Why I can live with "Cheap" Optics

[tstowater]

Spotters are like my eyes: in good light I can see and read about everything, in poor light I am screwed. Don't buy a good spotter (of any cost) and get cheap and use a POS tripod. Defeated the purpose of having good glass. I would rather buy average glass and a good tripod.

 

[Jon Boy]

I run a fairly cheap middle of the road optics line. Zenray ed3s, minox md50 spotter and a leupold range finder. Got the ed3s for 440 the minox as a demo for 189 and the range finder for 200. They do what I need them to. If I was sheep hunting I would definitely run a different spotter but for the lower 48 it does well.

 

[Matt W.]

I was wrong....

Have you ever written a post and then looked back and realized how much you had changed over a relatively short time period? Or maybe how wrong you were at the time? Well this thread that I started is one of those things... While I still argue a guy can do very well with mid line glass I've come to realize the value of high end glass for specific applications. I upgraded to a Swarovski spotter and its a pretty big difference from my el cheapo Vortex Nomad. I don't have a lot of field time behind the Swaro yet, but I've been impressed thus far. in 2013 I was lucky to take a good Dall Ram. 2 days after my ram my buddy and I spent the better part of a day eying a ram that we just could not be sure on. We knew it was not full curl, but we went back and forth on whether he was double broomed. We spent a lot of time and effort trying find out and in the end he outfoxed us.

Would a quality spotter have made the difference? We debated that, talked with other sheep hunters, and finally concluded that the majority of our conversations and research overwhelming concluded that we needed to upgrade the Nomad. Sheep hunting is a high intensity effort that takes a lot of preparation, resources, and time. Anything that helps you get an edge is worth taking a look at.

Are there good options between the Nomad and the Swaro? You bet, but I was able to go big and don't regret it.

I'm still pretty happy with my binos, but I was wrong on the spotter so who knows what the future will hold...

 

[dotman]

What's funny is we never even disscussed warranty. Hard to beat Vortex when you are hard on stuff, makes life easier knowing no matter what you do they are covered. I think the no fault warranty on my Zeiss only has 2 more years then it defaults to their standard mfg defects.

The old Rocketfish is still in action holding up a razor spotter and working perfectly, my buddy picked up a Slik 624 and they weigh about the same. Overall build quality looks to be simular. I did update the head to the PH111 and that made a huge diff over the ball head.

Did you update your tripod?

 

[Matt W.]

I think the top 4-5 companies have good warranties. Vortex went above and beyond to get a foothold in the market. Pretty good strategy. My binos tend to get beat up. If/when I ever upgrade/replace my current pair I'd take a hard look at Vortex, that's for sure.

That old Slik tripod I bragged up in my original post... Well the head cracked as it was certainly not designed to hold a spotter.. I upgraded to a Promaster XC522 that I got a good deal on with CamerlandNY.
http://www.cameralandny.com/tripods/promaster.pl?page=promasterxc522

Its weighs in right at 2lbs on my scale and I really like how compact it is. Can't swear by it yet, but so far so good..

 

[Becca]

Have you ever written a post and then looked back and realized how much you had changed over a relatively short time period? Or maybe how wrong you were at the time? Well this thread that I started is one of those things...
I'm still pretty happy with my binos, but I was wrong on the spotter so who knows what the future will hold...

Thank you for your honesty, and for the update to this thread. I think all of us are still learning all the time, and new experiences can cause our opinions and perspectives to change. Unfortunately I think this process is sometimes missing from the forum atomsphere, especially once a thread becomes dated. I suspect folks are still searching and reading old threads even if no one has posted in them recently. I rarely see folks update a thread like this to reflect a difference in perspective after much time has past, but it's something I will try to start doing if I feel like it would be valuable. Thanks again for letting us know how your perspective has evolved...

 

[WRO]

Have you ever written a post and then looked back and realized how much you had changed over a relatively short time period? Or maybe how wrong you were at the time? Well this thread that I started is one of those things... While I still argue a guy can do very well with mid line glass I've come to realize the value of high end glass for specific applications. I upgraded to a Swarovski spotter and its a pretty big difference from my el cheapo Vortex Nomad. I don't have a lot of field time behind the Swaro yet, but I've been impressed thus far. in 2013 I was lucky to take a good Dall Ram. 2 days after my ram my buddy and I spent the better part of a day eying a ram that we just could not be sure on. We knew it was not full curl, but we went back and forth on whether he was double broomed. We spent a lot of time and effort trying find out and in the end he outfoxed us.

Would a quality spotter have made the difference? We debated that, talked with other sheep hunters, and finally concluded that the majority of our conversations and research overwhelming concluded that we needed to upgrade the Nomad. Sheep hunting is a high intensity effort that takes a lot of preparation, resources, and time. Anything that helps you get an edge is worth taking a look at.

Are there good options between the Nomad and the Swaro? You bet, but I was able to go big and don't regret it.

I'm still pretty happy with my binos, but I was wrong on the spotter so who knows what the future will hold...

It starts with a spotter or good set of binos, then you end up realizing how much your other pieces are lacking and before you know it you have 10K in optics..

 

[JP100]

cool to see change in opinion.
With my first rifle I went brave and spent over $1000 on my first scope. It was a huge decision for me at 16 years old haha. 6 years later I love that scope. best purchase I have made. Shot many animals with it that I would never have seen let alone been able to shoot at.
Only just bought a spotting scope now because I could not afford one worth buying up untill now so have just gone with out. Probably not the best choice but my I just use my rifle scope as my spotter haha.

 

[Cross]

Jp100,

Makes sense to me out of all 3 things mentioned in this thread I would say a quality scope is by far the best investment and choice.
The others can be added later; can't shoot them if you can't seem them.

 

[Matt W.]

cool to see change in opinion.
With my first rifle I went brave and spent over $1000 on my first scope. It was a huge decision for me at 16 years old haha. 6 years later I love that scope. best purchase I have made. Shot many animals with it that I would never have seen let alone been able to shoot at.
Only just bought a spotting scope now because I could not afford one worth buying up untill now so have just gone with out. Probably not the best choice but my I just use my rifle scope as my spotter haha.

I don't mean to call you out, but one of my biggest pet peeves is using the rifle scope as a spotter. I have been trained to NEVER point my rifle at something I don't intend to kill. I use my binos when things are close and my spotter when things are far away.

I hunt where I am looking at objects at quite a distance. There could be hunters in that area. I would never use a rifle scope for that purpose.

Jp100,

Makes sense to me out of all 3 things mentioned in this thread I would say a quality scope is by far the best investment and choice.
The others can be added later; can't shoot them if you can't seem them.

There are plenty of good rifle scopes in the $300-$500 range. You don't need high dollar rifle scopes unless you are shooting in low light or long range. (IMO) However, I'd rather go iron sights than not have a good spotter / binos. Good glass saves me a TON of time and validates the effort it takes to get on a target.

 

[Hardstalk]

The irony I see in this, surpasses most peoples views im sure. The old saying "buy what you can afford, then sell it and buy the best there is" has always rang true to me. Regardless if its hunting equipment or a sink for my bathroom.

To the op you were very level headed in your original post and stayed flexible thru all the comments and I honor that!

On another note if we look at alot of gear reviews as a whole. (Especially internet reviews) where joe schmoe fires up on the "what bino should I get" thread about how badass his 10 year old nikons are and everything else is garbage, he has talked ten people into the nikons and they all swear there the best!! (Not hating any company here just using a name) its rather clear to see that joe schmoe has an emotional attachment to an object because he spent hard earned money to buy them and will literally fight to prove his case before admitting "maybe my stuff isnt the best, or greatest fit for this hunter?"

I see this on a daily basis and this thread may help a few guys notice it as well, on rokslide everyone is pretty cool about staying open minded to new products and willing to listen, learn and so on. But when it comes to anything gear related weather it be a kifaru pack or a jansport, take most "reviews" or feed back with a grain of salt. And dont suggest something is ever the best bar none, no questions. Im not implying this thread has done that by any means but it has highlighted a few things we can all learn from. Ex. The budget spotter that didnt hold up and so on.

I hope this reply does not hit anyone the wrong way but in my opinion there is alot to learn from this thread.

 

[JP100]

I don't mean to call you out, but one of my biggest pet peeves is using the rifle scope as a spotter. I have been trained to NEVER point my rifle at something I don't intend to kill. I use my binos when things are close and my spotter when things are far away.

I hunt where I am looking at objects at quite a distance. There could be hunters in that area. I would never use a rifle scope for that purpose.

Fair enough call there. I use my binos for identifying animals. Im never just looking around through my scope trying to spot animals. only to confirm trophy quality if need be.
most of my hunting is on large private properties (60 000 acres) and there are not other people around.

There are plenty of good rifle scopes in the $300-$500 range. You don't need high dollar rifle scopes unless you are shooting in low light or long range. (IMO) However, I'd rather go iron sights than not have a good spotter / binos. Good glass saves me a TON of time and validates the effort it takes to get on a target.

[/QUOTE]

I do shoot long range and low light with that gun and also alot of night shooting with a spotlight so I do get the best out of it. Im also shooting alot of game in these conditions. We might shoot 50-100 wallabies in one night of spotlighting and 20-30 goats in one days hunting. I dont just trophy hunt so a spotter isnt of any use for 70-80% of my hunting.. And also I live in NZ where we pay twice what most other countires pay for scopes/guns ect.. My scope is a $700 scope but I had the joy of paying twice that. got to love importers.

 

[Matt W.]

I understand where you are coming from. Definitely a different way of hunting. Ug on the importers.. No way around that by buying in the US and paying the S&H?

 

[JP100]

I understand where you are coming from. Definitely a different way of hunting. Ug on the importers.. No way around that by buying in the US and paying the S&H?

Yea its a different style of things over here for most people. Yea prices here suck. I am in the process of getting a Vortex spotter that I bought on optics planet and got shipped to mates place in the US then hes sending it here. the the cheapest option. If it works out well I will be ordering alot of stuff haha. At customs they can chuck extra tax and bullshit fees on gear if importers have exclusive import rights.

 

[Backpack Hunter]

Not sure how I missed this thread originally but it seems my opinion has changed right along with yours.
For years I got by (maybe even did pretty well) with mid level optics. Slowly but surely I have been seeing the benefits to the higher end glass.

 

[Shrek]

I got hooked on quality glass back around 2003 ? I had Leopold Vari x III 's on my rifles back then when I got a Zeiss in a trade of my camper. Put it on my backup rifle and took them both to the range to sight in and practice a little. Right there at the range I swapped it to my main rifle and have never looked back. Compared to the Zeiss the Leopold was dingy yellow and just not sharp. I've got swarovski and zeiss on anything I care about and since I have started to hunt out west there will be alpha binoculars for my next trip.

 

[Andy Dana]

I have to....just can't afford it...I ain't ashamed just the way it is......we do just fine regardless. If I could it would be the best. If you can why wouldn't you?

 

[luke moffat]

There are plenty of good rifle scopes in the $300-$500 range. You don't need high dollar rifle scopes unless you are shooting in low light or long range. (IMO) However, I'd rather go iron sights than not have a good spotter / binos. Good glass saves me a TON of time and validates the effort it takes to get on a target.

I agree with this for sure...I don't' really shoot long range or low light so VX-2s are fine for my style of hunting. I spend my money most on spotter, then on binos, then on riflescope in that order. I'd rock iron sights as well before I went without binos.

 

[tstowater]

I had forgotten about this thread, but it is an oldie but goodie. I need to look at it periodically to see if I need to make any changes. I did pick up a pair of Vortex Viper HD 10x42's the other day for my son. We haven't had much time to play with them, but the glass seems quite good for the price and the spectacular warranty. For a 15 year old, they are more than "good enough". They should last him until he wants something different. I have an extra spotter for him to use also.

The discussion about rifle scopes has peaked my interest. I have been a Leupold person for years as I am not a long range shooter and the light gathering has been more than sufficient for my use. I will be getting a new rifle for hunting applications and will be looking at different scopes.