Rock climbing style harness

[pirogue]

I looked at that “Xop Holiday” harness on line. The pictures I see show no metal loop on the side. I would not call, nor ever use, a belt loop sewn on the side, a “linesman loop”, and hang my positioning strap metal clips into that.

 

[N2TRKYS]

Lineman loops are useless to me and definitely not needed. I’ve been using a Black Diamond Vario Speed harness for years. Works great and way safer than a full body harness that attaches between the shoulder blades.

 

[WanderingFarmer]

XOP Holiday was great for me last year. One caveat, read the manual on how to attach your tether for fall protection. It’s not as simple as “carabiner through the loop”

 

[kpk]

I looked at that “Xop Holiday” harness on line. The pictures I see show no metal loop on the side. I would not call, nor ever use, a belt loop sewn on the side, a “linesman loop”, and hang my positioning strap metal clips into that.

In the pic they have of it folded up, the linesmans loops look like it's an additional nylon sling sewn in around the backside of the waist belt. They're obviously not meant to fall on, but most slings are rated for like 5,000 lbs of static load.

 

[Macintosh]

I looked at that “Xop Holiday” harness on line. The pictures I see show no metal loop on the side. I would not call, nor ever use, a belt loop sewn on the side, a “linesman loop”, and hang my positioning strap metal clips into that.

why? the metal loops on an industrial work harness are sewn onto the harness using similar-strength webbing and using the exact same type of bartacks. As above ^^, this webbing bartacked this way will hold a force big enough that it'll kill a person...ie you will break before the harness does. It's not a "belt loop" or a gear loop, it's specifically built to be a weight-bearing part of the harness used for that specific purpose.
Metal loops are heavy, cumbersome and loud, and if you use a carabiner to attach your linemans belt, arent needed for strength or durability.

 

[JasonT]

XOP Holiday was great for me last year. One caveat, read the manual on how to attach your tether for fall protection. It’s not as simple as “carabiner through the loop”

Do you mind sharing on how they say to attach the tether? I looked online and couldn’t find a manual

 

[WanderingFarmer]

Do you mind sharing on how they say to attach the tether? I looked online and couldn’t find a manual

No problem, pretty standard from what I’ve experienced with climbing harnesses. Basically, you want figure 8 knot that goes through the waist and leg straps. You can use the belay loop to rappel, but not recommend to stop a fall.

The picture below came with the harness. They don’t show a stopper knot on the tag end, but I tie one on there.

I’ve been experimenting with how to attach to the tree with it. So far, the quietest has been just using the knot to tie in at height, which means zero metal to deal with. Just a rope with a loop on one end. The only catch there is that once you’re tied in, it’s not a quick adjustment. That doesn’t seem to affect me and how I set up though.

 

[JasonT]

Thanks. That’s different than a few videos I watched.

 

[mtfallon]

I run the killdeer but thankfully haven’t fallen out yet!

 

[BowTrout]

I used a rock climbing harness for tree stand hunting for probably a decade. Recently switched to a small tree saddle that I use as a harness in my tree stand. I can't imagine trying to hunt with a full body harness, I think I'd rather sleep in a life jacket.

what saddle are you using?

 

[Mountain_Life]

XOP Mutant. Occasionally I use it without a stand but not often. I like using it as a harness and it also makes shooting odd angles and behind my tree more comfortable. Can hang a stand on the back of the tree if cover is limited.

 

[N2TRKYS]

No problem, pretty standard from what I’ve experienced with climbing harnesses. Basically, you want figure 8 knot that goes through the waist and leg straps. You can use the belay loop to rappel, but not recommend to stop a fall.

The picture below came with the harness. They don’t show a stopper knot on the tag end, but I tie one on there.

I’ve been experimenting with how to attach to the tree with it. So far, the quietest has been just using the knot to tie in at height, which means zero metal to deal with. Just a rope with a loop on one end. The only catch there is that once you’re tied in, it’s not a quick adjustment. That doesn’t seem to affect me and how I set up though.

I tie a figure 8 in the end of my tether line. I use it to attach to the tree by passing the line through the figure 8 loop around the tree. I attach the tether line to my harness via a prusik knot and a carabiner. That way I can easily adjust the length on the fly.

 

[cornfedkiller]

I've been using a rock climbing harness for a while (BD Vario Speed). I have a tree rope from HSS. Loop around the tree, rope goes under my arm to a prussic knot with a carabiner to my harness loop. Easy to adjust the slack and not in my way when I stand up.

 

[WanderingFarmer]

I tie a figure 8 in the end of my tether line. I use it to attach to the tree by passing the line through the figure 8 loop around the tree. I attach the tether line to my harness via a prusik knot and a carabiner. That way I can easily adjust the length on the fly.

I might be misunderstanding here, sometimes turning words into a mental image eludes me. How are you connecting the carabiner to the harness? Are you using the XOP Holiday harness?

I couldn’t get a carabiner to both connect to the leg and waist strap while being comfortable. If the harness manufacturer doesn’t say that the belay loop is fall rated, I’m not comfortable trusting it for that.

 

[JasonT]

I've been using a rock climbing harness for a while (BD Vario Speed). I have a tree rope from HSS. Loop around the tree, rope goes under my arm to a prussic knot with a carabiner to my harness loop. Easy to adjust the slack and not in my way when I stand up.

That seems the easiest, wonder why they don’t suggest that. If I get one that was going to be the route I take.

 

[Macintosh]

I might be misunderstanding here, sometimes turning words into a mental image eludes me. How are you connecting the carabiner to the harness? Are you using the XOP Holiday harness?

I couldn’t get a carabiner to both connect to the leg and waist strap while being comfortable. If the harness manufacturer doesn’t say that the belay loop is fall rated, I’m not comfortable trusting it for that.

This is standard for a climbing harness. That harness is tested to an ansi spec which is brand new, I'm not as familiar with it as I am with the EN and UIAA norms, but they're going to be virtually identical if not identical. (if someone wants to buy the standard for $66 you can compare to the UIAA standard). There is no standard test for a sit-style tree stand harness so XOP is simply following the certification communication standards for a climbing harness. That means--TIE in to both the waist and legs separately, and CLIP in to the belay loop only. This is what is shown in the instructions.

This accomplishes 2 things:
1) it prevents loading the gate of a carabiner when it is loaded in three directions (3=waist+legs+load), which is much, much weaker than when it is loaded on the major axis. Belay loops exist purely to provide a full-strength attachment for carabiners.
2) when tying in, it eliminates the belay loop so you are relying on fewer links in the chain. This is made for a climbing rope, which is desinged to take a long free-fall which results in a far higher force than it would likely achieve in a tree stand tether application.

They dont show you how to clip in with a prussik, becasue the instructions are from a climbing harness standard, not for a tree stand harness standard. Understand that the belay loop and tie-in on a harness is designed to hold a 15kn load, becasue that's more than the max your body can withstand before suffering major internal trauma. 15kn is just under 3400lb. A 7mm prussik will also hold roughly 3000lb depending on what it's tied to. But neither a prussik nor a rope grab was ever intended to be a primary safety device--prussiks slip, and most rope grabs are much less strong than a prussik and easily strip the sheath off your tether at pretty modest loads. Worrying about the strength of the belay loop is misplaced worry. If you are worried about anything, clip that prussik to the BELAY LOOP as it's intended and use it to position yourself on your stand, and then BACK IT UP by either clipping the tether below the prussik to your belay loop, or tying in with the end of the tether through the waist and legs.

I would be interested to see the full instructions for the holiday harness, it does not appear to be available on their website.

Edit: if you look at the videos on youtube featuring this harness they dont provide any instruction per se, but they show the xop guy both clipping in to the belay loop as well as running a combo tether/friction hitch directly thru the belay loop. Bottom line, they are using the belay loop because its a full-strength part of the harness designed specifically for the purpose.
This is the exception. This video has some good advice and does provide some instruction.

 

[Headwaters]

I've been using a Black Diamond harness for a few years and I like it more than a full body harness. If you fall, you'll be facing the tree and self rescue is much easier. As for securing myself to the tree, I have two "rated" locking carabiners clipped into a rope (11mm) with a figure eight knot on a bight on each end. You will have to decide the length of the rope. My rope is 5 ft. While climbing or hanging the stand, I run the rope around the tree and clip into the harness in front and adjust as I climb. When I get in the stand, I clip one of the carabiners back into the rope around the tree with a munter hitch. This creates friction on the rope but allows adjustments. I leave just enough slack in the rope between the harness and the tree to allow me to sit, stand and move left/right to shoot. This way if I slip or fall, I'm not falling more than 8-10 inches before the line tightens. You can also adjust the rope quickly for any shot possibilities.

 

[N2TRKYS]

I might be misunderstanding here, sometimes turning words into a mental image eludes me. How are you connecting the carabiner to the harness? Are you using the XOP Holiday harness?

I couldn’t get a carabiner to both connect to the leg and waist strap while being comfortable. If the harness manufacturer doesn’t say that the belay loop is fall rated, I’m not comfortable trusting it for that.

My harness is a single attachment in the front. I’m using a Black Diamond Vario Speed harness.

I only use one carabiner to attach myself to the tree.

 

[TonySkyline]

I use a black diamond and added the linemans loops. Love it but I'm likely getting an xop mostly because it packs down easier for travel and fitting inside a pack

 

[shwacker]

Be careful up there. A 10 foot fall can be pretty serious, especially alone in the woods, and a surprisingly short fall onto static equipment can break stuff that may seem strong. And beware taking advice on life critical equipment from strangers, online or otherwise.