The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom

[Beagle1]

And once again I have explained why in previous posts.

You’re correct in your above response and you may have stated why in a previous post. But honestly it is starting to look like a “it’s done because I said it’s done.” reply. If the same question gets asked to you multiple times maybe it’s because your response is not clear or it is found to be contradictory. I can tell you that if you are here to change minds then it is not going to work.

So if you are not going to change anyone’s mind, and you are not searching yourself, then I ask with all sincerity what is your point?
[/QUOTE]

It sounds like you’re taking my participation as if I must be here to “change minds.” But I’ve been clear my aim is to question the claims being made, and to discuss the reasons behind them. That’s what happens in a forum, people present ideas and opinions and others examine and respond to them.

Your faith itself isn’t under my control and I’m not asking you to surrender it. What I’m doing is engaging with the reasons you and others give for it. If those reasons are strong, they should stand up to scrutiny. If they’re not, it’s fair to point that out. That’s no different from how any other thread here works but when the topic is religion, suddenly the same process is treated as suspect.

The question of whether God exists is maybe the most important question of anyone’s lifetime. If it’s true, it shapes everything. If it’s not, that matters just as much. To me that’s why it requires examination and not insulation.

So my point is simple: discussion. If believers want to post their views, skeptics are free to examine them.

Now I await the next time I am asked the same question about my motives.

 

[go_deep]

“But to you who hear I say, love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,
bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.
To the person who strikes you on one cheek, offer the other one as well, and from the person who takes your cloak, do not withhold even your tunic.
Give to everyone who asks of you, and from the one who takes what is yours do not demand it back.
Do to others as you would have them do to you.
For if you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them.
And if you do good to those who do good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do the same.
If you lend money to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit [is] that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, and get back the same amount.
But rather, love your enemies and do good to them, and lend expecting nothing back; then your reward will be great and you will be children of the Most High, for he himself is kind to the ungrateful and the wicked.
Be merciful, just as also your Father is merciful.
Luke. 6:27-36

 

[go_deep]

Stop judging and you will not be judged. Stop condemning and you will not be condemned. Forgive and you will be forgiven.
Luke 6:37

 

[Beagle1]

Are you arguing with me over the fact that I acknowledge my own bias? lol I do not reject said evidence automatically I actually watch and or listen to discussions and come to my own conclusion, I am allowed to do that.
You think God contradicts Himself? Please show me where.

You’re free to acknowledge your bias but what you said earlier was that no new evidence would ever change your mind. That’s not just bias, that’s closing the door before you even see what might come in. If nothing could count against your position, then what you call “weighing evidence” is really just accepting what reinforces what you already believe.

As for contradictions, they’re well-documented by scholars and skeptics alike. You and anyone else can look them up with a quick search. I don’t see much point in pasting long lists here, especially since you’ve already said no amount of evidence would matter.

And as I’ve noted, Muslims say the same about the Quran, Mormons about the Book of Mormon, and others about their scriptures. Each insists their text is immune from contradiction, so the logic works just as well for them as for you. It doesn’t prove the faith is true, it just shows it’s closed off from examination.

But let me ask you this: if truth really is from God, why would it need to be shielded from evidence? If it’s true, scrutiny should only confirm it. When someone refuses even the possibility of counter evidence, that suggests the belief isn’t standing on strength but on insulation.

 

[Shortschaf]

But let me ask you this: if truth really is from God, why would it need to be shielded from evidence? If it’s true, scrutiny should only confirm it. When someone refuses even the possibility of counter evidence, that suggests the belief isn’t standing on strength but on insulation.

What proof do you think should be sufficient for a Christian to stop believing in God

 

[socoalt]

You’re correct in your above response and you may have stated why in a previous post. But honestly it is starting to look like a “it’s done because I said it’s done.” reply. If the same question gets asked to you multiple times maybe it’s because your response is not clear or it is found to be contradictory. I can tell you that if you are here to change minds then it is not going to work.

So if you are not going to change anyone’s mind, and you are not searching yourself, then I ask with all sincerity what is your point?

It sounds like you’re taking my participation as if I must be here to “change minds.” But I’ve been clear my aim is to question the claims being made, and to discuss the reasons behind them. That’s what happens in a forum, people present ideas and opinions and others examine and respond to them.

Your faith itself isn’t under my control and I’m not asking you to surrender it. What I’m doing is engaging with the reasons you and others give for it. If those reasons are strong, they should stand up to scrutiny. If they’re not, it’s fair to point that out. That’s no different from how any other thread here works but when the topic is religion, suddenly the same process is treated as suspect.

The question of whether God exists is maybe the most important question of anyone’s lifetime. If it’s true, it shapes everything. If it’s not, that matters just as much. To me that’s why it requires examination and not insulation.

So my point is simple: discussion. If believers want to post their views, skeptics are free to examine them.

Now I await the next time I am asked the same question about my motives.
[/QUOTE]

We are typing on the internet so we don’t have the luxury of social cues that go with an in person conversation. I am not insulted, but rather enjoy the discussion that you are offering. I asked my question to clarify to myself what was motivating you to engage here. As a skeptic are you genuinely curious about faith or are you looking try to debunk scripture? Your motives have a lot to do with the thread since this has gone a very different direction than what I believe the op was intending when he started it. If discussion is really your point that is great and I welcome it.


I disagree with your statement that the question if God exists is the most important question of people’s lifetime.
I agree that if he does then it matters more than anything else in the our lives. But I disagree in that if believers are wrong and he doesn’t then in the end when we die if there is nothing, then it doesn’t matter at all.