly practiced.

 

[roosiebull]

First common sense would say it’s pretty hard to draw a bow laying on your belly so there’s that.

Sounds like you’re over bowed bro

You should be able to draw your bow from prone, or at least on all fours

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

It turns into a cult when the dumb ass word "Fudd" or stupid ass phrase "Fudd lore" is thrown around by the guys trying something new toward the guys that know what works for them...

I’m with you there.

 

[mtnwrunner]

Let's watch the the totally unnecessary comments. I won't even say please.

Shoot however you want........and the more you practice, the better shooter you will be, in all positions and all scenarios.

I've had to shoot fast many times and the VERY first thing I do is look for a prone shot.
If thats not possible, it's the next most stable position available.

This thread also runs parallel to another recent thread on RS about rear bags. Use whatever you need to......and this also may require you to be fast.

Randy

 

[KurtR]

Exactly. Also why is that the norm and also very successful ,,,yet with a rifle, omg no dont do that.... Dare I toss out the not ethical line




How much offhand rifle shooting have you actually done? I bet it isnt even close to shots off of a bag/sticks/whatnot

I dont know a single person packing shooting sticks. Never met a guy that shot off a tripod either. Where I hunt, inside 200ish yrds. It is going to be an offhand shot if there isnt a tree to lean against. Amazing how many animals hit the ground....

If there was a way for a person to get more stable shooting a bow I would bet they would use it to their advantage. I never said anything about off hand shot being unethical. I don’t care if you Annie Oakley it using a mirror and shoot it looking backwards if your good at it.

Uncle Sam had me do a fair amount of practice off hand. I don’t know how many rabbits and other shit I have killed from a young age off hand when the adults gave us a 4 wheeler and a 22 with a brick of bullets.

I shoot a lot of birds with the shotgun off hand then my dog delivers them to my hand. Never shot the shotgun prone.

 

[butcherboy]

I use whatever is handy at the moment I shoot. Off hand, standing tripod, kneeling tripod, prone, branches, fence posts, rocks, kneeling off hand, sitting. Anything available. My luckiest shot was 300 yds standing off hand at a nice mule deer. Walking rim rock in NM throwing rocks off to get something to move. Saw a buck running in a wash at the bottom coming in from behind me at roughly 800 yds away. Something else spooked him. I threw my rifle up when he got close enough to shoot and shot him through the top of the heart. It was one of those 10% skill and 90% lucky shots.

 

[longrangelead]

I hunt specific terrain planning on going prone as quick as possible. I've found areas of "shallow" broken terrain nobody hunts because at first glance, it looks empty of life.
Antelope and especially mule deer go there to hide once pressured. Because they are on alert, they get up at longer distances, usually having seen me. This is perfect because as soon as I see animals, I quickly go prone and make ready.
This has the effect of keeping the animal(s) stationary longer because they're looking for a walking person no longer there. It's enough time to make a good shot, but not minutes by any means.

Shots ive taken have been 200-550 so going prone is the best way to get as stable as possible in this terrain.

I grew up hunting Blacktail deer in timber and still do. You see a mature buck in the timber, you better act quick or you may never see him again. I've killed a bunch of Blacktails and other critters offhand because the window was seconds.

I've also killed deer and antelope seated supported elbows on knees in tall grass or a hillside where any other position won't get the rifle high enough.

There is no downside to being ready for any position quickly.

Keeping an open mind keeps you creative when the situation arises and you are forced to modify what has previously worked for you.

To take this idea further, what if ever hunter from now on was such an efficient killer when the hunting culminated in a shot, there was only a 1% wound/loss percentage and there were no more shit show hail marys for non hunters to talk about?

 

[Fatcamp]

Our first mule deer hunt my wife missed an opportunity on a really nice buck due to being hesitant getting prone.

Since then I've shot almost all of my animals prone. Never had to be super quick, but urgent for sure on a couple.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Proficient and efficient are not synonymous.

A shooter could very well be proficient (consistently hits what he's trying to hit) if he takes a full minute to set-up, range, dial, adjust, etc. An efficient shooter does all of that faster.

Spot on.

I'm honestly blown away that guys aren't experiencing this stuff first hand in the field. As I shared earlier...timing has very much made a difference on my hunts.

This is the crux of it all for me…. They’d actually have to go in the field, and then try it, but it’s much easier to “argue” about it on the internet and not go actually do it.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

Exactly. Also why is that the norm and also very successful ,,,yet with a rifle, omg no dont do that.... Dare I toss out the not ethical line




How much offhand rifle shooting have you actually done? I bet it isnt even close to shots off of a bag/sticks/whatnot

I dont know a single person packing shooting sticks. Never met a guy that shot off a tripod either. Where I hunt, inside 200ish yrds. It is going to be an offhand shot if there isnt a tree to lean against. Amazing how many animals hit the ground....

Used a dual tripod setup last year on an oryx hunt. Due to the terrain, vegetation, wind and animal behavior it was the only viable option. Two weeks later I used "the claw" on a pronghorn where the terrain, vegetation, and animal behavior made it the only viable shot option.

Lots of options out there and one thing is clear: no shooting position is 100% effective 100% of the time. But a hunter can increase his/her effectiveness by practice others shooting positions.

 

[Still Hunter]

Any practice shooting, in any position is beneficial. I have never shot a game animal from the prone position in my life. I just can't draw and shoot my bow from that position. However, practicing that position with a rifle sure will not hurt, should the occasion arrive. Shoot the way you shoot best. Know your personal capabilities and your rifles capabilities. Stay within them and enjoy your hunt. In reality, for a lot hunters that's less than 100 yards.
Too many "experts" today telling everyone "how" to do it. All they need is a platform, an opinion and a online Forum. Kind of like Rokslide!

 

[WSMHNTR]

I'll admit that I practice far more prone shots off a bipod than free hand but unless its sub 100 yards I'll be shooting off my pack or trying to get prone if possible. I think shooting with an elevated heart rate or under a time constraint to simulate the stress involved is far more important. I would venture to say that a majority of people hunt because they enjoy it not because they'll starve if they don't harvest an animal. I think we owe it to the animal and our own conscience to take the highest percentage shot possible for any given situation.

 

[Coyote Commander]

At the risk of sounding mean, if you haven’t been in a situation where you had to take a hasty shot, from any position, than you haven’t been in many situations.

 

[Coyote Commander]

Called in a pair of coyotes not long ago.

Killed the first, second lit out.

He paused briefly at about 420.

I knew I’d only have a second or two to get on him and make him deceased before he started moving again.


And countless other scenarios.

 

[hibernation]

I think there's a big difference between rushing vs being efficient. I took an elk last year at 200 yards from prone over my pack in a real hurry, the timed drills were helpful. The herd was feeding through a western Oregon clearcut toward the timber right at dawn in a low spot between some shorter rises. I could see them well from my dawn glassing spot 800 yards out, but to get closer quickly while watching the wind, I had to get to a rise just over 200 yds from the herd.

When I finally climbed up and started to see elk again, shooting lanes between all the young doug firs were real limited and they were moving steadily toward thick timber where I knew I'd lose them. One stepped into an open lane and the easiest position was to lay my pack down over all the slash at the crest of the hill, get prone, and get a shot off quickly.

I know 200 isn't a long stretch for most, but for me, the timed practice still made a difference. It wasn't that I was rushing, I just wasn't wasting time. I didn't need to adjust my legs, or move my bag, or take an extra couple breaths. Just tossed the pack over the brush, got on target, and fired before it could take another few steps out of the shooting lane. Bringing a timer into my practice has really helped cut down on the fiddle-f*ing around I used to do before a shot.

 

[WSMHNTR]

At the risk of sounding mean, if you haven’t been in a situation where you had to take a hasty shot, from any position, than you haven’t been in many situations.

That's my point exactly. In my younger days consequences of a botched shot never crossed my mind until after the shot was taken. Best case scenario you miss worst case you wound and never recover the animal. Short of an already wounded animal why would you have to take a hasty shot? Either youre confident in your abilities or you aren’t and thats really what it comes down to.

 

[highcountrymuley]

My buddy, a nonhunter but a shooter went turkey hunting with me. We sat down way too close to the roosted bird, he was right over us but still gobbling so I guess we didn't spook him too badly. I told my friend to get ready to shoot him as soon as he hit the ground cuz he will be in range and we are too close... as soon as bird jumped out of tree my buddy goes from.back-against-tree to jumped forward prone on a steep hillside to try and shoot.... I think I actually laughed out loud. I think k he thought that was the way to do it from watching too many sniper movies.

I have never shot prone at anything in 42 years of hunting. Most shots are kneeling with forend or hand against tree or kneeling/crouched up against a rock. Prone seems most applicable to longer shots than I typically take.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

I have never shot prone at anything in 42 years of hunting.

There is a time and place for everything. Sure, your buddy was showing his inexperience going prone on a wild turkey at close range, but I was taught that you owe it to yourself and the animal to take the highest percentage shot reasonable under the circumstances. There’s a reasonable medium between going prone at under 40 yards and never going prone.

I set up two of my new steel targets specifically for this “coming up over the crest and seeing a deer” scenario. One at roughly 200 yards from the true crest and one at roughly 420 yards.

When I went out for my walk yesterday, I got a good chuckle out of the proximity of grazing deer to my new targets.

This one was fifty yards left of my longer target.

And I immediately ran drills on both these deer practicing shots from as many positions as I could before they ran off.

 

[TaperPin]

The most effective predators sit and watch in some situations and move with purpose through areas that can’t simply be looked at. Same applies to the most effective western hunters. Some animals will be a long way away and moving slowly and some will be under 100 yards and not waiting long before taking off.

The western hunting where animals that are bumped into stand around for a minute while the hunter dilly dallys around getting into position is something I’m not familiar with from the sage foothills, timber, or above timberline. More deer and elk are lost from a lack of ability to shoot quickly than many of the things folks spend too much time on, regardless of position needed.

People should know what their limits are in each position and not choose a slower alternative because of a bias to their favorite. I was still a teenager the first time an animal was lost because of that mistake and it drove home the importance of knowing the fastest way to send a bullet down range for the distance and situation. If you can’t shoot past 350 yards seated, you better be fast at getting prone when a buck has stopped for a few seconds before hopping over the ridge at 400.

 

[Macintosh]

I live in the east where "prone" just isnt a thing. Literally, its for movies and matches and nothing else--it simply doesnt exist in any practical form for hunting here. I practice standing offhand, kneeling unsupported with gun elbow resting on a knee, standing/kneeling supported by a tree or post, standing/kneeling supported on a branch, and sitting supported on a pack or sticks. I practice prone becasue I have used it hunting in the west (several times), and for matches. Fastest field prone shot I ever took was a bull elk at 60 yards prone...I was sitting, and was so jacked that I was noticeably unsteady, so I flopped forward prone and shot him through the heart. Popped up to kneeling and shot him again through his heart when he stopped to look behind him. Probably could have hit him with a rock at that range, but being steady didnt hurt!

IMO most timed drills on anything arent necessarily because that thing happens fast all the time, it is to introduce pressure that causes lapses in ability or process to become more apparent. I time myself not to be fast as much as to make sure I am efficient and can focus on position, breathing, trigger, making sure I dont make stupid ranging or dialing mistakes, etc. It's about grooving-in my process to be smooth and efficient...it just so happens that smooth and efficient also happen to be fast. They also happen to usually be quiet. While it isnt often necessary in my experience to take a prone shot in 20 seconds, the ability to do so never hurts, and will also increase your odds when you do have the time. That's the same regardless of any position imo.