Suppressor causing chamber condensation

[wind gypsy]

Are you required to use chamber flags when not shooting?

If so I recommend this: https://www.amazon.com/MagnetoSpeed-RifleKuhl-Barrel-Cooler-Red/dp/B07TLF4KKY

Will cool you down and act as a chamber flag.

I have one, fair point that if I have to use a chamber flag anyway i could just use that. From the 2 range trips where I had issues it seems this could become problematic over the course of 1 stage before a fan is even installed. I never use chamber flags at the range but 'spose it might not be as big a headache as Im making it out to be.

 

[Lawnboi]

I have one, fair point that if I have to use a chamber flag anyway i could just use that. From the 2 range trips where I had issues it seems this could become problematic over the course of 1 stage before a fan is even installed. I never use chamber flags at the range but 'spose it might not be as big a headache as Im making it out to be.

I have shot a few matches suppressed in conditions that would cause problems and I never had an issue during a stage, and it seems that the wait to the next is long enough to let things dry.

I do use a Magpul fan right away though. Always pushes out a big puff of smoke

 

[wind gypsy]

Did a little experiment today because temps were in the teens with wind in the face. My lone peak 6.5x47 gamer gun has a 28” barrel and typically wears a brake. The tikka 6.5 creedmoor that has been being a bitch with bolt lift typically has a suppressor on it. So I switched up the brake and suppressor between the rifles.

After 20 rds, the action on x47 with suppressor was a little gummier feeling on lift but resistance was still light. Brass necks showed notably more carbon as round count grew.

The tikka 6.5 creedmoor with a brake had no stickiness with bolt lift on 30+ rounds. I put the suppressor back on it and after 6 rounds the bolt lift was heavy again. These are not hot rounds by any means. It was Norma factory 130 match ammo going a whopping 2700 FPS through the 24” barrel. The lone peak x47 was pushing 140 JLKs 2755 fps avg over h4350 so likely higher pressure than the creedmoor.

Might have to ditch shooting this rifle suppressed in the cold because it’s annoying as hell.

 

[Lawnboi]

Did a little experiment today because temps were in the teens with wind in the face. My lone peak 6.5x47 gamer gun has a 28” barrel and typically wears a brake. The tikka 6.5 creedmoor that has been being a bitch with bolt lift typically has a suppressor on it. So I switched up the brake and suppressor between the rifles.

After 20 rds, the action on x47 with suppressor was a little gummier feeling on lift but resistance was still light. Brass necks showed notably more carbon as round count grew.

The tikka 6.5 creedmoor with a brake had no stickiness with bolt lift on 30+ rounds. I put the suppressor back on it and after 6 rounds the bolt lift was heavy again. These are not hot rounds by any means. It was Norma factory 130 match ammo going a whopping 2700 FPS through the 24” barrel. The lone peak x47 was pushing 140 JLKs 2755 fps avg over h4350 so likely higher pressure than the creedmoor.

Might have to ditch shooting this rifle suppressed in the cold because it’s annoying as hell.

It is annoying. I have never had it happen with my 223 strangely so I mainly shoot that in the cold.

Or shoot like in a match, 10 rapid shots followed by 30 minutes of sitting

I also don’t know if the tikka is maybe more prone to bolt thrust than a 90* custom. My defiance does not exhibit issues as quickly as my tikka

 

[wind gypsy]

It is annoying. I have never had it happen with my 223 strangely so I mainly shoot that in the cold.

Or shoot like in a match, 10 rapid shots followed by 30 minutes of sitting

I also don’t know if the tikka is maybe more prone to bolt thrust than a 90* custom. My defiance does not exhibit issues as quickly as my tikka

Same for me with 223. I put 40 rounds through the tikka 223 today as well with a suppressor and no hints of similar behavior.

I think the tikkas definitely are more prone to bolt thrust or they just don’t have as much mechanical advantage for extraction. They sure seem to exhibit stiff bolt lift quicker than my other actions.

 

[HandgunHTR]

I also don’t know if the tikka is maybe more prone to bolt thrust than a 90* custom. My defiance does not exhibit issues as quickly as my tikka

I think the tikkas definitely are more prone to bolt thrust or they just don’t have as much mechanical advantage for extraction. They sure seem to exhibit stiff bolt lift quicker than my other actions.

I don't think "bolt thrust" is quite the right term as that has a lot more to do with the cartridge case design and pressures, but I do understand where you are going with this.

A 90* bolt is always going to be easier to open than a 60* bolt due to having a longer camming action (i.e. the force to open is spread over a longer distance). On a round with limited body taper, this will be even more evident. Add in increased carbon due to the suppressor and you are just stacking issues.

 

[Lawnboi]

I don't think "bolt thrust" is quite the right term as that has a lot more to do with the cartridge case design and pressures, but I do understand where you are going with this.

A 90* bolt is always going to be easier to open than a 60* bolt due to having a longer camming action (i.e. the force to open is spread over a longer distance). On a round with limited body taper, this will be even more evident. Add in increased carbon due to the suppressor and you are just stacking issues.

I’m speaking bolt thrust as it relates specifically to this anomaly that sometimes happens. I don’t know what else to call it because it’s not pressure, but can appear as pressure sometimes on the case. Iv shot in these conditions enough that I know it’s not causing any more velocity. I only have one custom action which is why I wonder. It’s not even causing a remotely stiff bolt, nor is it showing the same signs as say my tikka 22 creed would.

But yea a properly timed 90* action should normally seem easier, I can understand that.

Interesting bringing case design into it too. Maybe it’s the body taper on the 223 and 3006 that keep it less prone to bolt thrust issues with dirty chambers.

 

[SloppyJ]

Following. I've noticed some odd hard bolt lifts that I assumed were pressure spikes or bad sizing at matches.

Ill see if I can replicate it with a head on wind.

I also feel like i reached preasuee early in my 6cm but I have confirmed my brass is a bit under typical capacity of load data.

 

[HandgunHTR]

I’m speaking bolt thrust as it relates specifically to this anomaly that sometimes happens. I don’t know what else to call it because it’s not pressure, but can appear as pressure sometimes on the case. Iv shot in these conditions enough that I know it’s not causing any more velocity. I only have one custom action which is why I wonder. It’s not even causing a remotely stiff bolt, nor is it showing the same signs as say my tikka 22 creed would.

But yea a properly timed 90* action should normally seem easier, I can understand that.

Interesting bringing case design into it too. Maybe it’s the body taper on the 223 and 3006 that keep it less prone to bolt thrust issues with dirty chambers.

Yep, I understand what you are trying to convey.

Interestingly, cartridges with less body taper tend to exhibit more bolt thrust (rearward force on the boltface during firing) than those with less body taper. That is why you see a lot of "improved" case wildcats for break action firearms, specifically the TC Contender. A standard 30-30 case exhibits more rearward force during firing than that same case that has the body taper removed such as in the 30 Herret, 7-30 Waters, 30-30AI, etc.
The mechanism is that the case body will better grip the chamber walls under pressure and therefore have less rearward thrust.
In the case that you and wind gypsy are experiencing it seems to be the lack of bolt thrust (rearward thrust) that is causing the issue. Based on what you are describing your cases are actually gripping the chamber more and causing stiff bolt lift (similar to a clicker).
It is being exasperated when using a Tikka action due to having to overcome that larger force over a shorter distance (shorter force curve).

 

[General RE LEE]

I have this EXACT same issue and it’s not discussed when suppressors get heaps and heaps of praise.

When my suppressor starts to get hot at the range, I get annoying stiff bolt lift and ejector marks on my brass. I have to let everything cool way down and start over. It’s a bitch when doing load development with a can cause it creates false pressure signs.

I’ve been told it’s just back pressure accumulating in the can. Have to let everything settle down.

Dont get me wrong I see the benefits of a can, but I’m on the fence if I even want to thread my incoming Tikka Lite 6.5 PRC. Sometimes I just want an old school hunting rifle.

 

[id_jon]

Another thing to add to Tikkas, I had a bolt that started getting heavy bolt lift even on an empty chamber. Ended up disassembling the bolt, cleaning everything, and lightly greasing the cocking ramp, that fixed that. One more thing to check to eliminate a variable at least.