Rifle scope in place of a spotting scope?

[rclouse79]

Nobody even mentioned looking at animals all day through a scope. It’s amazing that you even came to that conclusion. It’s pretty simple. Look through binoculars to locate/judge animals. Before you pull the trigger, confirm it’s what you want with a good scope. Easy peasy.

Fair enough. I am not a spotting scope or trophy guy so I am not probably qualified to even weigh in. I wonder how many start out with the idea you posted and end being the guy someone sees glassing them through their rifle scope? Seems like it could be a slippery slope from checking out the animal for a couple seconds before you pull the trigger to more extensive glassing if they are as optically amazing as you say.

 

[slim9300]

I am.

Keep in mind I own two spotters and have never even tried the OP’s idea. So if I verify it’s an animal and not a human with binos and then transition to a rifle scope for picking apart the detail, how is that unsafe?


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[BluMtn]

Glass in my direction with your rifle and we’ll have a talk.

Did I say that I scope indiscriminately. I have already identified that I am looking a game animal.

Using the logic that has been written here how in the heck do you ever shoot a game animal considering it might be another hunter. LOL

 

[slim9300]

Did I say that I scope indiscriminately. I have already identified that I am looking a game animal.

Using the logic that has been written here how in the heck do you ever shoot a game animal considering it might be another hunter. LOL

Exactly.


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[stan_wa]

It is hard to believe the intent of this post wasn’t to get people riled up. I was thinking about starting a thread titled “Rifle scope in place of binoculars, spotting scope and range finder” to see if I could make someone’s head explode before they even opened it.

When I asked the question I really had no idea it was going to turn into a safety discussion because I kind of figured the kind of people who read and comment on this forms are conscious enough to follow safety basics of not pointing guns at people. And my intent was to ask an optical performance question. I guess shame on me for assuming the best of people.
That is why in the middle of the first thread I simplified the question to “can a high power rifle scope optically compare to a compact spotter”. I got a full-time job I am a lot of responsibilities on my plate I assure you getting people angry on the Internet is not the best use of my time.

I appreciate the concern for safety it is important especially as out woods get more crowded and we introduce new hunters to the outdoors. Here in Washington mule deer is three-point minimum.I like talking to Hunters when I see em out on the tail, ask what gear they’re using what they’ve been seeing ect, I would say 75% of them do not carry a spotter. And most of them have Bino’s around their neck the cost less than $300. And somehow they are shooting legal bucks. Which means they are clearly looking at them through their rifle scope.
I’ll publicly promise not to look at a human with my rifle scope!

 

[Bubblehide]

When I asked the question I really had no idea it was going to turn into a safety discussion because I kind of figured the kind of people who read and comment on this forms are conscious enough to follow safety basics of not pointing guns at people. And my intent was to ask an optical performance question. I guess shame on me for assuming the best of people.
That is why in the middle of the first thread I simplified the question to “can a high power rifle scope optically compare to a compact spotter”. I got a full-time job I am a lot of responsibilities on my plate I assure you getting people angry on the Internet is not the best use of my time.

I read your post very early on, but refrained from comment previously. But here goes, because of my experiences while hunting, of having other hunters scope animals very near me, and scoping me directly I will respond. In many cases when the animal(s) being scoped were close to me, it appeared that I was being scoped. Frankly those experiences are a bit unnerving. I mean, do I try to pull my trigger before they shoot me, sit back and let them shoot me... I had one guy in Utah years ago, clearly scoping me, despite me waiving my arms around to try to get him to stop. Honest to God, I shouldered my rifle and took the safety off as I pointed my rifle at him. So coming from this mindset, I just cannot imagine using my scope as a spotting scope. I simply do not point my rifle and look through the scope, at anything, unless I have already determined I am going to shoot it given a good shot opportunity. This comes from a guy that has been shot at, has had bullet fragments removed from his upper left shoulder, and has shot more than one person, killing them. I do not take the pointing of my weapon in any direction lightly, as the results can be un-reversible in the blink of an eye. By the way, that hunter in Utah was less that a split second away from being shot; the last thing I wanted to do. But I would rather be left dealing with the shit-storm that would have happened, and still be alive, then be shot by him. So despite your lack of seeing it as a safety issue, it has great potential of being a safety issue. But then, I have several times, pulled out the spotter to look at slight movement I spotted glassing at distance with my binoculars, only to find another hunter(s). If I did that with my rifle scope, it would be a safety issue (we do not need hunter orange in Ca).

I get your weight savings logic. But for the life of me, I do not see a 40 to 50 mm objective lens of a rifle scope gathering nearly as much light as a 60+ mm objective of a spotting scope, given the same quality glass, let alone the clarity of the larger objective with equivalent glass. Now if you have a cheap spotter but top tier glass in your scope, yes the top tier glass in the scope is likely to out perform the cheap spotting scope, in some cases by leaps and bounds.

I can also tell you from personal experience that looking at a mule deer buck a mile away through my ED 82 spotter, I can easily tell if it is a trophy class animal, or not. At a mile plus, I can see small kickers, small eye guards, and EVERYTHING any bigger with exceptional depth perception. high powered scopes (which I have from mid range quality glass to top tier) simply do not compare.

So with all due respect, and no knocking you (the OP) for your ingenuity in trying to problem solve (kudos for it actually), I just do not see this working out for you, for the above 2 reasons. But the greatest reason being safety, I mean lets say you do see an animal and glass it with your scope, but there is an unseen hunter near by that thinks you are scoping him or her; I just pray that it all works out well for all involved. Ultimately, this all comes down to individual choice. And, clearly, what you propose is legal. But since you brought up the safety issue in your post above, I thought my examples here might assist your choice in this matter.

Best wishes!

 

[stan_wa]

I read your post very early on, but refrained from comment previously. But here goes, because of my experiences while hunting, of having other hunters scope animals very near me, and scoping me directly I will respond. In many cases when the animal(s) being scoped were close to me, it appeared that I was being scoped. Frankly those experiences are a bit unnerving. I mean, do I try to pull my trigger before they shoot me, sit back and let them shoot me... I had one guy in Utah years ago, clearly scoping me, despite me waiving my arms around to try to get him to stop. Honest to God, I shouldered my rifle and took the safety off as I pointed my rifle at him. So coming from this mindset, I just cannot imagine using my scope as a spotting scope. I simply do not point my rifle and look through the scope, at anything, unless I have already determined I am going to shoot it given a good shot opportunity. This comes from a guy that has been shot at, has had bullet fragments removed from his upper left shoulder, and has shot more than one person, killing them. I do not take the pointing of my weapon in any direction lightly, as the results can be un-reversible in the blink of an eye. By the way, that hunter in Utah was less that a split second away from being shot; the last thing I wanted to do. But I would rather be left dealing with the shit-storm that would have happened, and still be alive, then be shot by him. So despite your lack of seeing it as a safety issue, it has great potential of being a safety issue. But then, I have several times, pulled out the spotter to look at slight movement I spotted glassing at distance with my binoculars, only to find another hunter(s). If I did that with my rifle scope, it would be a safety issue (we do not need hunter orange in Ca).

I get your weight savings logic. But for the life of me, I do not see a 40 to 50 mm objective lens of a rifle scope gathering nearly as much light as a 60+ mm objective of a spotting scope, given the same quality glass, let alone the clarity of the larger objective with equivalent glass. Now if you have a cheap spotter but top tier glass in your scope, yes the top tier glass in the scope is likely to out perform the cheap spotting scope, in some cases by leaps and bounds.

I can also tell you from personal experience that looking at a mule deer buck a mile away through my ED 82 spotter, I can easily tell if it is a trophy class animal, or not. At a mile plus, I can see small kickers, small eye guards, and EVERYTHING any bigger with exceptional depth perception. high powered scopes (which I have from mid range quality glass to top tier) simply do not compare.

So with all due respect, and no knocking you (the OP) for your ingenuity in trying to problem solve (kudos for it actually), I just do not see this working out for you, for the above 2 reasons. But the greatest reason being safety, I mean lets say you do see an animal and glass it with your scope, but there is an unseen hunter near by that thinks you are scoping him or her; I just pray that it all works out well for all involved. Ultimately, this all comes down to individual choice. And, clearly, what you propose is legal. But since you brought up the safety issue in your post above, I thought my examples here might assist your choice in this matter.

Best wishes!

A very respectful and fair POV! Appreciate you taking the time to write it all out.

 

[Marbles]

Never. A rifle scope is an aiming device for a deadly instrument. Unless you plan to pull it off the rifle every time you want to look at something. One could argue for just unloading and pulling the bolt from the rifle, but that is questionable and might get a condition 0 weapon pointed back at you.

Edit: If you have the discipline to never use it to look at anything not clearly identified by your bino's, sure. But, my guess is that you would end up using it on something in brush that you can only clearly identify as deer sized with bino's. Or at the "antler" sticking out from behind a log that turns out to be a rifle barrel. But, perhaps your deer are always kind enough to skyline themselves.

 

[bowmanch]

It was kinda of mentioned before

how would you hold the scope if it is not on a rifle and doesn't have easy mounts to put it on a stand? Attempting to get and hold the eye releaf for a scope is a pain in the butt.

 

[slim9300]

It was kinda of mentioned before

how would you hold the scope if it is not on a rifle and doesn't have easy mounts to put it on a stand? Attempting to get and hold the eye releaf for a scope is a pain in the butt.

Nobody was suggesting such a thing and I don’t think you have looked through many high end scopes. Eye relief is less of a problem with high end rifle scopes than spotting scopes.


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[tdhanses]

I am.

Have you ever aimed at an animal and decide to not shoot? If so, how is that any different?

 

[Laelkhunter]

When I first read the OP (original post) I was assuming (yea I know) that he was asking about using a detached rifle scope instead of a spotting scope. Not for one second did I think he meant using the scope attached to his rifle to scan the area. As has already been said, to do that you would have to point your rifle at things you might not intend to shoot. Here in Louisiana, pointing a rifle at someone is: RS 14 : art 37 relative to aggravated assault. It carries some jail time too, even if the person you point your rifle at is nice enough not to shoot back in your direction to 'wake you up'.
I doubt that the weight savings of carrying a riflescope (detached) would make it worth the lack of ability to glass your target (or area) better than a spotting scope. Binos might be the best solution.

 

[Fatcamp]

Have you ever aimed at an animal and decide to not shoot? If so, how is that any different?

Nope. By the time I unstrap my rifle and aim at a deer I intend for it to die.

 

[slim9300]

Nope. By the time I unstrap my rifle and aim at a deer I intend for it to die.

This is laughable. How many deer have you killed in your life not in a treestand or blind?

Good for you, but there is no reason a person should feel shame for making a decision to shoot a buck or not shoot through their scope (IF you have already identified it’s a freaking deer). Getting on the scope ASAP means that you are less likely to lose an opportunity once you have identified your target. The rifle scope is the perfect time to pick apart a deer and make your decision if it’s a shooter or not.

You keep doing what you do, but it will eventually cost you a shooter buck. I’m sure you are fine with that since you are being ‘extra safe.’


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[slim9300]

When I first read the OP (original post) I was assuming (yea I know) that he was asking about using a detached rifle scope instead of a spotting scope. Not for one second did I think he meant using the scope attached to his rifle to scan the area. As has already been said, to do that you would have to point your rifle at things you might not intend to shoot. Here in Louisiana, pointing a rifle at someone is: RS 14 : art 37 relative to aggravated assault. It carries some jail time too, even if the person you point your rifle at is nice enough not to shoot back in your direction to 'wake you up'.
I doubt that the weight savings of carrying a riflescope (detached) would make it worth the lack of ability to glass your target (or area) better than a spotting scope. Binos might be the best solution.

You struggle with reading comprehension.


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[Laelkhunter]

You struggle with reading comprehension.


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Well, educate me Sir. What did I fail to comprehend?

Apparently other readers came to the same conclusion after reading some of their responses.

 

[Laelkhunter]

This is laughable. How many deer have you killed in your life not in a treestand or blind?

You keep doing what you do, but it will eventually cost you a shooter buck. I’m sure you are fine with that since you are being ‘extra safe.’


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No problem with being "extra safe". The moment or two you wait to confirm what is a viable target and what lies beyond could prevent a horrible accident. Sure, a deer might get away, but this isn't war times where hesitating on taking a shot might get you or a team member killed. This is a sport where being out there is as much a part of the trip as shooting your game animal. It is to me anyway. YMMV

 

[slim9300]

Well, educate me Sir. What did I fail to comprehend?

Apparently other readers came to the same conclusion after reading some of their responses.

I made points a couple times in the thread already replying to comments exactly like yours. I’m just saying you didn’t read the thread or the OP’s post before posting, and you assumed incorrectly just like they did (likely as a result of poor reading comprehension also). I’m not going to make the same points again. If you actually care, read the thread.


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[slim9300]

No problem with being "extra safe". The moment or two you wait to confirm what is a viable target and what lies beyond could prevent a horrible accident. Sure, a deer might get away, but this isn't war times where hesitating on taking a shot might get you or a team member killed. This is a sport where being out there is as much a part of the trip as shooting your game animal. It is to me anyway. YMMV

Again, this proves you did not read the thread or the OP’s posts. If the animal has already been verified in your binos, how is it not safe to put your rifle scope on the animal? Not one time has anyone suggested using a rifle scope to scan for animals.


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[REALWARRIOR]

To those of you that have difficulty with reading comprehension, I'm going to simplify it for you.
Can you use a scope to differentiate between a 2 point buck and a 3 point buck?
If you think that the op asked "Can you use your rifle scope to identify unidentified objects?", You are a "backwards, mentally challenged, inconsiderate, lazy retard" because you either failed to read or failed to comprehend the question asked. Furthermore, it could be argued that only a "backwards, mentally challenged, inconsiderate, lazy retard" would carry three tools, if & when the job could be done with two.
Again the OP basically asked "Can you use a scope to differentiate between a 2 point buck and a 3 point buck?"
To the OP- Yes with a quality scope you can count points in some instances, depending on weather, terrain, & illumination. At times a spotting scope will be better depending on weather, terrain, & illumination.