To Peep sight or not ?

[ElDiablito]

Where can you buy a Gehmann PH510? From what I understand the Parker Hale model is needed to get the 7x32-40 threads for the Williams peep. I have been trying to find out what the diameter is because not much “room” for clearance on my Knight.

Ordered mine with the PH thread adapter on eBay

 

[Coueskiller43]

Gehmann 510 Rear Iris/ Aperture .5 - 3mm

The sight includes a new system of aperture control operated by varying the pressure of a steel tube against the central aim point.

www.creedmoorsports.com

I didn’t know you needed an adapter, though it makes sense.

From Creedmoore Sports:
Threading is 9.5mmx1. Not available in 10-32.

Maybe you can find an adapter?

 

[Coueskiller43]

Actually this looks like the correct one…

Gehmann Redfield/Parker-Hale Rear Sight Iris .5-3.0mm

This iris is for use with Parker-Hale or Redfield sights and has laser engraved indications.

www.creedmoorsports.com

 

[Gila]

Thanks…I ordered the Gehmann.

 

[Wrench]

I run the gehmann with a 17ah front and can shoot amazingly well with it to 500 yards with swiss 2f and a 420 no excuses bullet.

 

[Wrench]

The parker hale is what you want for the williams fp series.

 

[HighUintas]

fwiw
learning to use a peep will double your range minimum. if you do all the things to make it shoot consistent, 250-300 yds is doable. back when I primarily hunted with a ml, I could hold 6" or smaller all day @ 250yds.
the other thing I recently started doing is using the Lyman globe front with a target post upside down so poa isn't obstructed in a hold over situation.
The KNS crosshair front sight fits in a 3/8" dovetail and gives a very precise poa...if you can see it. it takes practice and it's not fast but it can be very accurate.
currently I'm using a Williams FP Target rear peep with both for long range stuff and a basic Willams peep base on short range stuff.

I'm guessing that kns cross hair would be impossible to see on a 36" barrel. What do you think?

I'm trying to figure out a globe or similar front and peep rear for my muzzleloader. It unfortunately is octagon barrel and completely custom so none of the sets currently available will work.

I was thinking either Lyman 17 front with Lee shavers inserts, or the Western precision that clamps on a dovetail and use the lowest base they have.

Rear, I'd likely have to drill and tap either the barrel or tang

 

[flyfisher117]

Is there a resource to peep/globes and compatibility and comparisons? Wanting to change out the fiber optic sights on my Optima V2. I was looking at the Williams set but wanted to ensure i could upgrade to adjustable peep later. Unless there’s just a better starting point.

 

[Gila]

Is there a resource to peep/globes and compatibility and comparisons? Wanting to change out the fiber optic sights on my Optima V2. I was looking at the Williams set but wanted to ensure i could upgrade to adjustable peep later. Unless there’s just a better starting point.

If you go with a Williams Western precision, they say you should be using their rear peep sight. They have different models of front globes that fit different barrel circumference. The rear peep for that setup is only adjustable to the point that you set it and forget it. i ended up buying the .19 fiber post for the globe. I am having trouble with my eyes and can’t focus on the front post very well. I tried a Gehmann iris aperture which works much better than the standard peep aperture but probably won’t fit on some inlines. Williams does make different size apertures but I need an adjustable iris aperture for different ranges. All in all, not that impressed with the Western Precision.

 

[longrangelead]

I'm guessing that kns cross hair would be impossible to see on a 36" barrel. What do you think?

I'm trying to figure out a globe or similar front and peep rear for my muzzleloader. It unfortunately is octagon barrel and completely custom so none of the sets currently available will work.

I was thinking either Lyman 17 front with Lee shavers inserts, or the Western precision that clamps on a dovetail and use the lowest base they have.

Rear, I'd likely have to drill and tap either the barrel or tang

if it were mine, I'd try the WPS first. on a 36", the fiber optic dot might appear small enough to be useful but give a good poa.

I agree, the KNS would probably be to small that far away.

depending on you muzzy make, there are several tang sight options that may work.

If you have to, the Williams Octagon rear peep is a easy install. The nice thing about a drill n tap rear sight on a octagon muzzy is you can mount it exactly where you like it for eye relief and aperture size.

 

[HighUintas]

if it were mine, I'd try the WPS first. on a 36", the fiber optic dot might appear small enough to be useful but give a good poa.

I agree, the KNS would probably be to small that far away.

depending on you muzzy make, there are several tang sight options that may work.

If you have to, the Williams Octagon rear peep is a easy install. The nice thing about a drill n tap rear sight on a octagon muzzy is you can mount it exactly where you like it for eye relief and aperture size.

For WPS, they told me their paramount WPS dovetail isn't compatible with the dovetail base they use for the target globe. However, the target globe can use the WPS inserts. So I'd be able to use the 0.220 dovetail base with the target globe and small 0.019 fiber optic insert. But would have to window the target globe for light collection and the sight would be pretty high; ~0.765 from barrel top flat to sight center.

Alternatively I could just use one of the regular front dovetailed blades with a 0.060 fiber for a lower height. My current silver blade is 0.050. it's ok, but I think the 0.019 insert would be great.

For the rear, their octagon peeps are made for 0.395 flats, which I think is probably 15/16" barrel. Mine is 1" barrel with 0.414 flats so it wouldn't work.

I'm considering this one below. It can be mounted either using the upper tang bolt, or I could D/T another spot on the tang or even on the barrel. He said he could make one with a longer staff to accommodate extra height if needed. Apertures are changeable. Adjustable windage.



Here's the rear of my gun.

 

[longrangelead]

For WPS, they told me their paramount WPS dovetail isn't compatible with the dovetail base they use for the target globe. However, the target globe can use the WPS inserts. So I'd be able to use the 0.220 dovetail base with the target globe and small 0.019 fiber optic insert. But would have to window the target globe for light collection and the sight would be pretty high; ~0.765 from barrel top flat to sight center.

Alternatively I could just use one of the regular front dovetailed blades with a 0.060 fiber for a lower height. My current silver blade is 0.050. it's ok, but I think the 0.019 insert would be great.

For the rear, their octagon peeps are made for 0.395 flats, which I think is probably 15/16" barrel. Mine is 1" barrel with 0.414 flats so it wouldn't work.

I'm considering this one below. It can be mounted either using the upper tang bolt, or I could D/T another spot on the tang or even on the barrel. He said he could make one with a longer staff to accommodate extra height if needed. Apertures are changeable. Adjustable windage.

View attachment 880746

Here's the rear of my gun.

View attachment 880748View attachment 880749

If you have sights on it now that are comfortable for you, you could measure them both and match the height or add accordingly if they need or have to be higher.

This base I know works with the WPS globe.

The rear ladder peep looks like a great option. I suggest taping it to the gun in different locations until you find the place you like it.

 

[HighUintas]

This base I know works with the WPS globe.

It does? That's good news. Do you have a part number for the specific WPS globe that works? The tech support guy told me twice through email that dovetail base 47620 doesn't work with the paramount WPS, which is the only wps on their sight that looks like it has a dovetail. So if you have a part number pairing you know will mate together, I'll go that route.

 

[wowzers]

I tried the globe front sights with the reticle inserts. They worked great for the range and sighting in but not so much for me out in the field on game. They shaded the sight too much for me. So my optima is set up with stock front fiber optic sight and a peep/aperture rear sight. I’ve taken pronghorn and elk with it to 80-90 yards. My son took his first mule deer with it @ 40 yards last fall. I personally don’t plan on shooting over about 100 yards and though a little large on a pronghorn at that range, it works. I like that it is a primitive weapon and that there is some challenge and judgement involved in making a clean kill.

That was my experience last year too. I didn’t even think about it till I got in the woods opening morning and couldn’t hardly see the front insert.

 

[longrangelead]

It does? That's good news. Do you have a part number for the specific WPS globe that works? The tech support guy told me twice through email that dovetail base 47620 doesn't work with the paramount WPS, which is the only wps on their sight that looks like it has a dovetail. So if you have a part number pairing you know will mate together, I'll go that route.

I don't hold Williams tech support too high any more.
When I initially called with the same questions and to see if I could purchase just the front sight, I got SOME help. When I told him I was trying to pair it with a Lyman target rear peep for "long range", he got condescending and told me it wouldn't work.

I'd be willing to bet the "target" and Paramount WPS are exactly the same. You were told different because his "product description " is what he's going off.

If you buy the Paramount WPS and it doesn't fit that dovetail base from Midway, I'll buy it from you + shipping for what you paid.

I bought the "Target" and can confirm the WPS inserts do fit.

 

[HighUintas]

I don't hold Williams tech support too high any more.
When I initially called with the same questions and to see if I could purchase just the front sight, I got SOME help. When I told him I was trying to pair it with a Lyman target rear peep for "long range", he got condescending and told me it wouldn't work.

I'd be willing to bet the "target" and Paramount WPS are exactly the same. You were told different because his "product description " is what he's going off.

If you buy the Paramount WPS and it doesn't fit that dovetail base from Midway, I'll buy it from you + shipping for what you paid.

I bought the "Target" and can confirm the WPS inserts do fit.

I decided to go with this sight and a taller aperture staff. The flip up brass one I had pictured I think could have durability and reliability issues, no much windage adjustment, and the peep can't be removed in low light scenarios to turn into a ghost ring. I think the one below will be rock solid and give great flexibility. https://skinnersights.com/products/universal-barrel-mount-peep-sight?_pos=1&_sid=d268b1120&_ss=r

I also talked to Williams on the phone. He got both items in hand, the dovetail base and the paramount pro dovetailed WPS, and checked fit. They do not fit as the dovetail size is different. So the base does only work with the target globe. However, the target globe does take all the WPS inserts. Even still, the center of the globe would be 0.660 above top of barrel and about $100 for all the parts, so I decided to go with the Lyman 17ahb and Lee shavers inserts. I'll window the Lyman housing and put some white paint on the center of whichever insert I use and I think that ought to work ok.

 

[longrangelead]

I decided to go with this sight and a taller aperture staff. The flip up brass one I had pictured I think could have durability and reliability issues, no much windage adjustment, and the peep can't be removed in low light scenarios to turn into a ghost ring. I think the one below will be rock solid and give great flexibility. https://skinnersights.com/products/universal-barrel-mount-peep-sight?_pos=1&_sid=d268b1120&_ss=r

I also talked to Williams on the phone. He got both items in hand, the dovetail base and the paramount pro dovetailed WPS, and checked fit. They do not fit as the dovetail size is different. So the base does only work with the target globe. However, the target globe does take all the WPS inserts. Even still, the center of the globe would be 0.660 above top of barrel and about $100 for all the parts, so I decided to go with the Lyman 17ahb and Lee shavers inserts. I'll window the Lyman housing and put some white paint on the center of whichever insert I use and I think that ought to work ok.

good to know the Paramount and target are actually different.

definitely post pics of what you get to work.

I have a can of white/glow-in-the-dark jig paint I need to try in a scenario like yours.

 

[bobco]

My preference is the Williams Western Precision front globe with the small .019” fiber optic. To my knowledge, this is the smallest fiber optic on the commercial market.

.019 top and .029 bottom:


View attachment 736539

Drew my muzzleloader buck tag in Colorado. I used the Williams globe 3 years ago and was unable to see through the globe in low light situation, my only chance . how much better are these fiber inserts? I'm considering going back to stock fiber sight on my gun and ditching the globe, good idea but not practical for hunting, shoots great on paper!

 

[HighUintas]

Drew my muzzleloader buck tag in Colorado. I used the Williams globe 3 years ago and was unable to see through the globe in low light situation, my only chance . how much better are these fiber inserts? I'm considering going back to stock fiber sight on my gun and ditching the globe, good idea but not practical for hunting, shoots great on paper!

I haven't tested my Lyman 17 in low light yet. I'm using the Lee shaver fine cross hair and I can see it being an issue in low light but haven't tried it yet.

My plan is to window it a heavily as possible and use some glow in the dark pigment in the center. I'll probably use the fine bead on top of post in combo with the cross hair so there is more surface to put the glow paint on. I think it will work well enough.

Is your Williams globe the Western precision type that is windowed? I would think the fiber optic with a windowed globe would work well.

 

[HighUintas]

Going to use this stuff on my dot or cross hair insert. Mix it with clear fingernail polish.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B01K081MYO?psc=1&ref=ppx_pop_mob_b_asin_title

If you want to spend more money on the glow lume powder, you could use this or the BGW9 version of it. https://shop.diywatch.club/products...hBEGqF8XTnE-bEmC2JjBY-rCkMMKnL_ywuMj59kZmk_Ib