What's accurate enough?

[jesco88]

I'm just wondering at what point do you call it good enough when doing load dev?
And why the hell do people keep doing OCW tests with 3 round groups?

For me, maybe I'm wrong here... but if its sub MOA with a 10round group at 100ish-150yards, I call it good enough.

 

[Grizzle]

Listen to form friday ep.4 he explains this using the wez calculator.

One of the next ones covers mv es and sd with the wez. Both well worth the listen.

 

[Snowwolfe]

For a scoped big game hunting rifle, if it shoots 3 shots under 1.5 inches at 100 yards I'll call it good. Iron sights, 2 inches.
I expect a rimfire used for hunting small game to shoot 1/2 inch or better at 50 yards. Rifle used for varmint hunting would like to see 1/2 inch at 100. Would be Ok with up to 3/4 inch for coyote or wolf.
I don't see any point at shooting groups larger than 3 shots. If I aint killed it with 3 shots then I'm pretty well screwed as it is.

 

[jesco88]

For a scoped big game hunting rifle, if it shoots 3 shots under 1.5 inches at 100 yards I'll call it good. Iron sights, 2 inches.
I expect a rimfire used for hunting small game to shoot 1/2 inch or better at 50 yards. Rifle used for varmint hunting would like to see 1/2 inch at 100. Would be Ok with up to 3/4 inch for coyote or wolf.
I don't see any point at shooting groups larger than 3 shots. If I aint killed it with 3 shots then I'm pretty well screwed as it is.

With all due respect, there are numerous sources out there that call out why the 3-shot group is worthless. This is not a matter of your personal abilities, it's to point out that 3 shots are statistically irrelevant.

I got tired of doing OCW tests with 5 rounds per 0.5gr increments about 3 years ago when I would find a "good" 5-round group (say, sub-MOA) then the next day I load 50-100 rounds, go to the range with that same gun and system and find that actually it was closer to 1.5-2 MOA.

In other words, if you throw enough darts at a bullseye, eventually you might land 3 in a row on the bullseye. That doesn't mean that you're good at darts, that just means you threw a lot of darts.

EDIT:
I guess my intent on creating the post was to find out what others do when doing load development. ie at what point do you think its accurate enough and stop futzing around with load dev? I think Grizzle's link to that episode sums it up nicely for me. Trying to get sub-MOA (10round groups) from every gun you hunt with really is a waste of time and resources. I still feel a sense of confidence when I take a rifle out that I know shoots well, so at least I know that it's just my autism that drives me to find a recipe that puts 10 rounds under an inch. I don't think I'm ready to face reality from a 20-round group yet.

 

[Snowwolfe]

Not concerned what the other "sources" say. Three shots is plenty for me. And what is even more important is where the first shot hits from a cold barrel.
I aint here to punch holes in targets. I shoot to kill critters.
I'm almost 73 and never shot an animal beyond 300 yards so 1.5 inches at 100 yards tells me all I need to know.

 

[stevevan]

Not concerned what the other "sources" say. Three shots is plenty for me. And what is even more important is where the first shot hits from a cold barrel.
I aint here to punch holes in targets. I shoot to kill critters.
I'm almost 73 and never shot an animal beyond 300 yards so 1.5 inches at 100 yards tells me all I need to know.

All my rifles are used for some sort of hunting. Out of practicality 3 shots is plenty with the first one being the most important. Inch group with velocity that I like is a go. If it prints < MOA then that's a bonus. Too, with the cost of ammo and reloading components at todays prices that factors in, If I want just to shoot or practice then that's where the rimfire comes in.

 

[jesco88]

Not concerned what the other "sources" say. Three shots is plenty for me. And what is even more important is where the first shot hits from a cold barrel.
I aint here to punch holes in targets. I shoot to kill critters.
I'm almost 73 and never shot an animal beyond 300 yards so 1.5 inches at 100 yards tells me all I need to know.

Heard. I won't try to change your mind, Sir. At 300 yards, I don't think you need to be worried about accuracy, just go zero your musket and let em have it!

 

[hoooogan]

Are you guys sending 10 rounds at a time for your 10 shot groups?

No way in hell am I going to send 10 rounds of 7mm Rem Mag down my hunting rifle. But I'll do multiple 4-5 shot groups from cold bore. I just don't stack them in the same spot. Is that what you guys are doing?

 

[RyanT26]

Are you guys sending 10 rounds at a time for your 10 shot groups?

No way in hell am I going to send 10 rounds of 7mm Rem Mag down my hunting rifle. But I'll do multiple 4-5 shot groups from cold bore. I just don't stack them in the same spot. Is that what you guys are doing?

Speaking only for myself, yes. Prone with rear bag single feed ten rounds at a single target.

 

[nm.otter]

3-5 rounds is enough to know that it sucks.

Takes 20+ to get a good zero and to know what the cone of fire actually looks like.

 

[BCsteve]

Are you guys sending 10 rounds at a time for your 10 shot groups?

No way in hell am I going to send 10 rounds of 7mm Rem Mag down my hunting rifle. But I'll do multiple 4-5 shot groups from cold bore. I just don't stack them in the same spot. Is that what you guys are doing?

Sure, do that but shoot your two 5 shot groups at the same point of aim. Or use identical targets and superimpose them for your 10 shot group.

 

[streamerfish]

10 rounds sub moa at 100 yards is plenty good enough, for a standard off the shelf hunting rifle, I would say that's actually very good. Probably even great.

I'm hoping to get that out of my new rifle...(start testing this coming weekend).

Real world, for a hunting gun at moderate distances, anything that's legit 2moa or under and your good to go, probably even legit 3moa or under. I would prefer to be under 1.5moa.

I'm hoping for around 1moa or less as I am looking at maybe doing some NRL hunter type stuff.

If I'm getting 1.25 or bigger 10 shot groups, I'm gonna do a little experimenting to see if it will do better. But i would be fine with the initial as long as its under 1.5moa. If its around 1moa or better I'm not touching it.

 

[mt100gr.]

Are you guys sending 10 rounds at a time for your 10 shot groups?

No way in hell am I going to send 10 rounds of 7mm Rem Mag down my hunting rifle. But I'll do multiple 4-5 shot groups from cold bore. I just don't stack them in the same spot. Is that what you guys are doing?

I don't shoot 10 round strings but I will shoot 10/15/20 round groups at the same point of aim when I am vetting a rifle. A composite group, I suppose.

I see this as also testing the repeatability of me getting into the rifle and executing the shot. Breaking and rebuilding the shooting position is practice, too.