Training rifle caliber/ are they worth it?

[TexasHTR]

Hornady 75bthp
Hornady 73eldm
Hornady 75eldm if you have a longer mag
Sierra 77smk if you want to pay more
Sierra 77tmk if you got ‘em

Pretty much your options right now.

If I were getting into it today. I’d buy 8 pounds of Ramshot tac, 400 pieces of Lapua brass, and a thousand of any of the above (preferably 73s)

Have you found a decent load for 73 eld’s and tac? I’ve started working one up now so I can save my tmk’s and xbr for hunting duty only.

 

[Lawnboi]

Have you found a decent load for 73 eld’s and tac? I’ve started working one up now so I can save my tmk’s and xbr for hunting duty only.

I did in a buddies tikka but don’t have it handy. I also didn’t get crazy with load development for it. It shot them well. My tikka also shot factory with the 73eldm well.

 

[Lawnboi]

I've been hunting for 15 years with an old 30.06 at close ranges in the midwest. Now I live out west, want to not miss elk at 500 yds and have access to shoot in the summer. My 7mm rounds are very much not always in stock. Decent the .223 or 6.5CM tikka. 223 might be a better wind trainer, 6.5CM might be more cross functional for hunting and better at steel to 1000?

You’re the shooter I was a few years ago. I’d start with a 223 honestly, especially if shooting factory. I’d also not shoot distance till you know what you can reliably do from field positions at 100 yards. My decision may differ if you plan to shoot the rifle suppressed, then I can almost see the 6.5 cm being a better option.

The 223 really peters out past 600, and not my choice for anything beyond plinking past that range. Certain conditions can exist where it’s not terrible.

As far as wind trainers go I’ll say the 223 is a good trainer out to around 400, beyond that you get into a situation where 1mph of wind means more than .1 mil. In any dynamic environment this creates a lot of missing off the right, correcting and missing off the left situations that dosnt really teach you much and are just frustrating. Atleast that’s my experience with it. Past 4-500 yards I’m reaching for something that gets me more hits in varying winds. The most important part about learning wind starts with good fundamentals, If you can’t preform from however you’re shooting at 100 yards, adding wind to the equation will just leave you guessing. For that reason the 223 is still a good tool.

 

[rentalrunner22]

Thanks for the feedback. I have a TBAC ultra 7 in jail so I'll be shooting suppressed this summer? Be only shooting factory ammo. Have one range to 400 within 15 min and another range to 1000 within 40 min drive.

Currently leaning towards 6.5 if I think I'd need to use match 223 ammo (close to 6.5 ammo price) and 6.5 ammo is readily available. 223 could work great for training but not sure if I'd "outgrow" it and want a 6.5 for longer range steel and deer/ antelope, instead of my 7RM.

 

[Formidilosus]

Thanks for the feedback. I have a TBAC ultra 7 in jail so I'll be shooting suppressed this summer? Be only shooting factory ammo. Have one range to 400 within 15 min and another range to 1000 within 40 min drive.

Currently leaning towards 6.5 if I think I'd need to use match 223 ammo (close to 6.5 ammo price) and 6.5 ammo is readily available. 223 could work great for training but not sure if I'd "outgrow" it and want a 6.5 for longer range steel and deer/ antelope, instead of my 7RM.

You will not outgrow a good 223 bolt gun. The best field shooters I know shoot 20-1, 223 to anything else. I disagree heavily about wind being a detriment to the 223 past 400 yards- yes, if your sole concern is hitting small targets in wind more than learning- but then why not just shoot a 35lb 6 dasher PRS rifle and get even more hits?

Most things that need to be practiced with, can be practiced with bulk ammo. 55gr FMJ will stay on 12” plates to past 400 yards, and most people lack gun handling the most, which is where volume comes in. For anything precision related (sub 2moa) Hornady frontier 68gr and 75gr HPBT works just fine as is $12-14 per 20 rounds- no 6.5cm is available for that.

 

[Lawnboi]

Ammo prices are coming down as well, 223 will always be cheaper than creedmoor. Add In the price per round for barrel life and it makes more sense. It’s going to take purposeful practice to become proficient, lots of rounds, and with your proximity to a 400 yard range id have a hard time not starting there.

I’d also not pass up on the 223 if I went back in time. It’s made me a better shooter without a doubt. It’s my primary deer gun as well for most of what I do. Thousands of rounds on that gun opened my eyes to a lot.

A 6.5 creedmoor is tolerable with a suppressor, a 223 is even better. Seeing what you’re doing right and wrong will be easier with the 223.

 

[wind gypsy]

Hornady 75bthp
Hornady 73eldm
Hornady 75eldm if you have a longer mag
Sierra 77smk if you want to pay more
Sierra 77tmk if you got ‘em

Pretty much your options right now.

If I were getting into it today. I’d buy 8 pounds of Ramshot tac, 400 pieces of Lapua brass, and a thousand of any of the above (preferably 73s)

I'm a big fan of ADI loaded ammo. I've had friends say the ADI brass is great stuff too but i haven't reloaded it or measured it yet. If it's as good as i've heard, theres no reason to buy lapua brass either.

ADI 69 SMK ammo has been available recently for $0.65/ea so for short range practice I see zero reason to reload. I bought some AAC 75 hornady BTHP for $0.60 /ea and 77 SMK for $65/ea recently too but haven't shot it yet but id be surprised if it shot as good as the ADI stuff. Hoping to get out this weekend and compare all this ammo.

[EDIT: I shot some new ADI 69 SMK today and it was trash accuracy wise in my T3x lite. Not sure if something changed from when it was sold under Australian outback label. AAC 77 smk was pretty ugly too. The AAC 75 hpbt was a better but bolt lift was a little stiff on some rounds.]

Also bought Norma golden target "match" ammo for 6 and 6.5 creed for $1.15-1.20 this week and Berger factory 6 creed for $1.50/ea. I've not bought this much factory ammo in years but i'm pretty excited to spend time at the range vs bench.

 

[Lawnboi]

I'm a big fan of ADI loaded ammo. I've had friends say the ADI brass is great stuff too but i haven't reloaded it or measured it yet. If it's as good as i've heard, theres no reason to buy lapua brass either.

ADI 69 SMK ammo has been available recently for $0.65/ea so for short range practice I see zero reason to reload. I bought some AAC 75 hornady BTHP for $0.60 /ea and 77 SMK for $65/ea recently too but haven't shot it yet but id be surprised if it shot as good as the ADI stuff. Hoping to get out this weekend and compare all this ammo.

Also bought Norma golden target "match" ammo for 6 and 6.5 creed for $1.15-1.20 this week and Berger factory 6 creed for $1.50/ea. I've not bought this much factory ammo in years but i'm pretty excited to spend time at the range vs bench.

I think we are close to seeing some deals on factory ammo soon. Hard to ignore that option.

I can appreciate the factory ammo simplicity now. With an infant I don’t get to spend as much time in my downstairs closet as I used to. I’ll keep loading thought.

Is that adi brass crimped? That would be enough for me to throw it in the recycling bin.

 

[wind gypsy]

Is that adi brass crimped? That would be enough for me to throw it in the recycling bin.

Nope.

 

[Rich M]

30-06 will kill an elk at 500 yards...

 

[rentalrunner22]

Proud new owner of a T3X 223

 

[rentalrunner22]

It's shooting ~0.75 moa on hornady frontier. So much fun and so cheap. Thanks for the two cents.

 

[MJB]

Practice with the gun & ammo your going to hurt with.......

 

[Formidilosus]

Practice with the gun & ammo your going to hurt with.......

What gun and ammo do you hunt with?

 

[MJB]

I did use my M70 .270 with 130tsx hot hand loads for deer and pigs.
Elk M70 30-06 with 180SST custom load factory ammo.
Now I will be using X bolt 6.8W with 162gr hammer hand loads.

I will dry fire 10 to every live load when practicing.......I also have a bb gun range with moving small targets in my backyard that I shoot almost every day.

 

[joshr]

You will not outgrow a good 223 bolt gun. The best field shooters I know shoot 20-1, 223 to anything else. I disagree heavily about wind being a detriment to the 223 past 400 yards- yes, if your sole concern is hitting small targets in wind more than learning- but then why not just shoot a 35lb 6 dasher PRS rifle and get even more hits?

Most things that need to be practiced with, can be practiced with bulk ammo. 55gr FMJ will stay on 12” plates to past 400 yards, and most people lack gun handling the most, which is where volume comes in. For anything precision related (sub 2moa) Hornady frontier 68gr and 75gr HPBT works just fine as is $12-14 per 20 rounds- no 6.5cm is available for that.

Hey @Formidilosus, I would love to hear your thoughts on what you consider a good bolt gun for these purposes.

 

[Formidilosus]

Hey @Formidilosus, I would love to hear your thoughts on what you consider a good bolt gun for these purposes.

The short answer is a Tikka T3 with 1-8” twist, cut to 18” and threaded for a suppressor. Every other option has heavy compromises in function.

 

[joshr]

The short answer is a Tikka T3 with 1-8” twist, cut to 18” and threaded for a suppressor. Every other option has heavy compromises in function.

Thank you - no suppressors for us here (in Australia), but the T3 is my first choice, in 223. Cheers.

 

[Formidilosus]

Thank you - no suppressors for us here (in Australia), but the T3 is my first choice, in 223. Cheers.

Ahh. Yes, it’s a good choice.

 

[Dobermann]

Thank you - no suppressors for us here (in Australia), but the T3 is my first choice, in 223. Cheers.

Move to NZ. Suppressors are over the counter.