Which Arrow Build?

[nwcurt]

Got 3 builds I'm considering. 2, really, since one is my existing set. My current setup is tough as nails, but absurdly low FOC and I see it on longer shots. My goal is to get really close to 500 grains total arrow. I'm shooting 30" arrows. 30.5" draw length. 72 pound draw. Here are my options:

1. Easton Axis 300s. Once everything is on there they spec out to 480-495 depending on which nock/fletching I go with and only 6-8% FOC.

2. Black Eagle Rampage 300s. With everything they're 475-490 and FOC gets up to 12-14%. A little worried about being underspined according to the BE spine chart, though.

3. Easton Hexx 260s. Withe everything they're 485-500. FOC 11-13%. Should be plenty stiff.

I've only ever used Axis, so not really familiar with the other arrows. I'm just going by specs. Got some time to build with all the lockdowns, so looking for what to order.

Any advice is appreciated. Thanks!

 

[freedomhunter25]

are you running the hit inerts in the axis????try bumping those up ans using 125s ???

 

[Don Qui Puncher]

I’d put more weight up front on the axis if your looking for a specific weight, they have been extremely durable for myself and many others, I haven’t tried the others but you can’t go wrong with the axis

 

[nwcurt]

That was my plan, but getting the Axis up makes it super heavy. It's gets slow and the punch actually starts going down. I'm already near my goal arrow weight with just the light aluminum HIT. Adding something like Iron Will Collars gets me a little heavier than I want to be and barely nudges my FOC. Like 1-2% or so.

It really is too bad. I love the Axis - it's been super tough for me. So durable. But as I get all other parts of my bow and shooting dialed in the arrows are proving to be a weakness. Great at short distances still. That low FOC just starts to show after 40 or so.

 

[Boxerboxer]

That was my plan, but getting the Axis up makes it super heavy. It's gets slow and the punch actually starts going down. I'm already near my goal arrow weight with just the light aluminum HIT. Adding something like Iron Will Collars gets me a little heavier than I want to be and barely nudges my FOC. Like 1-2% or so.

It really is too bad. I love the Axis - it's been super tough for me. So durable. But as I get all other parts of my bow and shooting dialed in the arrows are proving to be a weakness. Great at short distances still. That low FOC just starts to show after 40 or so.

What do you mean by "punch actually starts going down"?

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[nwcurt]

There's a point where the weight gets the speed down enough that kinetic energy actually starts to reverse. I know kinetic energy isn't everything and misses some effects in the real world, but seeing it go down probably isn't the right direction to be going. For my setup that happens around 530 grains or so.

 

[Piscatory_4]

I had full pass through on elk at 55yds with 420g arrow and about 12-15% foc with about 65lb draw weight and 28"of carbon and it broke a rib. Are you using a light broadhead or extra weight at the rear of shaft?

 

[nwcurt]

I had full pass through on elk at 55yds with 420g arrow and about 12-15% foc with about 65lb draw weight and 28"of carbon. Are you useing a light broadhead or extra weight at the rear of shaft?

I'm confident in its ability to do the job - it's a beefy setup. I just want a little more accuracy that comes with a bit better FOC. Not looking for extreme or anything like that - it's just that 7-8% is low by almost any definition as far as I can tell.

Nothing special on front or back. Basic HIT. 100 grain head. I do wrap under my fletching, but it's short and only 4.5 grains. I'd prefer to stay at 100 grain heads. More options in broadheads.

 

[Boxerboxer]

There's a point where the weight gets the speed down enough that kinetic energy actually starts to reverse. I know kinetic energy isn't everything and misses some effects in the real world, but seeing it go down probably isn't the right direction to be going. For my setup that happens around 530 grains or so.

There's no tipping point, that's true no matter where you are because in the equation velocity is squared and mass isn't. The good news is momentum goes up, and so does the efficiency of your bow in transferring stored energy to the arrow. Diminishing returns come via trajectory more than anything IMO.

Edit: I'm probably wrong about the no tipping point thing now that I think about it. Everything else I stand by.

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[nwcurt]

There's no tipping point, that's true no matter where you are because in the equation velocity is squared and mass isn't. The good news is momentum goes up, and so does the efficiency of your bow in transferring stored energy to the arrow. Diminishing returns come via trajectory more than anything IMO.

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This is helpful. Good point on trajectory - another reason to keep my overall weight down to a reasonable number. A little more room for error with a flatter arrow. My speeds from 470 to 500 all calculate within 10-20 fps, though, so not a huge deal. That gets quite a bit more when I get up into the 540+ range.

 

[Boxerboxer]

This is helpful. Good point on trajectory - another reason to keep my overall weight down to a reasonable number. A little more room for error with a flatter arrow. My speeds from 470 to 500 all calculate within 10-20 fps, though, so not a huge deal. That gets quite a bit more when I get up into the 540+ range.

I edited my post because I'm probably wrong about there not being a tipping point. I'll go research and see what I find.

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[Marble]

If you put the 50 grain inserts in the 300 spine, you would only really be adding 34 grains to the arrow. The HIT inserts are 16 grains. It will have very little effect on your speed and trajectory. I went from 460 to 510 and it was barely noticable. Just my experience.

 

[nwcurt]

If you put the 50 grain inserts in the 300 spine, you would only really be adding 34 grains to the arrow. The HIT inserts are 16 grains. It will have very little effect on your speed and trajectory. I went from 460 to 510 and it was barely noticable. Just my experience.

You are correct - and your setup sounds pretty similar - but that also won't boost my FOC by much at all. Maybe get me from 7% to 9%??

 

[Rob5589]

#3, or shorten a .300 and work up a different formula.

 

[nwcurt]

#3, or shorten a .300 and work up a different formula.

That's what I've been thinking. I like that it's a little stiffer, too. Just not sure about durability. I really like how tough the Axis has been for me. Also prefer the 5mm to the 6mm, but I can give that up I have to.

 

[HoytHntr4]

If you are worried about being under spinned with the 300 Rampage, you could drop down to a rampage 250. The rampage 250 and axis 300 are both 10.7 GPI. Not sure if you were looking at their F.O.C. system (100 gns) or their half outs (51 gns) but you can play with the 30,50,& 75 gn screw in weights to really dial in how you like it

 

[Rob5589]

That's what I've been thinking. I like that it's a little stiffer, too. Just not sure about durability. I really like how tough the Axis has been for me. Also prefer the 5mm to the 6mm, but I can give that up I have to.

Shorter arrow in same diameter can handle more weight up front. If a higher foc is your goal.

 

[nwcurt]

Shorter arrow in same diameter can handle more weight up front. If a higher foc is your goal.

I'm already getting my broadheads a little further back than I like. I'd prefer them to clear the riser. Right now they're about even with the riser. Much shorter and they'll back into my rest.

 

[Marble]

You are correct - and your setup sounds pretty similar - but that also won't boost my FOC by much at all. Maybe get me from 7% to 9%??

You're gonna have 150 up front, with 500 to 515 total arrow weight. The arrow will be more accurate than I could shoot it and will have a tom of momentum, energy etc.

I cant tell you exactly what your FOC will be, but you'll have an arrow that can run right through any animal in North America.

I did the same thing with 340s and 200 up front, but because of inexperience I failed to understand how the extra weight affects spine. They shot great at longer distances but up close weren't as good.

So i plan to shoot the same setup as you, except with 125 grain heads. Should be 515 give or take a bit.

 

[Boxerboxer]

As far as spine goes I'd be happy to check your intended setup in Archer's Advantage and see what it thinks.

When it comes to weight, IMO you could probably add at least 100 grains to your setup before you come even close to too slow, unless you're shooting a really old bow.

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