Tough Scope options. SHV? ATACR? LRHS? Veracity?

[PowellSixO]

I don't log in much over here, but I can assure you that Form is legit. I agree that this is not nightforce's normal practice or quality that most of us have been accustomed to. However, I would send a scope to Form for evaluation days before a hunt if he was offering. The shv line scopes are the best value in their line up, definitely not junk or lacking performance. Scopes fail, but hopefully your friend is aware of the vortex issues too.

100% aware that vortex has issues. But what they do have, is an A+ no bullshit badass warranty. You drop your binos on a big rock, and break them, bam you get your binos fixed no problem. You fall on your scope while trying to cut off a bull on the first day of your long awaited elk hunt, bam you get your scope fixed no problem. Shit happens. We're not mad that his scope failed. We're mad NF won't make it right. There's a big difference. Everything can fail.

 

[Broz]

I have never had a need for a warranty at NF, so I can only go by the reports that they have taken care of others. The difference to me in Vortex and NF warranty is you simply need one more often than the other. I have called NF and asked for small parts like scope cap or power throw knob before, we even asked for a box once. Every single time my request was greeted with them happily taking care of me. And so far the cost was " We will catch you next time" This is why I would really like to see this resolved, if you got a person there that didn't follow policy, NF will want to deal with the issue. This I am sure of.

Jeff

 

[Formidilosus]

Form, do you know if the SHV uses the same internal springs as the ATACR or NXS models?

They are not built identically, similar but not the same. The major difference is the testing that every NXS/ATACR/BEAST goes through before it leaves the factory.


The SHV’s are probably in the running for the second most reliable scopes made.

 

[ElkElkGoose]

I use the NXS 2.5-10 42mm and find it works great for ranges out to 600 yards, prob more. It has a very fine reticle that helps out.

Also, as far a Nightforce customer service, I have their carbon fiber tripod that has detachable hiking poles. I was out scouting in Colorado a few miles up into a basin and forgot my filter and got pretty dehydrated. At some point, I put down my hiking poles to rest and just didn't pick them up again and left them somewhere in the mountains. I didn't realize this until I got back to the truck.

I called nightforce to ask them how much the two legs would cost and also get the remaining pole looked at because some of the glue on the twist knob was slipping. They ended up having me send in the center pole and in return they sent me a brand new COMPLETE tripod back, at no charge for any of it.

 

[backcountry_hunter]

Around here Form is NOT a “random” person...Spend ANY time here at all and you will realize you have a great opportunity before you to get this worked out.

This.... I don't know Form from adam but can tell you if I was having issues and he made this offer I'd take him up on it and that's just based off his comments and experience on here and other forums.

 

[PowellSixO]

Got a hold of Form. He was super helpful, and seems like a genuinely good guy. My buddy is either going to go meet him in person with the scope, or mail it to him. Very glad to talk to him. I'll update this once we find something out.

 

[PowellSixO]

Well here's the update. We drove 6 hours one way to meet up with formidilosus to test the SHV. He was a man of his word. He showed up on time, with a naked rifle, and all the free ammo you could shake a stick at. He bore sighted the rifle with the SHV, and proceeded to put a 1 inch 10 shot group just left of the bull at 100 yards. The rain chased us back to our vehicles for 30 minutes. He dialed the scope after the rain, and put 10 more in the center of the target. He then let us shoot the rifle. My buddy put a great group together. Long story short......... we suck. My apologies to everyone, and Nightforce. The scope did what it was supposed to do. Formidilosus was absolutely a stand up guy, and KNOWS his sh!t. It was a long drive for a short shooting session, but totally worth it. His girlfriend then proceeded to kick our ass at the 1000 yard target he setup, with a Howa 223 and a 6 powered fixed scope. Great people to meet, and great trip. Again my apologies for any bad said about Nightforce products. He showed me some nightforce products that made me a believer. My next scope will be nightforce. Plus you can absolutely take anything formidilosus says straight to the bank. Thanks again formidilosus for meeting up with us. We are glad to meet you and your lovely girlfriend. Thanks for taking time to meet with us jackasses, and show us a thing or two.

 

[Bobbyboe]

Good conclusion. I bet the 6 hour drive was worth the experience and a bit of a training session. So, do you think the problem was the shooter, rifle, or mounts?

 

[PowellSixO]

Good conclusion. I bet the 6 hour drive was worth the experience and a bit of a training session. So, do you think the problem was the shooter, rifle, or mounts?

It's hard to say. We're going to reinvestigate everything starting later today. Update to come.

 

[mtnwrunner]

Well here's the update. We drove 6 hours one way to meet up with formidilosus to test the SHV. He was a man of his word. He showed up on time, with a naked rifle, and all the free ammo you could shake a stick at. He bore sighted the rifle with the SHV, and proceeded to put a 1 inch 10 shot group just left of the bull at 100 yards. The rain chased us back to our vehicles for 30 minutes. He dialed the scope after the rain, and put 10 more in the center of the target. He then let us shoot the rifle. My buddy put a great group together. Long story short......... we suck. My apologies to everyone, and Nightforce. The scope did what it was supposed to do. Formidilosus was absolutely a stand up guy, and KNOWS his sh!t. It was a long drive for a short shooting session, but totally worth it. His girlfriend then proceeded to kick our ass at the 1000 yard target he setup, with a Howa 223 and a 6 powered fixed scope. Great people to meet, and great trip. Again my apologies for any bad said about Nightforce products. He showed me some nightforce products that made me a believer. My next scope will be nightforce. Plus you can absolutely take anything formidilosus says straight to the bank. Thanks again formidilosus for meeting up with us. We are glad to meet you and your lovely girlfriend. Thanks for taking time to meet with us jackasses, and show us a thing or two.

Been following this thread.......love the outcome. I was going to pipe in earlier about Form but figured enough had already vouched for him.
He does indeed know his shit. He does cost me a lot of money, though......

Randy

 

[Burnt Reynolds]

This is the kind of thing I love about this place. Good on everyone. Powell: good job giving props where props were due. Now that your buddy has an extra scope, sell price?

 

[wind gypsy]

Been following this thread.......love the outcome. I was going to pipe in earlier about Form but figured enough had already vouched for him.
He does indeed know his shit. He does cost me a lot of money, though......

Randy

^ This. He has helped sow a seed of doubt in my mind for many scopes out there. When i hear about / see good shooters miss easy 4-600 yard shots with corrections dialed on common lighter hunting scopes, I can't help but wonder if the Zeiss/Swaro/Leupold/etc had something to do with it.

As illustrated here, it can be tough to identify the cause of issues between scope, mounts, rifle, and shooter. It is very easy for the shooter to be the culprit in many of these situations especially when you bring magnums into the picture. If it isn't the recoil it can easily be flinching from the percussion from a lot of burning powder and an aggressive brake. I have struggled with fliers with my new havak 300 WM and I'm not 100% sure I'm not the problem. Hoping my coworker who was a Marine sniper for well over a decade can spend some time behind it soon to help validate!

 

[Formidilosus]

Powell,

Good to meet y’all and sorry we didn’t find anything definitive about the rifle. I hope y’all get it figured out and have no weird rifle issues this year. If you guys need any help or have any questions- you have my number. Rachel said to tell you it was good to meet y’all as well.

. I have struggled with fliers with my new havak 300 WM and I'm not 100% sure I'm not the problem. Hoping my coworker who was a Marine sniper for well over a decade can spend some time behind it soon to help validate!

Recoil is a thing. It doesn’t matter who you are, or how much time and ammo you have to spend at the range- you will always shoot better and more consistent the lighter the recoil. I shoot a lot of big rounds a year from 300WM to 338, all the way to 50 BMG’s. It takes a lot of time, ammo, commitment, and physical endurance to shoot light weight, heavy recoil and high muzzle blast guns well. I have the ability to shoot out a barrel every single week of the year from multiple guns if I want, yet when it comes to hunting I choose the most shootable cartridge/platform I can. That means the one with the lightest recoil that will give me the ballistic performance that I NEED. “Need” is the key word here. It does not take a magnum to consistently and reliably kill whitetail/mule deer at 600 yards. Everything up to elk and 400-600’ish yards I choose to use 22 centerfires with good bullets as you simply get more hits with them than anything else. Not only are they easier to shoot well under stress and sub-optimal positions, but you can actually afford to shoot them as much as needed in practice.

If a person isn’t shooting a thousand to two-thousand rounds a year in field/competition type practice, under time constraints, and from alternate positions...... In my experience they’re going to lack a lot of necessary knowledge and skill. The best favor a person can do themselves or their wives/children/significant other/ etc. is to get a relatively lightweight, fast twist 223, mount a solid scope, and buy a case of heavy high BC match bullets (aka- Tikka T3 SL, SWFA SS, and Blackhills 77gr SMK’s) then try to burn the barrel out.

 

[wind gypsy]

Form, what is max COAL that will mag feed from a tikka t3 lite 223 mag? Is it different in the varmint models?

 

[Cactus kid]

Form, do you have any experience with US optic scopes? Does nightforce still beat them on durability?

 

[Formidilosus]

Form, what is max COAL that will mag feed from a tikka t3 lite 223 mag? Is it different in the varmint models?

2.30” +/-

Form, do you have any experience with US optic scopes? Does nightforce still beat them on durability?

Yes, and yes. USO’s issue isn’t necessarily pure durability, it is variability. That is- a USO is nearly hand built and no two of the same scopes are exactly alike.


Regardless of of what people want; due to materials, build, testing, QA/QC, and field testing before release there is not another scope line/manufacture that bests Nightforces NXS/ATACR/BEAST scope lines in durability reliability, and correct function when used in large numbers. I can not say the same for the SHV as I’ve only seen a few dozen used heavily, vice hundreds of the former models. However, it seems that the SHV line is doing very well.

 

[Cactus kid]

2.30” +/-










Yes, and yes. USO’s issue isn’t necessarily pure durability, it is variability. That is- a USO is nearly hand built and no two of the same scopes are exactly alike.


Regardless of of what people want; due to materials, build, testing, QA/QC, and field testing before release there is not another scope line/manufacture that bests Nightforces NXS/ATACR/BEAST scope lines in durability reliability, and correct function when used in large numbers. I can not say the same for the SHV as I’ve only seen a few dozen used heavily, vice hundreds of the former models. However, it seems that the SHV line is doing very well.

based on your recommendation, I have finally saved up and purchased an ATACR. It hurt to spend that much on a scope. "It takes a rich man to afford a cheap scope" I have been told. If that is true than I am a prime candidate for an expensive one.

 

[Formidilosus]

based on your recommendation, I have finally saved up and purchased an ATACR. It hurt to spend that much on a scope. "It takes a rich man to afford a cheap scope" I have been told. If that is true than I am a prime candidate for an expensive one.

Sweet. 4-16x or 5-25x?


Let me know what you think.

 

[Cactus kid]

4-16x42 is the model I went with. Always liked the locking turret on the leupolds. I like the size of the scope as well. Ordered burris xtreme steel bases and a set of Hawkins precision rings.

 

[Formidilosus]

4-16x42 is the model I went with. Always liked the locking turret on the leupolds. I like the size of the scope as well. Ordered burris xtreme steel bases and a set of Hawkins precision rings.

I believe that’s the best medium to long range scope made. What reticle?