The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom

[Billinsd]

I used to have a bumper sticker on my old VW Beetle. "Honk if you are Jesus". I rarely got honked at and some people flipped me off.

I would have honked!

 

[Jason Snyder]

I would hope folks wouldn’t stoop to making pejorative statements and labels about someone with differing beliefs.

 

[Jason Snyder]

“God blesses those who are persecuted for doing right, for the Kingdom of Heaven is theirs. “God blesses you when people mock you and persecute you and lie about you and say all sorts of evil things against you because you are my followers. Be happy about it! Be very glad! For a great reward awaits you in heaven. And remember, the ancient prophets were persecuted in the same way.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭5‬:‭10‬-‭12‬ ‭NLT‬‬

 

[Bugger]

What I love about the science argument is that the science is constantly changing after we make new discoveries. So therefore if you go to science for your beliefs then you have to be willing to accept everything until proven otherwise.

Is Christianity any different? The New Testament Bible is a collection of letters discovered in random places hundreds of years after being written, in various states of decay, and by unknown origins or the names whitewashed to be more palatable to the European population. Who’s to say more won’t be found? In fact, many artifacts with equal validity and by the same authors have been found and were omitted from the Bible because they didn’t jive with the church’s stance at the time. Are you willing to accept new texts as they are found, or do you think the Bible is complete with whatever they happened to have at the time of publication?

So on this basis please use science to disprove creation.

Disprove that Wookies didn’t exist a long time ago in a galaxy far far away. It’s the same argument.

 

[NVUplandHunter]

If you were one of the thousands suffering from the physiological and emotional impacts, including PTSD, due to abuse at the hands of a religious institution you might view things differently.

And, if you were to stretch beyond your main character syndrome's focus on self-absorption and desire for attention (64 pages, of which you have ~50-60 of the posts), you might realize for a moment that survivors would likely prefer to not be reminded of such events on a daily basis, which, yes "one line" can do....."dude".....really.

Brother I say this with all the love in my heart, you need to heal. You need to get help and heal from your trauma. It’s not weakness, it’s actually strength. Seeing a thread title should not disrupt your peace this badly. Again, I say that with care for you.

I don’t have a desire for attention at all. Yes I’ve engaged this post a lot, because I’m passionate about it. My faith is my center, and I enjoy discussing it. Call me self absorbed whatever, you’re lashing out and I don’t care.

Now… you want to point the finger at me as if I know you or anything about your history. You can save that. We are men here, we don’t read minds. Ask any woman and she will back up that statement. And this is also why you need to heal. Others are not responsible for your triggers, you are. You need to control that as they are your own feelings. Get some help my guy, I’ve done it and it works.

 

[NVUplandHunter]

Who created God?

John Chapter 1

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.”

He has been here from the beginning. He is the one is, was, and always shall be.

Very theological explanation but if you pray for understanding, you’ll receive it.

Matthew 7:7-8
“Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks, receives; and the one who seeks, finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened.”

 

[Beagle1]

Your statement was never implied to you, directed at you, I simple elaborate on what the previous person posted and replied directly to them.

If I wanted to say something to you, I would have tagged you directly in it like I did the previous post #1295. Buddy I shoot straight, I don't take cheap shots and beat around the bush, this had ZERO to do with you.

And I was simply elaborating on what you and the previous poster said. If non believers accepting evidence means Luke 4: 5-6 applies to them it’s fair to say that would apply to me. The verse you posted is often used in Christian circles to imply that those who reject the message are under the devil’s influence. That’s why I addressed the logic behind it.

 

[Beagle1]

Can you reference previous post numbers? I'll go back and read them.

You’ll have to do that homework. But I’ll add one thing that I’ve learned. I prefer to read and post in this thread in the morning and not late at night.

 

[go_deep]

And I was simply elaborating on what you and the previous poster said. If non believers accepting evidence means Luke 4: 5-6 applies to them it’s fair to say that would apply to me. The verse you posted is often used in Christian circles to imply that those who reject the message are under the devil’s influence. That’s why I addressed the logic behind it.

When people are offended about something, I ask myself are they offended because someone said something in a way that was totally out of line, or was it because it was true and they got defensive?

 

[Beagle1]

But once again you came to this thread…
[/QUOTE]
And once again I have explained why in previous posts.

 

[Beagle1]

An obtuse swine Beagle is?

I appreciate you proving many of my points.

 

[Beagle1]

When people are offended about something, I ask myself are they offended because someone said something in a way that was totally out of line, or was it because it was true and they got defensive?

Hmm. So you think a reason someone could take issue with what you said is because it’s true and they’re secretly upset by it? That’s a convenient way to avoid ever having to consider that you might be wrong or unfair. By that logic, if I say something about you that you disagree with, I can just claim you might be upset because it’s true and pat myself on the back for my insight. The truth can hurt both ways

 

[go_deep]

Hmm. So you think a reason someone could take issue with what you said is because it’s true and they’re secretly upset by it? That’s a convenient way to avoid ever having to consider that you might be wrong or unfair. By that logic, if I say something about you that you disagree with, I can just claim you might be upset because it’s true and pat myself on the back for my insight. The truth can hurt both ways

Read the entire thing I wrote, not just the part that upset you.

Brother I hope you find peace, and I will be praying for you to find it.

 

[Beagle1]

Why do I or anyone else have to prove anything? Am I missing something here? My faith and what I believe has absolutely zero to do with what anyone else believes, and vice versa.

Your personal faith itself hasn’t been questioned, that’s yours. What’s being questioned are the reasons believers have given for it. A example of that would be our discussion of free will many posts ago. That’s fair game in a public discussion. If we only shared beliefs without examining the reasoning behind them, this would be a sterile discussion.

 

[Beagle1]

Read the entire thing I wrote, not just the part that upset you.

Brother I hope you find peace, and I will be praying for you to find it.

Yes I agree. Read the entire thing I wrote.

 

[go_deep]

Yes I agree. Read the entire thing I wrote.

Deflection is a dangerous weapon.

 

[Beagle1]

No new evidence will change my mind. Nothing I have heard or listened to has adequately explained or disproved the Bible. And I am not just listening to my own bias, I was listening to Dan Barkers speech on why he doesn't think God exists when you responded.

I have questions just like everyone else but I have also been shown the answers through the Bible. This is why I go back to it when people ask questions.

As far as the young earth theory being at odds with science in my own opinion it is not when God (All Knowing, All Powerful Being) created this world in such a way that we would never be able to find direct evidence to point to him because of the free will he has given us. Just as science cannot disprove God I do believe that us (Christians, creationists, defenders of the faith) cannot point to anything (in the eye of a non believer) and say this proves Gods existence. To a believer it all makes sense, we look at the animals, nature things and experiences that happen around us and see God in that. To a non believer it all makes sense as well in their own mind. This is when I reference back to the Bible and try and show people that trusting in man made assumptions could lead one down a dangerous path.

It might be weird but I do see both sides of the argument but I have the rose colored glasses on. Its a truth that is revealed to you through true truth seeking. I have asked God for wisdom and guidance in this life and I believe He has revealed it to me through His word. I do not study the Bible to come in here and say oh your wrong and here's why but more so to help guide others seeking truth to the truth behind Gods word.

God co exists with us and interacts with those who he choses. I think if you come at this with some sort of bias or ego God will not reveal himself to you. Or he will do as he did to Paul (Saul) and give said person a Damascus road encounter. God decides who He reveals Himself too and it is in accordance with moving forward God's plan.

Part of understanding the Bible and God's plan is understanding that I don't understand anything but what I do know is that everything works in accordance to God's plan which is written in the Bible.
Just as Judas betrayed Jesus and was responsible for Jesus going to the Cross, Jesus would have gone to the cross regardless of who betrayed Him. That was always the plan, it had to happen to give us all the chance at salvation directly through Christ. Things happen in this life, good or bad and God uses them to usher forward His plan.

Kind of all goes back to the OP post. The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. If you do not respect Him then you will not know.

You’ve made it clear that no new evidence would ever change your mind, and I think that’s where a big difference lies between our approaches. You’ve already concluded that anything conflicting with the Bible must be wrong, which means the source of the evidence, even if it were God himself, would be irrelevant if it didn’t match your current interpretation. But how would you know if new information that challenged your beliefs wasn’t actually from God? If you reject it automatically, you’ve closed off the possibility of God revealing something you weren’t expecting.

This is exactly how other religions defend themselves, too. A devout Muslim will tell you the Quran is God’s perfect word, that anything contradicting it is human error, and that people only fail to see its truth because they are blinded by bias or sin. A faithful Mormon will say the same about the Book of Mormon. If you were raised in one of those faiths, you’d be using identical logic to dismiss Christianity without ever realizing it.

When you say, “God decides who He reveals Himself to,” it turns every disagreement into those who agree with you have been chosen to see the truth; those who disagree simply haven’t been chosen or are too biased. That insulates your faith from doubt but it also means you have no way to detect if you’ve misunderstood God’s plan because in your system no evidence could ever override the conclusion you started with.

 

[Beagle1]

Deflection is a dangerous weapon.

Yes.