So you want to shoot Trad

[Ahutch]

Tater, you just ooze with positivity....

Be blessed man!


Hutch

 

[TaterTot]

Tater, you just ooze with positivity....

Be blessed man!


Hutch

You ooze with something you should probably see a Dr about.

 

[Cove-Creek]

Great thread with lots of good info for not only beginners, but any archer looking to take their shooting to the next level.

 

[Where's Bruce?]

I will add one thing that new shooters absolutely must do. Shoot a lot! You will get frustrated at first, trying different methods and having piss poor groups but eventually you'll find a sweet spot that enables you to shoot accurately, if only at 15 yards. Then start backing up in small increments...a foot to no more than 5 yards. Keep shooting. After a while the muscle memory kicks in and you can begin shooting from various distances and angles (without range finding) just from shooting naturally. You can learn to shoot a compound accurately very fast...trad is the opposite of that. My first year was brutal, now I am starting to finally get consistent. It's a love-hate sport...you will either love it or hate it. It's a lot more fun to shoot a stick bow if you enjoy a challenge...if not, stay with your CB. Trad isn't for everyone. You need the patience of Jobe to get good at it. It is an amazing feeling to hit the center of the target from something like 28 yards...a feeling you will never get from a compound. Your form is everything and that doesn't happen overnight. You need to shoot daily, even if only one arrow. Discipline is a requirement. There is a point during your trad journey where you become one with the bow and your confidence grows because you have surpassed the trials and tribulations and achieved a sense of comfort gauging distance and can just feel the sweet spot when releasing your arrow. Getting to this point requires a lot of shooting. Good luck.

 

[Ahutch]

AMEN!!!!



Hutch

 

[Beendare]

For the knowledge base;
deleted

 

[Ahutch]

Lol... Ya the first one ain't nothing but talking about it. But ya there good, I think so anyways


Hutch

 

[sneaky]

Tater, you just ooze with positivity....

Be blessed man!


Hutch

Well, I followed Asbell around a 3D course at a shoot. He was one target ahead of our group and shooting by himself. There were 4 of us in our group. We were constantly having to wait on him. He was shooting over targets, under targets, behind targets etc etc. When you watch a guy who gives seminars and writes books on trad shooting miss 3 targets in a row, none over 20 yards, you begin to realize he's all hat and no cattle. He spent more time looking for arrows than he did shooting. Another round we were behind a kid, about 6'3" using one of those 48" Bear SuperMags. Swing drawing. Straight out of the Asbell playbook. Couldn't hit the broad side of a barn, and never drew to anchor. I'm not a fan of Asbell or his shooting method. His wool stuff is pretty nice though.

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[sneaky]

For the knowledge base;

Ex Olympian Jake Kaminsky has a series of vids on Barebow form that is excellent.

The Grip and Rip guys will find these breakdowns of the shot process tedious ( and they are!) but if you get the concepts he is teaching it will make you a better shot.

Here is one in the series;

He shot in the Known 50 class, now known as Known Pro, at an ASA shoot in London, KY several years back. Finished day 1 like 3pts off the lead. The compound guys were like "have you seen that dude shooting a recurve? He's in the top 5!". I was laughing telling them that "dude" is one of our Olympic shooters and 50yds is one of their short shots . Guess they've never watched, or shot, a field round.

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[Beendare]

Deleted
…

 

[Ahutch]

Jakes videos have already improved my shooting. Littles things I wasn't aware of. My shot cycle is smoother, I don't fight my anchor. A good overall improvement. Highly recommend anyone to atleast check them out.


Hutch

 

[Foggy Mountain]

Guys you don’t need to be a perfect archer to be a great coach. A guy I teach with is state champ, his grip isn’t perfect. We don’t teach his grip but it works for him. Another instructor coached 2 girls to state champ, he doesn’t compete himself.
I agree you def need to be careful where advice comes from, lots of contradictory/confusing things things posted but the idea is a great coach/teacher/instructor, they don’t necessarily have to be a competitor themselves. Even if they are doesn’t mean you should mimic them.
This is Trad but look at Rio, (hes a compound guy he leans back far enough to be in 2 zip codes) but try and outshoot the man.

 

[Boxerboxer]

ALL; Post up any of the free internet resources to improve your shooting you like.

I think the video series at 3 rivers, "Masters of the Barebow" #1 and #3 are a great resource with top pros breaking down the components of a shot....and breaking down the different aiming techniques.


Most of these guys I'm recommending on Youtube have multiple good vids in addition to the ones here;
Arne Moe

I would add that if you're anywhere near Arne (Grand Rapids, MN), drop him a message on Facebook or find his number on the NTS Coach Finder website and set up a lesson. Great guy who has invested heavily in the next gen of archers.

 

[Rick M.]

200$ is a lot of money to a lot of people… I totally agree with spending money on a coach, but trad archery doesn’t have to be expensive… being compulsive and impatient is expensive.. but if a guy had self discipline and watch the classifieds, you could have 200-300$ in a rig that would last a lifetime and shoot as good as anything out there.. don’t get me wrong… I’ve spent a small fortune on shit that I’ve sold and rebought and sold, etc… but didn’t have to be that way.. my first bow was a black bear warf with TT BM2.0, and I guarantee you I now can shoot that bow as good as any ow out there…

Couldn't agree more. My first bow was a used Bowtech Tomkat (granted I'm talking compounds, but the notion is the same) and to this day it's my favorite and best performing of all the bows I've owned, including top of the line flagship models from Hoyt, Bowtech, and Mathews. That little bow was lights out. I regret selling it. If I could give any advice, it would be to never start at the top of the line.

 

[mattflint]

Man this is a freakin fantastic thread.

 

[bjfoxhoven]

Few points:
Consistency is as important as form (I know a guy who has won many competitions and set state records with a plucking type release, however, it’s exactly the same every time). Exact repeatable grip. Same hook with same finger pressure on the string. Direction of push toward the target, follow through, shoulder height, etc. change one of those things and shoot a bareshaft at 20 yards…it’s one of the best teachers there is out there.

I enjoy this thread for what it offers. People that are in this site are here to learn, pick people’s brain on certain topics, get better, etc. I get taters points too. This is a lot of info in one spot. And hopefully it doesn’t overwhelm anyone and keep them from jumping into trad, because it’s such a fun journey.

It’s so easy to start bad habits in this spot that creep back so easily, i think it’s imperative to get the form as close to right as possible from the get go.

@Beendare stated a while back that feathers do wonders for covering up a bad shot and straightening out the arrow. This is no small statement. I shoot trad vanes because they are so quiet and easy maintenance , and I wanna lessen the chance a deer ducks the arrow. However, it’s easier to have bad flight with traffic canes because the feathers offer so much more drag due to the resistance they offer…. Perfect arrow flight is probably the number 1 factor in penetration, so I’ve contemplated changing back, but haven’t yet.

 

[North Idaho Stickbow]

I depend a lot on good fletching since I use woodies. I’ll bareshaft a couple of them too, but the fletching makes a big difference.

 

[Kevin Dill]

A gazillion years ago I was learning to shoot a recurve with no instruction. A guy with a line of BS a mile long told me: "Son, this ain't no compound thing. Shootin' a real bow instinctive is like a martial art. You just need to keep shootin' and doin' it until your arrows start smacking each other. You'll be able to use that bow like a throwin' a boomerang". And sadly....I bought it. I thought I would be the next Ben Pearson or something. Some days I could hit a golf ball at 40 yards and miss a milk jug at 20. I endured years of screwy shooting and accuracy....some of it not fun....and had confidence issues. I actually lost trust in my ability to be accurate when it counted.

While pondering all this one day the simple reality hit me. Form, consistency, technique, strength and confidence WILL produce accuracy, assuming good equipment. These are exactly the same requirements for accuracy with a compound bow. I suddenly realized how I'd discarded all the things I'd learned by shooting a compound in favor of finding some new and magical pathway to stickbow accuracy. You can throw a football the wrong way every day for years and call yourself a quarterback: It doesn't mean you're even halfway qualified or good at it.

In my case I had to relearn how to shoot. I live way in the country in a sparsely populated county, so no coaches. I had to do it myself. It was hard and I took my time with it. The things I eliminated were perhaps the most important:

Snap shooting
Not anchoring
Loose bow arm
String plucking
Lack of focus
Lack of adequate strength
Lack of confidence

Strength is absolutely critical. If I can't pull a bow to complete full draw and hold it at least 3 seconds without a tremor or shake, then I'm over-bowed at the moment. Building muscle is cheaper (and maybe faster) than acquiring another bow. I can handle a 65 pound longbow with zero shake after enough weeks of practice. When I'm weak, I'm inaccurate and that's a basic for me. Strong enough to make full draw and instantly release isn't good enough for me. Personally I think too many guys get a stickbow and start trying to be accurate WAY before they should realistically. It takes months to build adequate strength, repetitive form and dependable consistency. Only then should most newcomers start paying attention to accuracy. It seldom works that way according to what I see,

 

[TaterTot]

A gazillion years ago I was learning to shoot a recurve with no instruction. A guy with a line of BS a mile long told me: "Son, this ain't no compound thing. Shootin' a real bow instinctive is like a martial art. You just need to keep shootin' and doin' it until your arrows start smacking each other. You'll be able to use that bow like a throwin' a boomerang". And sadly....I bought it. I thought I would be the next Ben Pearson or something. Some days I could hit a golf ball at 40 yards and miss a milk jug at 20. I endured years of screwy shooting and accuracy....some of it not fun....and had confidence issues. I actually lost trust in my ability to be accurate when it counted.

While pondering all this one day the simple reality hit me. Form, consistency, technique, strength and confidence WILL produce accuracy, assuming good equipment. These are exactly the same requirements for accuracy with a compound bow. I suddenly realized how I'd discarded all the things I'd learned by shooting a compound in favor of finding some new and magical pathway to stickbow accuracy. You can throw a football the wrong way every day for years and call yourself a quarterback: It doesn't mean you're even halfway qualified or good at it.

In my case I had to relearn how to shoot. I live way in the country in a sparsely populated county, so no coaches. I had to do it myself. It was hard and I took my time with it. The things I eliminated were perhaps the most important:

Snap shooting
Not anchoring
Loose bow arm
String plucking
Lack of focus
Lack of adequate strength
Lack of confidence

Strength is absolutely critical. If I can't pull a bow to complete full draw and hold it at least 3 seconds without a tremor or shake, then I'm over-bowed at the moment. Building muscle is cheaper (and maybe faster) than acquiring another bow. I can handle a 65 pound longbow with zero shake after enough weeks of practice. When I'm weak, I'm inaccurate and that's a basic for me. Strong enough to make full draw and instantly release isn't good enough for me. Personally I think too many guys get a stickbow and start trying to be accurate WAY before they should realistically. It takes months to build adequate strength, repetitive form and dependable consistency. Only then should most newcomers start paying attention to accuracy. It seldom works that way according to what I see,

Great post. Lots of truth there. I honestly think a lot of what guys call target panic comes from people just not being honest with themselves about what they can pull. I'm guilty of it myself. If you can get the bow back but you can't settle in and have to release then you are over bowed. Every bad shot you take will reinforce bad form and makes you worse.

Although you said it much more eloquently than I did we essentially have the same message. It's the same as welding or whatever. First you need to get good then speed will come (or in the case of archery, accuracy).

I haven't been shooting nearly as long as many here but I realized very early on that my first approach to the sport was all wrong. I was worried about tuning, accuracy, what my strings made of, how much foc my arrow has etc etc all to the detriment of actually learning how to shoot.

There's plenty of time to worry about matching the colours of your nocks to the pinstripes in your bow string after you build your fundamentals.

 

[TaterTot]

Few points:
Consistency is as important as form (I know a guy who has won many competitions and set state records with a plucking type release, however, it’s exactly the same every time). Exact repeatable grip. Same hook with same finger pressure on the string. Direction of push toward the target, follow through, shoulder height, etc. change one of those things and shoot a bareshaft at 20 yards…it’s one of the best teachers there is out there.

I enjoy this thread for what it offers. People that are in this site are here to learn, pick people’s brain on certain topics, get better, etc. I get taters points too. This is a lot of info in one spot. And hopefully it doesn’t overwhelm anyone and keep them from jumping into trad, because it’s such a fun journey.

It’s so easy to start bad habits in this spot that creep back so easily, i think it’s imperative to get the form as close to right as possible from the get go.

@Beendare stated a while back that feathers do wonders for covering up a bad shot and straightening out the arrow. This is no small statement. I shoot trad vanes because they are so quiet and easy maintenance , and I wanna lessen the chance a deer ducks the arrow. However, it’s easier to have bad flight with traffic canes because the feathers offer so much more drag due to the resistance they offer…. Perfect arrow flight is probably the number 1 factor in penetration, so I’ve contemplated changing back, but haven’t yet.

Keeping a bareshaft in my quiver has done wonders for my shooting when practicing. It keeps you honest.

I think a lot of people get overwhelmed when starting, I know I did, and worry about things that don't matter. Well they don't matter until you can actually shoot.