What sidearm do you carry in lower 48 grizz country ??

[JCS271]

Sig p220 elite 10mm with decocker. Carry one in the chamber and then 8 in the stack. I don’t need a larger magazine then that because the bears going to be on you before you get 9 rounds off. Buffalo bore hard cast alternating with woodcutter bullets. The Buffalo bores are 200gr I believe and the woodcutters are 180gr. Gunslingers chest harness. I carry to keep the bears honest.

What the heck is a "woodcutter bullet" and why would you alternate anything with Buffalo Bore hardcasts if you are anticipating trouble with a bear?

 

[Karlburns]

Sorry woodsman not woodcutter. Here’s a link to their bullets.

https://g9defense.com/g9-10mm-145-gr-woodsman/

They were shown to me by a guide up here in AK. They were only sold at one gun shop that I knew of and they went out of business. Luckily because no one sells them up here the business agreed to send me the bullet tips to load myself.

The theory behind alternating them is the same theory we use with shotguns in AK. You alternate your bullets to maximize potential of putting a large angry bear down. Bird shot to blind it, slug to slow it down and create a hole, 00 to just wreck its internals through said hole.

Others just load a shotgun with all slugs.

 

[BugleMeTimber]

S&W 629 44 Mag 5" barrel. 305 grain hard cast.

 

[Idaho4x4Bronco]

FNX with the 460 Rowland conversion shooting 250gr hard cast. Razco bino harness holster

I had never heard of this until now. Oh my, what have you done to my wallet....

 

[medvedyt]

Sorry woodsman not woodcutter. Here’s a link to their bullets.

https://g9defense.com/g9-10mm-145-gr-woodsman/

They were shown to me by a guide up here in AK. They were only sold at one gun shop that I knew of and they went out of business. Luckily because no one sells them up here the business agreed to send me the bullet tips to load myself.

The theory behind alternating them is the same theory we use with shotguns in AK. You alternate your bullets to maximize potential of putting a large angry bear down. Bird shot to blind it, slug to slow it down and create a hole, 00 to just wreck its internals through said hole.

Others just load a shotgun with all slugs.

i ve heard that theory but you do not want to make madder a bear that is already angry. all the departments over here in the yukon use one kind the slugs and as an individual im using the same kind, and it is for me the brenneke.

 

[Karlburns]

i ve heard that theory but you do not want to make madder a bear that is already angry. all the departments over here in the yukon use one kind the slugs and as an individual im using the same kind, and it is for me the brenneke.

It’s not about making the bear madder it’s about increasing your survival odds. Yes shooting a bear in the face with bird shot is going to make it a lot madder but when you do run in to a bear who intends to attack, most individuals aim is going to be terrible. Bird shot gives you a wide spray to give you an opportunity for a second shot to slow or potentially put it down depending on the size. A blind bear will have a significantly harder time hitting you.

If you’re rock steady and have challenged many bears to dance contests then I would agree bird shot as your first bullet is probably not needed.

 

[medvedyt]

It’s not about making the bear madder it’s about increasing your survival odds. Yes shooting a bear in the face with bird shot is going to make it a lot madder but when you do run in to a bear who intends to attack, most individuals aim is going to be terrible. Bird shot gives you a wide spray to give you an opportunity for a second shot to slow or potentially put it down depending on the size. A blind bear will have a significantly harder time hitting you.

If you’re rock steady and have challenged many bears to dance contests then I would agree bird shot as your first bullet is probably not needed.

sometimes you do not have the luxury of a second shot with a charging bear but your experience may vary.

 

[MattB]

Sorry woodsman not woodcutter. Here’s a link to their bullets.

https://g9defense.com/g9-10mm-145-gr-woodsman/

They were shown to me by a guide up here in AK. They were only sold at one gun shop that I knew of and they went out of business. Luckily because no one sells them up here the business agreed to send me the bullet tips to load myself.

The theory behind alternating them is the same theory we use with shotguns in AK. You alternate your bullets to maximize potential of putting a large angry bear down. Bird shot to blind it, slug to slow it down and create a hole, 00 to just wreck its internals through said hole.

Others just load a shotgun with all slugs.

That theory may make sense with a shotgun when alternating slugs and buck shot, but what you are doing is akin to alternating different kinds of slugs. I can't see how that strategy would provide any demonstrable benefit. One type of slug will penetrate the deepest and would be the best choice. Same goes with 10mm ammo.

 

[Brianc]

Slow person


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Karlburns]

That theory may make sense with a shotgun when alternating slugs and buck shot, but what you are doing is akin to alternating different kinds of slugs. I can't see how that strategy would provide any demonstrable benefit. One type of slug will penetrate the deepest and would be the best choice. Same goes with 10mm ammo.

I agree one type likely is the best in the 10mm scenario but I haven’t had to use it on a bear to find out which of the two would perform better. Hopefully I never have to try and figure that out.

With what they quote on those woodsman in theory they are a vastly better bullet. I don’t know that I 100% believe that which is why I alternate with the Buffalo bore hard cast. In the event they are correct though about the woodsman it’s a vastly superior bullet to the Buffalo bore. Again, I hope to never find out.

 

[Yoder]

Do any of you regularly practice drawing and getting off a shot as quickly as possible on target? If you don't it's pretty eye opening when you see how slow you actually are and how hard it is to get on target fast. How about 6 rounds as fast as you can accurately hit a pie plate at 5-10 yards? If you don't practice a lot, it's going to be ugly when you need it. I used to practice this a few times a week for competitions and still missed shots. I can't imagine the stress of a Grizzly running at you compared to some stupid pistol game.

 

[WTNUT]

If you use the search feature. You’ll find a million threads on this…

What fun would there be in that …..


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[mcseal2]

I'm not a guide or outfitter.

In Alaska I carry a 10mm. Last trip it was a Sig 220 Hunter with Underwood 200gr Hardcast. Razco chest holster and a TLR-1HL light. I've carried others but this one has been the most reliable with hardcast ammo. The newer Buffalo Bore 190gr Dangerous game ammo has worked in everything I've tried it in, A buddy carries my old Glock with that ammo.

In the lower 48 I go lighter. Fishing where anything 4 legged is a remote threat I carry my Sig 365XL. My primary reason is it's easy to take down and clean the sand out of after a trip to the river, and easy to carry in the kydex holster I have it snaps into.

Any western trips when I'm not packing a rifle, I carry a 357 revolver. I have a 3" S&W 60 with Crimson Trace laser grips and 158gr JSP ammo I carry a lot. If I want a little bigger gun I have a 6" 386XL Hunter I like a lot. It has a 6" barrel and 7 shot cylinder but only weighs a little more than the 5 shot steel gun. It shoots 158gr JHP or JSP to the same point of aim as it does HSM 180gr hardcast.

Biggest reason I choose a 10mm in Alaska is the ability to have the light on the rail. I have tried a couple 44 magnums, a Ruger 5.5" Redhawk and a 4" S&W 69. The recoil of even the lighter Buffalo Bore 255gr hardcast is more than I handle well. The 10mm/357 level of recoil is about all I can handle well without flinching. I can practice a lot with those with no issues. I chose to give up some power for accuracy in my hands.

 

[mcseal2]

Do any of you regularly practice drawing and getting off a shot as quickly as possible on target? If you don't it's pretty eye opening when you see how slow you actually are and how hard it is to get on target fast. How about 6 rounds as fast as you can accurately hit a pie plate at 5-10 yards? If you don't practice a lot, it's going to be ugly when you need it. I used to practice this a few times a week for competitions and still missed shots. I can't imagine the stress of a Grizzly running at you compared to some stupid pistol game.

I agree and do practice a lot before a trip especially to Alaska. I think practicing with my pistols improves my trigger control and carries over to my rifle shooting too. With 9mm ammo being so much cheaper than most centerfire rifle ammo it makes a difference. I have a Sig 226 Legion SAO with a 22LR and 9mm slide that is set up just like my 220 in 10mm. I practice with it early, then switch to the more expensive 10mm as the trip gets closer. I like to shoot and have a 100yd range in my yard, this gives my practice direction before hunts.

Will it help if I'm actually under the stress of a charging bear? I hope I never find out.

 

[Moss]

Be specific !
What sidearm do you carry in the lower 48 grizz country?
Ammo or load used?
What holster?

Are you a guide, outfitter or camp hand?

I am not a guide. I am not an outfitter. I do like to go places and see things in nature that tourists don't often see.

I recently carried a Springfield XD-M Elite 10mm compact with 15 rounds of Underwood 200gr hardcast into an area known for very high grizzly activity in Montana.

I was in this area on Monday and Friday of the last week in August. In this same basin, an angler killed an adult male grizzly that charged him and a companion on the Wednesday between my two visits. To be clear, I did not leave the roadside having known of the activity prior to making my first trip there. I spent my time behind my BTX watching, photographing and videoing the many, many bears that showed themselves each morning and evening.

I have a DME holster made to fit including my light/laser combo. I also have a Eberlestock bino pack that has a carry conceal pouch behind the bino pouch. The front opening bino pouch stays out of the way if drawing is necessary.

I sold a S&W 460V before buying the 10mm because the 460 is to heavy to carry around camp in my opinion. The 10mm compact is always at my side or on my chest.

We also had bear spray in our party of 4 along with an identical 10mm. My sale of the 460 bought 2 of the 10mm setups. >Moss

 

[Stray Horse]

Glock 20

 

[Karlburns]

Ever shot a shotgun with birdshot in it at close range? There is no wide spray of shot. It stays pretty tight

It has a much wider spray than a slug or 00. I use shotgun for ptarmigan and grouse regularly at 10 yards or so. I’m also not saying you should wait until the bear is at the end of the barrel before you shoot. If I’m in thick brush like I was this weekend and was packing a shotgun instead of my 45-70, I would have loaded it with pure slugs because the bear would have been 10 feet at best before I saw it. When I was up on the hillside above the brush I’d have put a bird shot in because I could have easily gotten that off when a bear was 40ish yards out. Load outs are situational depending on where I am hunting.

I will also say this. Regardless of what you are packing if you are down to your sidearm you are already at a significant disadvantage against a large pissed off bear. The best backup is your hunting partners pistol and rifle which is why you should be checking what they are packing.

 

[3Esski]

psa dagger 9mm. used to haul a ruger super redhawk around but figure more, and more accurate rounds were the better option for me.

 

[Yoder]

I agree and do practice a lot before a trip especially to Alaska. I think practicing with my pistols improves my trigger control and carries over to my rifle shooting too. With 9mm ammo being so much cheaper than most centerfire rifle ammo it makes a difference. I have a Sig 226 Legion SAO with a 22LR and 9mm slide that is set up just like my 220 in 10mm. I practice with it early, then switch to the more expensive 10mm as the trip gets closer. I like to shoot and have a 100yd range in my yard, this gives my practice direction before hunts.

Will it help if I'm actually under the stress of a charging bear? I hope I never find out.

A shot timer always helped me. Set it on random start. It's a little bit of self induced pressure. It's also great to see if you're actually getting faster.

 

[Wildhorse]

7.5" ruger super redhawk 340gr. Solid cast bear loads in a guides choice chest holster started to carry this after a couple run ins with bear while fly fishing in western Montana it also works well for me when on horseback and when in camp I'm no guide just a guy in the woods