Switching to loose powder finally

[LCguy]

After another inconsistent day at the range, I am finally going to make the switch to loose powder. My groups with my CVA Wolf V2, T7 pellets and cheddite primers are always lights out (sub 1") at 50 yards with both Hornady Bore Drivers and Barnes Expander hollow points but always open way up at 100 yards. Are the groups still good enough to kill an elk or deer? Yes. Are they good enough for me? No. Especially since I drew a premium unit for elk. I drew the same hunt last year and had multiple opportunities at 300+ bulls.

So I am making the switch to loose powder. My local Cabelas always has Triple 7 FFG in stock so I will be using that. I'm open to different primers to try out. I only use the cheddite because a local gun shop has a ton in stock for cheap. My hope is to use the Barnes or Federal BOR Lok 350 gr. lead bullets for elk and the bore drivers for deer. I have killed a cow elk with bore drivers in the past but would like a more stout bullet for elk.

Anyone have a similar set up and have any tips/advice/load data to help out with?

 

[ElDiablito]

My groups with my CVA Wolf V2, T7 pellets and cheddite primers are always lights out (sub 1") at 50 yards with both Hornady Bore Drivers and Barnes Expander hollow points but always open way up at 100 yards.

What’s happening between 50 and 100 yards? Open sights? Shooter input?

 

[LCguy]

Yes, using open sights. I'm getting around 4 inch groups at 100. I'm using a EABCO peep rib and a Williams front globe with the 0.019 green insert.

I'm sure there is some shooter input issues but I am usually pretty good about calling that out to myself before I even look down range. Obviously not perfect.

I'm hoping that maybe going down to 90 or 95 grains will really tighten the groups up.

I'm also curious if barrel temperature has anything to do with it? The last few times I've gone out it has been in the 80s to start and warming up to the mid-90s.

 

[ElDiablito]

Sabots don’t like heat so you definitely need to let the barrel cool sufficiently.

As for the groups opening up - my bet is it’s the sights. Nothing magical happens between 50 and 100 yards. If youre consistently shooting ragged holes at 50, your 100 yard groups should be roughly twice as large.

 

[LCguy]

Might try putting a cross hair insert in with the fiber optic sight. I will also try to be a little more disciplined with my shooting approach. Still going to give the loose powder a shot so I have more control over charges and velocities.

 

[ElDiablito]

Still going to give the loose powder a shot so I have more control over charges and velocities.

Definitely the way to go.

 

[KnightExtreme]

With T7 are you swabbing between shots? As a crud ring can lower accurancy, so keeping powder build up down is important & could also widen your longer range groups. As you did not mention your process between shots.
Just a thought.
KnightExtreme

 

[LCguy]

With T7 are you swabbing between shots? As a crud ring can lower accurancy, so keeping powder build up down is important & could also widen your longer range groups. As you did not mention your process between shots.
Just a thought.
KnightExtreme

Yes, I run two wet and two dry through after every shot. Usually with windex but sometimes with dawn soap and water.

 

[KnightExtreme]

Thanks for the clarification.
KnightExtreme

 

[LCguy]

For added context, I'm about 2 inches high at 50 yards but then about 5-6 inches at 100. I'm assuming some of that is user error but that is the most frustrating part of the groupings. Then when I adjust, I'm way too low at 50.

I would like my zero to be in that 75-100 yard range because I usually am hunting PJ where I can very easily get within 50-100 yards. For example, I killed my cow at 30 yards two years ago and was at 73 and 84 on two different bulls last year. Shots didn't line up but the units ?I hunt, I can get very close.

 

[RagnCajn]

I would recommend against the 350gr Bor-Lok. I knocked down a nice bull with one not long after they came out. Slightly quartering to, hit him in the shoulder. He rolled around and flopped for a few seconds as I tried to reload then got up and trotted over a ridge. Tracked a tiny blood trail for a half mile until it stopped. I think the bullet came apart without getting into the vitals. I had the bullet pushing 2000fps with Blackburn 209 if 8 remember correctly.

Now I shoot No Excuses 460gr lead conicals at around 1450fps. Accurate is great and they pass through shoulders and then keep passing through. Seen one on a frontal shot pass all the way through the body cavity and through a hindquarter on a large bull stopping under the hide.

After my failure and research and then seeing what lead conicals are capable of the biggest takeaway for me was to not push the velocity. Otherwise they can splash. Thats why so many people have issues with powerbelts. Soft lead and light bullets pushed fast.

That lost bull haunts me to this day. Nice 6x6 chasing a cow on opening day. 30 yards. Its hard to think about. Haven't gotten a shot on one that nice since.

 

[LCguy]

Just wanted to give an update. This weekend at the range I got my setup dialed with 90grV of Triple 7 with both the Barnes T-ez 290 grain and Barnes Expander MZ giving me 2-inch groups at 100 yards with harvester crush rib sabots. After speaking with Barnes and looking at ballistics data, I will be able to achieve full expansion to about 150 yards with either of these two bullets with this charge and I personally don't plan on shooting any further than 125 yards. I do plan on experimenting with 110 grV Triple 7 on my next range day. I did shoot one 50-yard group with 110 grV that grouped virtually identical to the 90grV charge so I will shoot a few groups at 100 on the next range day.