The 22 creedmoor thread

[Smokinyotes]

My daughter shot her first whitetail this morning with my 22 creed. 77 gr tmk worked well on a broadside shot. In one side through the heart and out the other side.

 

[43.6N]

Alright fellas, Here’s my application to join the cool kids club haha!

I’ve been working on this build for the last 2 months. It finally all came together, and I just got back from shooting it.
Long term plan is for it to wear the walnut stock in the photo. But I’m going to take my time finishing it the right way.

I took it out today to get a rough zero. All I could find on the shelves were some fierce “dirt nap” 77gr nosler ammo. Upside is they have alpha headstamp brass. Shot pretty well for factory. Mirage quickly became my limiting factor.

Plan is to reload 77tmk after I acquire enough brass.
I’ve got N555 and Staball 6.5 to start with.

Very happy after the first range session.
I think the nx8 is a good fit. I found I was able to handle a relatively higher magnification power and still track shots appropriately today.

Other pertinent specs:
16.25” Wilson barrel chambered by Drews Precision. Manson Saami freebore reamer. 1/7”. 0.75” taperless contour.
Tikka T3 action.
McMillan MTLR
NX8
SRS rail
DD enticer LTI

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

Considering moving back to a 6 CM. The 22 CM is so finicky with the highest BC bullets that I end up shooting the 80’s, which definitely give up wind drift and terminal range to the 112 MB’s. Ie. 8 vs 9 mph gun and nearly 100 yards.

My 22 CM barrel is a UM 18”.
I could try a PBB from LS Wild I guess to see if the 88’s would work ok in it, though an 88 @ 3000 still doesn’t match a 112 Match Burner @ 2900.

Wound channel differences with any of these projectiles are irrelevant to me. They all work exceptionally well on sheep/deer/moose. The highest gun number for forgiveness in mountain terrain & winds is the highest priority.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Considering moving back to a 6 CM. The 22 CM is so finicky with the highest BC bullets that I end up shooting the 80’s, which definitely give up wind drift and terminal range to the 112 MB’s. Ie. 8 vs 9 mph gun and nearly 100 yards.

My 22 CM barrel is a UM 18”.
I could try a PBB from LS Wild I guess to see if the 88’s would work ok in it, though an 88 @ 3000 still doesn’t match a 112 Match Burner @ 2900.

Wound channel differences with any of these projectiles are irrelevant to me. They all work exceptionally well on sheep/deer/moose. The highest gun number for forgiveness in mountain terrain & winds is the highest priority.

Both are cool

 

[Tanner]

Considering moving back to a 6 CM. The 22 CM is so finicky with the highest BC bullets that I end up shooting the 80’s, which definitely give up wind drift and terminal range to the 112 MB’s. Ie. 8 vs 9 mph gun and nearly 100 yards.

My 22 CM barrel is a UM 18”.
I could try a PBB from LS Wild I guess to see if the 88’s would work ok in it, though an 88 @ 3000 still doesn’t match a 112 Match Burner @ 2900.

Wound channel differences with any of these projectiles are irrelevant to me. They all work exceptionally well on sheep/deer/moose. The highest gun number for forgiveness in mountain terrain & winds is the highest priority.

I know you’ve shot both extensively, but in almost identical weight and built rifles, I could feel almost no detectable difference in recoil between my 22-250 and 6 Creed. 88s at 2950 and 115s at 2850, respectively… 6 just seems like such a perfect middle ground between ass kicking drop/drift and negligible recoil.

 

[david2duck]

Small sample. I have a 16” LS Wild barrel that really likes the 88’s. It’s running between 2950-3050 depending on lot number of powder. My 20” barrel from Clayton at West Texas Ordinance that also loves the 88’s is running 3150. We have 3 other LS barrels but haven’t screwed them on yet. Should have another barrel up and running in 2-4 wks.

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

I know you’ve shot both extensively, but in almost identical weight and built rifles, I could feel almost no detectable difference in recoil between my 22-250 and 6 Creed. 88s at 2950 and 115s at 2850, respectively… 6 just seems like such a perfect middle ground between ass kicking drop/drift and negligible recoil.

I feel the same way. My 6 CM last year was pretty much identical in felt recoil. You may be right about the perfect middle ground, atleast for wanting the characteristics I described.

Small sample. I have a 16” LS Wild barrel that really likes the 88’s. It’s running between 2950-3050 depending on lot number of powder. My 20” barrel from Clayton at West Texas Ordinance that also loves the 88’s is running 3150. We have 3 other LS barrels but haven’t screwed them on yet. Should have another barrel up and running in 2-4 wks.

That’s good to know. An 18” 22 CM sending 88’s at 3100 would be equivalent to the 112’s at 2900. But like a lot of us have found out, if your barrel doesn’t like the 88’s, you’re bumping back down to a lesser BC bullet.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

I feel the same way. My 6 CM last year was pretty much identical in felt recoil. You may be right about the perfect middle ground, atleast for wanting the characteristics I described.


That’s good to know. An 18” 22 CM sending 88’s at 3100 would be equivalent to the 112’s at 2900. But like a lot of us have found out, if your barrel doesn’t like the 88’s, you’re bumping back down to a lesser BC bullet.

Use a bullet that kills well and velocity trumps BC out to way past where most folks should be shooting at animals in the mountains.

I’d 100% prioritize what shoots well and become more proficient at making wind calls than I would fret over BC discrepancies.

77 TMKs in a 22 Creed is the answer in nearly all cases I’ve seen. A guy ain’t missing because of 88s versus 77s.

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

Use a bullet that kills well and velocity trumps BC out to way past where most folks should be shooting at animals in the mountains.

I’d 100% prioritize what shoots well and become more proficient at making wind calls than I would fret over BC discrepancies.

77 TMKs in a 22 Creed is the answer in nearly all cases I’ve seen. A guy ain’t missing because of 88s versus 77s.

I’d actually counter that that isn’t the case. I’ve had 2 sheep now where the wind was difficult to call in mountainous terrain and the POI was such, that 3” further off would have meant a wounded animal.

600 yards, 88 (3100) vs 77 (3200). 10 mph full value wind.
Difference is .25 mil. That’s 5” if my math is right.

Put another way, it’s the same wind drift difference as shooting a 112 MB from a 6 Creedmoor (2900) and a 6 UM (3200).

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

I’d actually counter that that isn’t the case. I’ve had 2 sheep now where the wind was difficult to call in mountainous terrain and the POI was such, that 3” further off would have meant a wounded animal.

It is the case though. When measured in shooting at realistic hunting ranges with shooters of all different skill levels, inside of let’s say 500 yards (way past where most should be shooting at animals in the mountains)… hits on 12” plates with identical 22 Creedmoors, with one shooting 77 TMKs and one shooting 88 ELDMs, we see no measurable discrepancy. Regardless of wind conditions.

The main point in all of it is, we almost never miss because of a bad wind call or because of a couple BC points. We sure like to blame the wind though (guilty as charged).

I think you might be one of the very few skilled and practiced enough for at the far fringes of the killing range for the BC “edge” to be taken advantage of.

In general I’m trying to get folks minds wrapped around that you don’t NEED the highest BC bullet going at close to catastrophic gun failure speeds to be able to kill animals in the mountains.

I’m probably one of the guiltiest on here of chasing high BC, high velocity, running unsafe loads etc. There’s nothing wrong with it at all, but I’ll never again shoot a 2.2MOA 22 Creed with 80s or 88s over a 1.3 MOA 22 Creed with 77 TMKs (as one example of many).

 

[ID_Matt]

Small sample. I have a 16” LS Wild barrel that really likes the 88’s. It’s running between 2950-3050 depending on lot number of powder. My 20” barrel from Clayton at West Texas Ordinance that also loves the 88’s is running 3150. We have 3 other LS barrels but haven’t screwed them on yet. Should have another barrel up and running in 2-4 wks.

Must be a top end load for sure. What powder?

Considering moving back to a 6 CM. The 22 CM is so finicky with the highest BC bullets that I end up shooting the 80’s, which definitely give up wind drift and terminal range to the 112 MB’s. Ie. 8 vs 9 mph gun and nearly 100 yards.

My 22 CM barrel is a UM 18”.
I could try a PBB from LS Wild I guess to see if the 88’s would work ok in it, though an 88 @ 3000 still doesn’t match a 112 Match Burner @ 2900.

Wound channel differences with any of these projectiles are irrelevant to me. They all work exceptionally well on sheep/deer/moose. The highest gun number for forgiveness in mountain terrain & winds is the highest priority.

I think i am in the same boat. Spun both a 6 creed and 22 creed barrel for a tikka action 2 years ago. Used the 6 creed last year and the 22 this year. No issues killing anything but the 22 with the 88’s just wasn’t real consistent. Say whatever a guy wants about ballistic charts and hit rates or whatever but the 6 creed just gives me more confidence being less finicky.

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

It is the case though. When measured in shooting at realistic hunting ranges with shooters of all different skill levels, inside of let’s say 500 yards (way past where most should be shooting at animals in the mountains)… hits on 12” plates with identical 22 Creedmoors, with one shooting 77 TMKs and one shooting 88 ELDMs, we see no measurable discrepancy. Regardless of wind conditions.

The main point in all of it is, we almost never miss because of a bad wind call or because of a couple BC points. We sure like to blame the wind though (guilty as charged).

I think you might be one of the very few skilled and practiced enough for at the far fringes of the killing range for the BC “edge” to be taken advantage of.

In general I’m trying to get folks minds wrapped around that you don’t NEED the highest BC bullet going at close to catastrophic gun failure speeds to be able to kill animals in the mountains.

I’m probably one of the guiltiest on here of chasing high BC, high velocity, running unsafe loads etc. There’s nothing wrong with it at all, but I’ll never again shoot a 2.2MOA 22 Creed with 80s or 88s over a 1.3 MOA 22 Creed with 77 TMKs (as one example of many).

I agree with most everything you’ve said as well, especially for the majority of the hunting population. From my experience, I think that the phrase that “we don’t miss from bad wind calls, it’s because of shooter error”, is thrown around too much. When you are an experienced shooter and know how to build stable positions, whether that’s on steel or an animal, it’s pretty apparent when you F up a wind call and make a correction that hits where you want it to, meaning it’s repeatable and not from a bad position, trigger pull or the like. Anytime you get into a higher level of performance, differences in an average vs good gun will be apparent.

Why else would the 6 UM be popular with guys wanting a gun with a great wind number when they could just shoot a 6 CM? And that’s the difference in BC from the 77 and 88 like I referenced.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

I agree with most everything you’ve said as well, especially for the majority of the hunting population. From my experience, I think that the phrase that “we don’t miss from bad wind calls, it’s because of shooter error”, is thrown around too much. When you are an experienced shooter and know how to build stable positions, whether that’s on steel or an animal, it’s pretty apparent when you F up a wind call and make a correction. Meaning it’s repeatable and not from a bad position, trigger pull or the like. Anytime you get into a higher level of performance, differences in an average vs good gun will be apparent.

Why else would the 6 UM be popular with guys wanting a gun with a great wind number when they could just shoot a 6 CM? And that’s the difference in BC from the 77 and 88 like I referenced.

I don’t really know anyone else throwing that phrase around haha. I only ever hear the opposite. Almost everyone I know 100% blames the wind instead of themselves. Again, once you’re at 22 Creedmoor speeds, we are not seeing hit rate discrepancies between 88s and 77s in the same wind on the same day.

How many times during training days have you made a wind call, shot and missed. Adjusted your wind call. Miss. Went back to original wind call, hit?
This is a daily occurrence when I take folks into the mountains.

The 6UM exits to extend the killing range and really nothing more. You also get like 50 rounds to a barrel so it’s gay haha.

 

[AndrewMT34]

Considering moving back to a 6 CM. The 22 CM is so finicky with the highest BC bullets that I end up shooting the 80’s, which definitely give up wind drift and terminal range to the 112 MB’s. Ie. 8 vs 9 mph gun and nearly 100 yards.

My 22 CM barrel is a UM 18”.
I could try a PBB from LS Wild I guess to see if the 88’s would work ok in it, though an 88 @ 3000 still doesn’t match a 112 Match Burner @ 2900.

Wound channel differences with any of these projectiles are irrelevant to me. They all work exceptionally well on sheep/deer/moose. The highest gun number for forgiveness in mountain terrain & winds is the highest priority.

I was also hoping to shoot the 88's out of my 22CM and ended up with the 80 ELDM because it wouldn't shoot the 88's. I attributed that to my 8tw barrel, but maybe the 88's are just finicky?

What twist barrel are you shooting?

 

[huntnful]

I agree with most everything you’ve said as well, especially for the majority of the hunting population. From my experience, I think that the phrase that “we don’t miss from bad wind calls, it’s because of shooter error”, is thrown around too much. When you are an experienced shooter and know how to build stable positions, whether that’s on steel or an animal, it’s pretty apparent when you F up a wind call and make a correction that hits where you want it to, meaning it’s repeatable and not from a bad position, trigger pull or the like. Anytime you get into a higher level of performance, differences in an average vs good gun will be apparent.

Why else would the 6 UM be popular with guys wanting a gun with a great wind number when they could just shoot a 6 CM? And that’s the difference in BC from the 77 and 88 like I referenced.

Am I hearing that Ben wants to shoot something that’s decent in the wind???? I have extra 195 Berger’s and N570 in the lab over here

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

How many times during training days have you made a wind call, shot and missed. Adjusted your wind call. Miss. Went back to original wind call, hit?

Honestly, I can’t think of a time that was the case.

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

I was also hoping to shoot the 88's out of my 22CM and ended up with the 80 ELDM because it wouldn't shoot the 88's. I attributed that to my 8tw barrel, but maybe the 88's are just finicky?

What twist barrel are you shooting?

7.5 twist. The 88’s and the 80 X’s both seem to have the reputation of either working or not, regardless of barrel specs.

 

[waspocrew]

Nothing wrong with going back to the 6 CM instead of the 22 CM. I really don't find much difference in recoil, etc between the two.

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

Am I hearing that Ben wants to shoot something that’s decent in the wind???? I have extra 195 Berger’s and N570 in the lab over here

I’ll see myself out of the 22 Creed thread and meet you in the middle in the 6mm one

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Nothing wrong with going back to the 6 CM instead of the 22 CM. I really don't find much difference in recoil, etc between the two.