Remington files bankruptcy

[WyoBowhunter21]

Something I didn’t expect to see. This isn’t good for the fight against guns.

Gun maker Remington files for bankruptcy | Fox News

 

[Kevin Dill]

Indicative of things to come? Makes me wonder about the decline of true sporting arms sales (as in guns not associated with self or home defense) used primarily in hunting or recreational target shooting. Despite plenty of bite-back from gun owners, the NRA, conservative folk and so on....I cannot help but feel that public perception and momentum against guns is gaining weight and traction. This time it feels different than years past...but I'm not sure why that is.

 

[tmwtrfwler]

I cannot help but feel that public perception and momentum against guns is gaining weight and traction.

and at an amazing pace...... I fully expect that some other news story will hit and put this on the back burner in due time. But with every incident the momentum builds greater for the anti's. Tough times ahead. Watch the video's online and it's frightening how sheepish people are. They have no idea what guns are, how they work, why one would use one. All they know is that they're bad and need to be banned. Worst of all the overwhelming majority of youth, future voters and leaders, are terribly anti gun (among other left leaning thinking). Concerning times for gun owners....not AR/Self defense gun owners - ALL gun owners.

Regarding the Remington situation it wouldn't shock me to see a couple more. if you look at this entire issue from 10k feet it spells disaster for hunting and conservation in the US. We as hunters need to become less protective of our spots, introduce more people to hunting and shooting, and realize that it's up to us to find the next hunters and thus conservationists/defenders of the 2nd Amendment.

 

[Jbehredt]

I think Remington’s decline has more to do with Remington than gun laws. Would you buy anything they make? Even 870s need to be older to be any good.

 

[Trial153]

Feels like we are loosing because we are.

 

[ChrisS]

This is why leveraged buy-outs should be illegal, are a scam in general, and even worse for an industry like this. Remington started out with ~252m in debt which their brain trust turned into nearly a billion in 10 years while paying themselves pretty good dividends. Private equity firms have a great track record in acquiring companies, stripping out cash and assets and loading up on debt ... exactly what happened with Remington.

Unlike some other current commodities (e.g., electronics or even automobiles), firearms don't have built-in obsolescence. I've some stats thrown around that 3% of gun owners own 50% of the firearms; it's a very small percentage of the population that owns more than a couple of guns. Generally, people don't buy them very often. I use two shotguns, an Ithaca from the early 70s that was my dad's and a Remington 870. I have no need for another for what I do. After the expiration of the 94 AWB, there was a big bump in revenue thanks to sales of AR-style weapons, mainly because they hadn't been available for sale, but there isn't some huge segment of population buying up multiples.

The people that bought Remington leveraged the hell out of that company to buy more companies and paid out dividends to themselves during the best of times. Unfortunately, they can't just triple gun sales in a quarter because a new model comes out and all 20 million of your customers rush out to buy the new version, it's even less possible when the new versions suck.

 

[sneaky]

This has been looming for a while and has been in the news for weeks. They lost their edge and through that and a combination of poor management the market has spoken. Do I think it spells gloom and doom for the industry as a whole? Not hardly.

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[jmez]

They will just dump their debt in court, reorganize and continue on.

 

[Where's Bruce?]

A CH. 11 FILING IS A REORGANIZATION BK...I DON'T THINK THEY ARE CLOSING. This is often used to restructure a company by alleviating it's current debt load. I've used this myself to buy time when creditors wanted funds faster than the company could expect to receive them. In the end everyone was paid off, just not when they wanted to be. The company not only survived (the Obama term) but went on to thrive and the same creditors are still doing business with us. An 11 doesn't mean Remington is automatically going under. It may be a tactical move to suspend lawsuits. It's a paper game, but i suspect a carefully thought out one where those most heavily invested will form a plan to recoup their debts and profit from their proprietorship.

 

[N2TRKYS]

Would you buy anything they make?

Yes and have

 

[GrantMan]

Remington's poor quality control and management combined with strong competition from Ruger, Tikka etc is there downfall.

 

[Crippledsledge64]

Remington's been treading water for awhile and it seems like this was a strategic move by the owners more than gun laws. That being said I don't feel overly optimistic about the current climate for future for what to me is a way of life.

 

[Beendare]

They will just dump their debt in court, reorganize and continue on.

Exactly.

Interesting they threw out the lawsuit that the Sandy Hook folks filed against Remington [silly anyway] but now they refiled it in a sympathetic court ...the antis are relentless

 

[HookUp]

The name is valuable. Winchester went through a similar deal several years ago. Hopefully when Remington is rebranded the quality comes back up. I never imagined my boys would hunt with anything but a Remington. I left Remington many years ago when there quality took a shit and they have a long ways to go to get me back.

 

[WV Mountaineer]

This is why leveraged buy-outs should be illegal, are a scam in general, and even worse for an industry like this. Remington started out with ~252m in debt which their brain trust turned into nearly a billion in 10 years while paying themselves pretty good dividends. Private equity firms have a great track record in acquiring companies, stripping out cash and assets and loading up on debt ... exactly what happened with Remington.

Unlike some other current commodities (e.g., electronics or even automobiles), firearms don't have built-in obsolescence. I've some stats thrown around that 3% of gun owners own 50% of the firearms; it's a very small percentage of the population that owns more than a couple of guns. Generally, people don't buy them very often. I use two shotguns, an Ithaca from the early 70s that was my dad's and a Remington 870. I have no need for another for what I do. After the expiration of the 94 AWB, there was a big bump in revenue thanks to sales of AR-style weapons, mainly because they hadn't been available for sale, but there isn't some huge segment of population buying up multiples.

The people that bought Remington leveraged the hell out of that company to buy more companies and paid out dividends to themselves during the best of times. Unfortunately, they can't just triple gun sales in a quarter because a new model comes out and all 20 million of your customers rush out to buy the new version, it's even less possible when the new versions suck.

Spot on commentary right here

 

[ckleeves]

I think Remington’s decline has more to do with Remington than gun laws. Would you buy anything they make? Even 870s need to be older to be any good.

I agree. Remington hasn’t done anything really well in quite some time. Their handgun line is a joke and their shotguns aren’t anything to get excited about.

After owning a bunch of them I really think Beretta and Benelli have them completely beat in the auto market. I’ll take a Nova over an 870 any day for a pump.

The 770 and 783 don’t compete with some of the other budget rifles now available and the 700 doesn’t really have a stellar reputation for accuracy these days.

I think most guys would take a 10/22 over a 597 when they go to buy a .22.

So no, I wouldn’t buy anything they make. I like 700 actions but nowadays if your building a custom by the time you get a 700 trued and all the other work done to it you have pretty much paid for a custom action.


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