Varmint bullet for deer

[EdP]

There are too many big game bullets that shoot well to use match or varmint bullets on big game IMO. I see you are going to try the 85gr GKs and think it is a good choice.

 

[Taudisio]

There are too many big game bullets that shoot well to use match or varmint bullets on big game IMO. Have you tried 100 gr Gamekings?

They may barely fit, I would guess my velocity would be sub 2500fps. I have a calibrated reticle I am trying to utilize before sacrificing the little speed that I have. I can add them to my backup of backup choices

 

[Taudisio]

I was looking for gel blocks and decided to search for videos of someone else doing it.

So he claims 2760fps with the 87gr. I am 100fps slower. He got 12” of penetration. This is looking promising and concerning at the same time. 35gr mushroom approx .5” wide.

I don’t think a deer ribcage will be a problem. A shoulder could pose a large problem with an extra layer of bone on top of ribs that I do not know how the bullet will react to.

 

[Ozarkansas]

77gr TMK and 87gr V-max have very similar form factors and likely similar jacket thickness

Are they similar jacket thicknesses? I was under the impression that the Vmax was thinner than either match or big game bullets but I can’t find anything concrete.

So he claims 2760fps with the 87gr. I am 100fps slower. He got 12” of penetration. This is looking promising and concerning at the same time. 35gr mushroom approx .5” wide.

Yeah that’s certainly enough to get to the lungs from most angles, but still not a ton of depth. Idk there’s guys on here who could interpret that better than me but I’d want a little more depth.

Those 85 grain Sierra BTHP gamekings have a pretty solid record on deer, including in my own family. It doesn’t shoot well in my .243 but does in a couple 6mm Remingtons in the family. My uncle uses some kind of 87 grain flat base soft point in his slow twist 6mm with great results and accuracy, but I think it’s discontinued

 

[Taudisio]

Are they similar jacket thicknesses? I was under the impression that the Vmax was thinner than either match or big game bullets but I can’t find anything concrete.

Yeah that’s certainly enough to get to the lungs from most angles, but still not a ton of depth. Idk there’s guys on here who could interpret that better than me but I’d want a little more depth.

Those 85 grain Sierra BTHP gamekings have a pretty solid record on deer, including in my own family. It doesn’t shoot well in my .243 but does in a couple 6mm Remingtons in the family. My uncle uses some kind of 87 grain flat base soft point in his slow twist 6mm with great results and accuracy, but I think it’s discontinued

Everywhere I have read, the 85gr Sierra is loved. I am excited to see what kind of groups and velocity I can get. I had high hopes for the 85gr speer and it fell flat on its face

 

[Fireflyfishing]

I’ve never used a 6mm sierra GK HPBT, but I have used a 160 out of a 7 mag and a 165 out of a 30.06. Both have produced bang flop kills. I still have a ton of them on my bench and are my loads for a couple of my rifles. The only reason I don’t hunt with them normally is the low BC. Within reasonable ranges they are very accurate and deadly.

They’re also reasonably priced.

 

[KenLee]

I've been wondering about this too. Generally speaking I avoid neck shots, given that it's easy to get suckered with all that size but only a relatively small CNS opportunity, and a good chance to have a wounded buck run farther than they can with blown-out lungs. But with the explosive nature of those match bullets, I'm starting to wonder if it's not a more viable option.

Very viable with splatter bullets.
Highly recommend, especially close in.

 

[Shō[t]gun]

Are they similar jacket thicknesses? I was under the impression that the Vmax was thinner than either match or big game bullets but I can’t find anything concrete.

Of the ones I’ve seen cross-sectioned, they should be really close or at least not vary enough to treat them any differently. Tipped match and tipped varmint bullets both prioritize lead volume for higher BC and only have enough jacket thickness to consistently hold together for high velocity/volume shooting.

 

[Taudisio]

Of the ones I’ve seen cross-sectioned, they should be really close or at least not vary enough to treat them any differently. Tipped match and tipped varmint bullets both prioritize lead volume for higher BC and only have enough jacket thickness to consistently hold together for high velocity/volume shooting.

I decided to check for myself.

Left to right
90gr eldx, 87gr vmax, 90gr ballistic tip hunting, 80gr ballistic tip varmint, 90gr sierra gamechanger, 85gr sierra gameking, 85gr speer spire point boat tail.

My observations-
The 90gr eldx and 90gr gamechanger are too long to be optimal in my 6x45.
The only noticeable difference between the 80 and 90gr ballistic tips are the length even though they are “varmint” and “hunting” respectively.
The 80gr ballistic tip “varmint” has a thicker jacket than both the 85gr speer and gameking, and they are both designated “medium/big game” bullets.
I can not see the interlocking ring on the 90gr eldx.
An 80gr Sierra gamechanger would probably be my choice of optimal bullet.

 

[Shō[t]gun]

I decided to check for myself.
View attachment 715608
Left to right
90gr eldx, 87gr vmax, 90gr ballistic tip hunting, 80gr ballistic tip varmint, 90gr sierra gamechanger, 85gr sierra gameking, 85gr speer spire point boat tail.

My observations-
The 90gr eldx and 90gr gamechanger are too long to be optimal in my 6x45.
The only noticeable difference between the 80 and 90gr ballistic tips are the length even though they are “varmint” and “hunting” respectively.
The 80gr ballistic tip “varmint” has a thicker jacket than both the 85gr speer and gameking, and they are both designated “medium/big game” bullets.
I can not see the interlocking ring on the 90gr eldx.
An 80gr Sierra gamechanger would probably be my choice of optimal bullet.

Awesome, that's why I laugh when people freak out because a manufacturer "doesn't recommend these for hunting". Very few people actually know what their bullet looks like on the inside. Curious though why you chose the game changer over the others. Slower velocities from a 6x45, especially at longer distances, would benefit from a thinner jacket up front.

 

[Timberline001]

We hunted with a 6x45 for a couple years and at 2700 FPS those 87 grain v-maxes were amazing. 500 yards and under I’d take that combo on any deer hunt with 100% confidence. Another member who uses them to cull put me onto that combo. Still the most accurate combo I’ve shot as well. We only sold because my sister who shot it was ready to extend her range and got past her issues with recoil.

 

[Ozarkansas]

I decided to check for myself.
View attachment 715608
Left to right
90gr eldx, 87gr vmax, 90gr ballistic tip hunting, 80gr ballistic tip varmint, 90gr sierra gamechanger, 85gr sierra gameking, 85gr speer spire point boat tail.

My observations-
The 90gr eldx and 90gr gamechanger are too long to be optimal in my 6x45.
The only noticeable difference between the 80 and 90gr ballistic tips are the length even though they are “varmint” and “hunting” respectively.
The 80gr ballistic tip “varmint” has a thicker jacket than both the 85gr speer and gameking, and they are both designated “medium/big game” bullets.
I can not see the interlocking ring on the 90gr eldx.
An 80gr Sierra gamechanger would probably be my choice of optimal bullet.

That’s awesome, I need to save this post for later. given the amount of stuff that’s been killed by the two sierras and the 90 grain ballistic tip in this caliber, I don’t think you should be concerned about using any of those “varmint” bullets for big game, especially at 6x45 velocities.

It is interesting to me just how thick the ELD-X, gamechanger, and ballistic tip jackets are. I know the 95 grain ballistic tip has a phenomenal reputation, and the only one I’ve used punched clean through both shoulders of a deer- they don’t seem to be the fragile bullets we all believed growing up

 

[Timberline001]

A doe that was shot through the shoulder. She was quartered towards us and what was left of the bullet lodged in the offside hide behind the shoulder.

 

[Taudisio]

Awesome, that's why I laugh when people freak out because a manufacturer "doesn't recommend these for hunting". Very few people actually know what their bullet looks like on the inside. Curious though why you chose the game changer over the others. Slower velocities from a 6x45, especially at longer distances, would benefit from a thinner jacket up front.

I have the gamechangers for my 6arc, they will not fit in my 6x45 very well. An 80gr version would be my choice, assuming it is about a 1/4” shorter.

 

[Taudisio]

We hunted with a 6x45 for a couple years and at 2700 FPS those 87 grain v-maxes were amazing. 500 yards and under I’d take that combo on any deer hunt with 100% confidence. Another member who uses them to cull put me onto that combo. Still the most accurate combo I’ve shot as well. We only sold because my sister who shot it was ready to extend her range and got past her issues with recoil.

I did some pressure testing Monday, and checked velocity, I got them up to 2800fps with a 16” 6x45 barrel when I hit pressure. I loaded 3 different grain weights to check group sizes tomorrow. I don’t really have any interest with any of the bullets if their MV is under 2700fps. The goal of my 6x45 was to get 5.56, 77gr velocities with at least 10 grains more lead behind it.

 

[Taudisio]

View attachment 715618View attachment 715620
A doe that was shot through the shoulder. She was quartered towards us and what was left of the bullet lodged in the offside hide behind the shoulder.

Was this with the 87gr vmax??
Real experience posts like this are why I started this thread.

 

[Taudisio]

That’s awesome, I need to save this post for later. given the amount of stuff that’s been killed by the two sierras and the 90 grain ballistic tip in this caliber, I don’t think you should be concerned about using any of those “varmint” bullets for big game, especially at 6x45 velocities.

It is interesting to me just how thick the ELD-X, gamechanger, and ballistic tip jackets are. I know the 95 grain ballistic tip has a phenomenal reputation, and the only one I’ve used punched clean through both shoulders of a deer- they don’t seem to be the fragile bullets we all believed growing up

I bought a jewelry saw because I wanted to see it in person and feel it in my hands. One thing I forgot to mention, the noslers felt significantly harder to cut through. I broke a blade on the 80gr and two blades on the 90gr, and sliced my finger open. I found some of the CT 95gr ballistic tips that I would love to be able to use. I may pick up a few boxes for my 6arc…..only heard the best of results from that bullet, and it doesn’t hurt they look like the coolest bullet ever.

I want to do more bullets in the future, if I have a particular bullet you want to see, let me know. If I have a caliber and interest in the bullet, I’ll slice one open.

 

[Timberline001]

Was this with the 87gr vmax??
Real experience posts like this are why I started this thread.

Yes it was. We shot 4 whitetails including a buck with it that trip. Shot a couple mule deer and antelope with it as well. There was quite a few marginal shots and not perfect shot angles and they all only took one shot. That set up taught me first hand what a small round can do with the right frangible. I wouldn’t listen to any opinions from people who don’t have first hand experience with this bullet at your velocity’s.

 

[Timberline001]

83-CJ is the man to talk about with the 87s. He’s built quite a few 6x45s just for them for culling deer.

 

[Taudisio]

83-CJ is the man to talk about with the 87s. He’s built quite a few 6x45s just for them for culling deer.

I’ll know tomorrow if it is a match for my rifle.

Out of the bullets I cut open, the vmax is the thinnest jacketed one, lots of lead to fragment and cause havoc inside.