Vortex Razor HD LHT 4.5-22x50mm Q&A

[Brandon.miller.4]

The majority of once a year hunters want "ultra clear glass" and "low light performance."

Yes. It is unfortunate

 

[HighUintas]

Makes me just want to install a vernier and globe sight

 

[SDHNTR]

The majority of once a year hunters want "ultra clear glass" and "low light performance."

I want that too. But I want that AND dead nutz reliability!

 

[Ucsdryder]

I want that too. But I want that AND dead nutz reliability!

Don’t forget zero stop and locking elevation turret, oh and sub 20 ounces. Sounds like we’re asking for a vehicle that does 0-60 in 3 seconds, can tow 10,0000 pounds, and has room for 8.

Missed the biggest buck of my life due to a spun turret.

 

[roosiebull]

Of course they can (and will)…I can see it now: “Torque wrench not calibrated; over-torqued”

haha, i was going to say the same thing until i read this reply... i doubt they will ever run out of excuses. i would love, to see this scope do well personally, on paper, it's an attractive optic, but Form's test just seems to solidify their history of not being a very reliable scope. i was about to buy one awhile back until i started looking into them... i really wish they were a reliable scope.

looking at how scratched up and dinged up my rifle is from 2 seasons, i don't think it's a good candidate for a vortex. without any really obvious hard impacts, the leupold i had on there lost zero pretty bad 2 times that i can recall off hand in a fairly short time frame, so i would expect similar results with similar reputations for poor durability.

seems like anytime i bring my stuff inside from hunting or shooting, my dogs will knock my rifle over on the bipod on the hard floor, haha... that's probably happened 50 times conservatively.... i'm not more careful with that because if that causes a loss of zero, it will never survive me hunting with it....

the leupold will be fine for my rat rifle, and i'm glad i didn't get the vortex or i'd have to buy another rat rifle, haha. a sample of one doesn't mean a whole bunch, but it has more meaning when the sample of one testing verifies it's inherent reputation.... when it does exactly as you would expect.... that can be good or bad depending on the reputation of the scope being tested.

i think the tests are great, and everyone can take away whatever they want from them..... i just hope people can act like grown ups enough to not cry if their scope doesn't do well..... it's non bias testing with as many variables as possible controlled, and standardized.... what more could people ask?

 

[Axlrod]

These tests need to get out to everyday guys that make up the majority of the consumers for these products. I can't begin to tell you how many people I have talked to, hard core hunters, guides, shooters, Etc. That have never even considered drop tests or other ways of evaluating scopes. They use gear until it breaks and then buy something else without putting much care or thought into it. I think it's a basic situation of awareness to the issue.

There has got to be someone with more online credibility or a larger audience that can share this information to the giants such as YouTube and Facebook to reach more of the consumers and hopefully make an impact. Like it or not the people reading, and actually believing these tests is a small group (me being part of that group). But coming from an outside perspective I too was quite skeptical at first. Seeing is believing. And I think if we could get these videos to be shared in a methodical and consistent way by someone who has a significant following it could actually spark some change from scope manufacturers and get the regular guy to question things more.

Maybe this is wishful thinking, but you never know.

Never going to happen. A few years ago Alex Wheeler was doing scope tests with competition scopes over on Accurate shooter. Using a scope checker- It holds 2 scopes including a mechanically frozen scope as the control. A large caliber handgun was fired next to the 2 scopes and the results noted. As I recall very few scopes held perfect POA, including some NF comps. Alex repeatedly said to check your own scope and send it back, if it wasn't holding zero. And that just because one particular scope he tested was bad didn't mean all of that model would be. He quit posting his results, I think, because of all the blowback from scope owners. And because most people were not learning what they should- test your own equipment. People get emotionally attached to things, and get upset if someone finds flaws. For example, you probably won't find someone that has purchased an AMP annealer, that is not absolutely positive it is the only way to prep brass. Even though they most likely have never done an honest side by side test with their rifle.

"A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way." Mark Twain

 

[Formidilosus]

Eval thread updated.

 

[MidGAHunter]

Eval thread updated.

Thanks for doing this Form. The initial response from Vortex was laughable to me and this just confirms how fragile this scope is. To think that this scope won't hold zero when rifle is propped against a tree and slides over or tips over while on a bipod SHOULD give the company some pause. Those are the more "gentle" impacts that can happen in real use. Despite most people's best intentions NOT to cause an impact to their scope/rifle, stuff happens. I appreciate yall doing these tests to give us more data, and doing it despite the fanboys bashing the test because their brand/scope flopped.

 

[ETtikka]

Thanks Form, I am not sure why anyone would think that the Vortex method of torquing would help. I’m sure the scope did pass their test, that is the problem. They could steal a lot of market share by at least attempting to address the root cause of the design issue(s).

 

[Dos XX]

Using a scope checker- It holds 2 scopes including a mechanically frozen scope as the control.

 

[I hunt_dm3]

Don’t forget zero stop and locking elevation turret, oh and sub 20 ounces. Sounds like we’re asking for a vehicle that does 0-60 in 3 seconds, can tow 10,0000 pounds, and has room for 8.

Missed the biggest buck of my life due to a spun turret.

Are you admitting the reliability is suspect but they have great features that are useless when it comes to holding zero?

 

[Ucsdryder]

Are you admitting the reliability is suspect but they have great features that are useless when it comes to holding zero?

My point is that there are lots of important things that go into a scope but somehow it’s all become all about one thing. I’ve yet to have a scope come out of zero from a fall but I had a turret spin which cost me a big buck. So to say durability matters but locking turrets don’t doesn’t make sense.

It’s all about compromise. When a sub 20 ounce, hd glass, with locking turrets and zero stop in a 3-15 comes out, that’s 100% reliable and is less than 800 bucks comes to the market, I guess we won’t have to make compromises!

 

[I hunt_dm3]

My point is that there are lots of important things that go into a scope but somehow it’s all become all about one thing. I’ve yet to have a scope come out of zero from a fall but I had a turret spin which cost me a big buck. So to say durability matters but locking turrets don’t doesn’t make sense.

It’s all about compromise. When a sub 20 ounce, hd glass, with locking turrets and zero stop in a 3-15 comes out, that’s 100% reliable and is less than 800 bucks comes to the market, I guess we won’t have to make compromises!

I agree we are asking to much, I can’t imagine anyone being upset with a scope having the criteria you mentioned but 25 ounces. Crazy to think the comprise would be holding zero over other options. I had good luck with a viper so I know it’s now all bad, but it was definitely the exception, and not just with vortex.

 

[Formidilosus]

My point is that there are lots of important things that go into a scope but somehow it’s all become all about one thing. I’ve yet to have a scope come out of zero from a fall but I had a turret spin which cost me a big buck. So to say durability matters but locking turrets don’t doesn’t make sense.

Then you would be in the minority. If you started a thread titled- “have you ever missed an animal due to the scope losing zero?” Or “have you ever had to rezero a scope due to losing zero”, bet money the amount of people responding yes would be massively more then if you titled a thread- “have you ever missed an animal due to not having a locking turret?”

A scope that loses zero when you need it is 100% a useless item regardless of make. Why would you not factor in reliability to a scope? It’s an aiming device. The reason that some are now paying attention to it, is not because one or two people are promoting it- it’s because people had no idea how bad scopes were, or if they did know, they weren’t aware that other scopes would hold zero. For 50-60 years the only thing people cared about was glass and features and having to rezero a scope or missing due to something happening was and is just normal.

The difference between scopes isn’t one scope has a 50/50 chance of losing zero from sliding over when leaned against a tree, versus another one has a 51/49% change of holding zero. Between common scopes it is literally near 100% chance of one type of scope losing zero, versus as close to 100% chance that another type holds zero.
I suspect that like most, because you haven’t seen it or tried it, you do not grasp how crappy most scopes are, nor how utterly reliable some others are.

 

[Castle Rock]

On my 3-9 Super Sniper I tape the windage and elevation when hunting
If I have the need to dial an extra second to unwind a wrap and a half of tape is of no consequence

 

[pozzit]

Does the entire christmas tree light up, or is it just the center dot like on the 3-15 ?

Just the main cross not the Christmas tree I believe

 

[packgoatguy]

I'll admit, I'm in the same boat as a few other posters here... I've got a new razor lht sitting in its box waiting for my new rifle I'm putting together. The drop testing (btw, thank you for your time Form!) does not inspire confidence... I bought the razor because it ticked all the boxes... under 22oz, FFP, illuminated reticle, capped windage, locking elevation turret, and wide zoom range. This situation leaves me wondering what my next best alternative will be, to get as close to the features I want to enjoy... but be reliable and hold zero under the normal wear and tear its likely to see during the many rough hunting miles I put on every year.

I'm curious... are there 'outside-the-box' work arounds for those of us stuck with less than durable scopes? Form made a comment at one point... about wrapping the scope in bubble wrap.... meant as a tongue and cheek I'm sure... but really, what if there were some sort of a padded scope cover or something we could use to protect the scope from all but the hardest falls? Form, if you read this, and I'm sure this sounds totally ridiculous... but how would scopes like these hold up in your testing if they were wrapped in a half inch of closed cell foam? (For example). If it means the difference between the possibility of losing zero or not... I might be willing to pack a rifle with a scope wrapped in foam... even if it looked ridiculous or was cumbersome... at least until better options are available in the market.

 

[SDHNTR]

I'll admit, I'm in the same boat as a few other posters here... I've got a new razor lht sitting in its box waiting for my new rifle I'm putting together. The drop testing (btw, thank you for your time Form!) does not inspire confidence... I bought the razor because it ticked all the boxes... under 22oz, FFP, illuminated reticle, capped windage, locking elevation turret, and wide zoom range. This situation leaves me wondering what my next best alternative will be, to get as close to the features I want to enjoy... but be reliable and hold zero under the normal wear and tear its likely to see during the many rough hunting miles I put on every year.

I'm curious... are there 'outside-the-box' work arounds for those of us stuck with less than durable scopes? Form made a comment at one point... about wrapping the scope in bubble wrap.... meant as a tongue and cheek I'm sure... but really, what if there were some sort of a padded scope cover or something we could use to protect the scope from all but the hardest falls? Form, if you read this, and I'm sure this sounds totally ridiculous... but how would scopes like these hold up in your testing if they were wrapped in a half inch of closed cell foam? (For example). If it means the difference between the possibility of losing zero or not... I might be willing to pack a rifle with a scope wrapped in foam... even if it looked ridiculous or was cumbersome... at least until better options are available in the market.

You’re gonna wrap a scope in 1/2” foam? How will you access the turrets, or parallax knob, or power selector? Or is this some sort of cover that you take off when you’re ready to shoot? Why not just return or sell your scope and buy something that works?

 

[Formidilosus]

I'm curious... are there 'outside-the-box' work arounds for those of us stuck with less than durable scopes?

Yes- sell it and buy something you trust.

Form made a comment at one point... about wrapping the scope in bubble wrap.... meant as a tongue and cheek I'm sure... but really, what if there were some sort of a padded scope cover or something we could use to protect the scope from all but the hardest falls? Form, if you read this, and I'm sure this sounds totally ridiculous... but how would scopes like these hold up in your testing if they were wrapped in a half inch of closed cell foam? (For example). If it means the difference between the possibility of losing zero or not... I might be willing to pack a rifle with a scope wrapped in foam... even if it looked ridiculous or was cumbersome... at least until better options are available in the market.

That would be no different than the 1/2” pad that they are dropped on anyways. A scope that loses zero easily, is a scope that loses zero easily and there is nothing you can do to help it. Keep in mind, this specific scope has lost zero twice just riding the padded seat of a truck.

 

[Tahoe1305]

I'll admit, I'm in the same boat as a few other posters here... I've got a new razor lht sitting in its box waiting for my new rifle I'm putting together. The drop testing (btw, thank you for your time Form!) does not inspire confidence... I bought the razor because it ticked all the boxes... under 22oz, FFP, illuminated reticle, capped windage, locking elevation turret, and wide zoom range. This situation leaves me wondering what my next best alternative will be, to get as close to the features I want to enjoy... but be reliable and hold zero under the normal wear and tear its likely to see during the many rough hunting miles I put on every year.

I'm curious... are there 'outside-the-box' work arounds for those of us stuck with less than durable scopes? Form made a comment at one point... about wrapping the scope in bubble wrap.... meant as a tongue and cheek I'm sure... but really, what if there were some sort of a padded scope cover or something we could use to protect the scope from all but the hardest falls? Form, if you read this, and I'm sure this sounds totally ridiculous... but how would scopes like these hold up in your testing if they were wrapped in a half inch of closed cell foam? (For example). If it means the difference between the possibility of losing zero or not... I might be willing to pack a rifle with a scope wrapped in foam... even if it looked ridiculous or was cumbersome... at least until better options are available in the market.

So I don’t do this because my scopes suck (but maybe they do).

But I use a cheap cloth foldable stadium chair (1/2lb maybe) that I pack on the outside of my rifle strapped to my bag. It provides exactly as you say (padding) when loaded up.

Most importantly forgot to
Mention I use this as my glassing chair and it’s awesome. That’s the primary purpose.

When In my hands (only right before I shoot), I feel it is less likely I’ll drop it (haven’t yet hard enough to adjust POI). I’ve dropped a bunch of times on the bag. No issue. I’ve dropped off the bag but no where near 18”.

I don’t have a picture with the rifle on the bag. But below is one of the seat and how it attaches. Just imagine a rifle (scope centered) between bag and that seat.