Sidearm for Brooks Range, AK

[Salmonchaser]

Actually Kevin two separate effects. What H and I were talking about as the case is extracted it draws blood etc into the barrel just like a syringe.

 

[Kevin Dill]

Salmonchaser, I like your thinking and experience on this topic. I understand your perspective on the syringe effect. For that to actually happen (blood drawn or pulled into the barrel and action) there would need to be negative pressure at the muzzle. Shell ejection is of course caused by explosive gas energy operating the bolt. I'm having trouble understanding how there could be negative muzzle pressure at that time. In any event, I would say most guys wouldn't rule a gun in or out based on how it performs in a muzzle-against-bear shot...given the extreme unlikeliness of ever having the need for it.

I always think these discussions end up being a wash, with each firearm type having pluses and minuses. One is not clearly better than another in all respects. Some will prefer more capacity while some prefer more energy per round. Each can argue for or against reliability. Each gun can be quite accurate. I have yet to hear or see documentation of either weapon jamming or failing in a true bear attack defensive shooting. Theory perhaps. Reality not so much?

I can speak from experience when I say that any handgun feels woefully insufficient when a 500+ pound grizzly is lurking nearby.

 

[Salmonchaser]

Salmonchaser, I like your thinking and experience on this topic. I understand your perspective on the syringe effect. For that to actually happen (blood drawn or pulled into the barrel and action) there would need to be negative pressure at the muzzle. Shell ejection is of course caused by explosive gas energy operating the bolt. I'm having trouble understanding how there could be negative muzzle pressure at that time. In any event, I would say most guys wouldn't rule a gun in or out based on how it performs in a muzzle-against-bear shot...given the extreme unlikeliness of ever having the need for it.

I always think these discussions end up being a wash, with each firearm type having pluses and minuses. One is not clearly better than another in all respects. Some will prefer more capacity while some prefer more energy per round. Each can argue for or against reliability. Each gun can be quite accurate. I have yet to hear or see documentation of either weapon jamming or failing in a true bear attack defensive shooting. Theory perhaps. Reality not so much?

I can speak from experience when I say that any handgun feels woefully insufficient when a 500+ pound grizzly is lurking nearby.

I never saw the syringe thing in real life, sleeping on it I recall an old instructor from Seattle pd tell us if we saw it, it ain’t suicide.
Amazing what happens when you can later measure the distance in feet not yards. The only thing that comes close to the adrenaline dumps I experienced in swat.

 

[Salmonchaser]

Having a little fun with the Lt, (me) and heading down to the WTO riots when Bill and Hillary were president. Me in the middle.
Good times still rather hunt and fish

 

[thinhorn_AK]

Nice thing with a revolver: If you experience a misfire or dead round, another pull of the trigger has you in action again.

Unless a bullet has jumped it’s crimp then your revolver is 100% out of service. With an auto you could just rack it again.

 

[Kevin Dill]

Unless a bullet has jumped it’s crimp then your revolver is 100% out of service. With an auto you could just rack it again.

Correct. Which is why you always shoot quality loads from companies like Buffalo Bore and others, following their recommendations for bullet weight and energy (pressures). And you always shoot the loads you depend on (to save your life) multiple times in practice to assure consistent performance and handling by your firearm.

I don't sweat bullet creep in my 329 because I stay with reasonable weight bullets and pressures in a defensive load created and tested for that gun.

 

[mcseal2]

Kevin are you using the Buffalo Bore 255 grain?

I tried it in my 4” S&W 69 and the recoil is enough that I dont shoot it well. I am considering trying the underwood 220gr or 160gr lehigh bullet ammo. I got a flinch from rifle shooting and have it under control now. I dont want that problem to come back with a handgun or rifle, and the 44 with that ammo is enough to cause me to flinch. I shot the 44 really well with magtech ammo at 750lbs of energy and that level of recoil. Thats real close to 357 or 10mm hot loads though. That seems to be about the max recoil level I can shoot currently without my subconscious mind factoring in recoil and increasing the likelihood of a flinch.

 

[Kevin Dill]

Kevin are you using the Buffalo Bore 255 grain?

I tried it in my 4” S&W 69 and the recoil is enough that I dont shoot it well.

Yes....255 Keith (hard-cast, wad-cutter) which hits hard in both directions. I practice with padded gloves as there's a 95% chance I'll be wearing gloves in any bear encounter. Yes...that round in that gun (329PD) is a hand-shocker. But I don't flinch and have never had it bother me mentally. I know in any bear encounter ALL of us will be trigger-jerking when the brain gives a green light to the finger. There's basic accuracy, and there's accuracy under simulated conditions. That's all we can measure or evaluate. I'm not totally convinced those things matter (as much) when the lid blows off the pressure cooker and a nasty bear is 3 seconds from impact.[/QUOTE]