Rebarrel to fast twist 270 Win or go 6.8 Western?

[alpinewanderer]

Rethinking needs to be done but not by him!! The yardage that that particular bullet drops below 2200-2400fps is the max effective range regardless if what the energy is

*Sigh* More energy means more penetration and more damage transferred to the animal's tissue. If you hunt you know that. I've killed elk with a compound bow and they have very little energy to transfer at all. But you what else? You get very limited shot angles and opportunities with such weak weapons. When hunting with a rifle I like to have the option to break through a shoulder, take that quartering-to shot.. keeping 1500 ft-lbs. as a personal limitation ensures I get to have options without worry.

 

[Axlrod]

I grew up shooting a 270, it's all my dad used to hunt with including many subsistence elk back in the 60's. He was an excellent shot, a lot of which I attribute to the low recoil of the 270. I will always have a few of them.
I have seen quite a few elk killed with a 270 and barnes bullets. Out to 600+ yards the 110/130 grain bullets work as well as can be expected for mono's. Shot through the lungs I have not seen a barnes stay in an elk/moose/deer, so energy is not a relevant factor. Mono's produce a smaller wound channel, but generally penetrate deeper, than cup and core bullets. So a 110 barnes out of y6our gun will go clean through an elk's chest. In mono's lighter is faster and faster is better. My son's first year hunting he shot a bull just under 600 yards with a 110 TTSX, bull didn't go 20 yards.
If you are going to stick with mono's (I quit using them in the 90's) keep the gun you have, get some 130 TTSX's, practice a lot at the farthest range you want to kill stuff at, and go hunt. The bonus to lighter bullets is less recoil which equals more bullets going where you want them to.

 

[TaperPin]

I love how any mention of the good old 270 O’Connor Ram Blaster makes heads spin! Lol

It made its name in the 1920’s shooting rather light bullets that fall apart just like Roksliders prefer - imagine that, a gun older than great grandpa’s first diapers is still relevant today. It’s survived because it’s a great combination of shootability, long distance performance, and WWF smack down.

At the ripe old age of 13, I saved up from my $1.85/hr job and bought a 270 - I still remember shooting my first sub MOA group with that gun and doing a little happy dance. I still have an old Remington 270, but that original rifle was upgraded to a 7 mag, and that 6.8 Western, or 264 win mag would have been just as good.

 

[alpinewanderer]

I grew up shooting a 270, it's all my dad used to hunt with including many subsistence elk back in the 60's. He was an excellent shot, a lot of which I attribute to the low recoil of the 270. I will always have a few of them.
I have seen quite a few elk killed with a 270 and barnes bullets. Out to 600+ yards the 110/130 grain bullets work as well as can be expected for mono's. Shot through the lungs I have not seen a barnes stay in an elk/moose/deer, so energy is not a relevant factor. Mono's produce a smaller wound channel, but generally penetrate deeper, than cup and core bullets. So a 110 barnes out of y6our gun will go clean through an elk's chest. In mono's lighter is faster and faster is better. My son's first year hunting he shot a bull just under 600 yards with a 110 TTSX, bull didn't go 20 yards.
If you are going to stick with mono's (I quit using them in the 90's) keep the gun you have, get some 130 TTSX's, practice a lot at the farthest range you want to kill stuff at, and go hunt. The bonus to lighter bullets is less recoil which equals more bullets going where you want them to.

Thank you this is a constructive response. The other factor here is that I want to put a can on the end and the factory tikka barrel is too thin to thread. The smithies near me won't do it. Sending it out farther will cost me in shipping and time so I figure why not get a new barrel all together? Either one with a faster twist or a new .277 cartridge all together like the 6.8 Western.

 

[bmart2622]

*Sigh* More energy means more penetration and more damage transferred to the animal's tissue. If you hunt you know that. I've killed elk with a compound bow and they have very little energy to transfer at all. But you what else? You get very limited shot angles and opportunities with such weak weapons. When hunting with a rifle I like to have the option to break through a shoulder, take that quartering-to shot.. keeping 1500 ft-lbs. as a personal limitation ensures I get to have options without worry.

*Sigh* More energy means more penetration and more damage transferred to the animal's tissue. If you hunt you know that. I've killed elk with a compound bow and they have very little energy to transfer at all. But you what else? You get very limited shot angles and opportunities with such weak weapons. When hunting with a rifle I like to have the option to break through a shoulder, take that quartering-to shot.. keeping 1500 ft-lbs. as a personal limitation ensures I get to have options without worry.

Hey 1975 called, it wants its antiquated, disproven, Fuddlore lack of understanding of terminal ballistics back!!

 

[alpinewanderer]

Hey 1975 called, it wants its antiquated, disproven, Fuddlore lack of understanding of terminal ballistics back!!

Well then dingus, enlighten me. If it isn't energy, or more properly the ability to transfer kinetic energy, that does damage than what does? Hope? Wishes? Fellas from Montana with a few too many fingers and toes?

 

[bmart2622]

Tissue damage caused by bullet expansion....bullet expansion dictated by velocity!!! So you tell me DINGUS, whats the minimum energy your preferred bullet manufacturer lists for proper expansion?!?!?

 

[Koda_]

Hey Roksliders,

I've got a Tikka T3x that I love chambered in 270 Win. I've hunted with it for while now and have dispatched a lot of game species throughout the west. After keeping her more or less stock for the last 8 years, I've finally decided to do some customization starting with the barrel.

I'm a fan of the Barnes LRX bullet and have been using the 129gr .277 for a long time. Now a 155 gr LRX is available as are a number of Hammer bullets in various weights 150gr+. In order to spin these heavier bullets I'd need a 1:8 or faster barrel twist or faster. I've done some research and 270 Win can do it, but it seems like in many ways the 6.8 Western was designed to do this very efficiently.

My question to you all is do I get a straightforward 270 Win barrel with a faster twist and a threaded muzzle for a can (other reason I'm doing this) or do I take this opportunity to switch to a cartridge more purpose-built for the longer heavier bullets I'm interested in? Seems like if I went 6.8 Western my experience would be really reloading focused whereas if I stick with 270 Win can continue go factory or handholds depending on the circumstance/level of laziness, etc.

For some context I do reload and have a nice little shop for load development at my place. I also want to stick with the .277 Cals. Not interested in 7 mags or PRC, etc.

Thanks for the input!

I just went thru this with an old favorite 25-06 I grew up hunting with. When it came time to retire it, I decided to upgrade it instead... keeping the same caliber but a fast twist barrel to handle the new heavier monolithincs.

You need to do the same with your 270 and yes it will bring it up to modern new caliber technologies. Get a 7 twist and dont hold back on the twist rate, you can still still shoot the lighter bullets too. If you do this build a dummy round with the heavy bullet you want and have the smith throat the chamber to that length, to optimize case volume to get the velocity you will need. Yes, velocity trumps energy but I'll leave that for you to decide. If you can, chamber your new 270 barrel to ackley improved, get all the velocity you can out of the new 270.

 

[Byrdman]

I would rebarrel it to a fast twist since it means that much to you. You won’t be happy otherwise. I have a factory browning fast twist 270 and love it. Haven’t loaded the 155 Lrx in it yet but I have loaded the Nosler 165 ablr with success. I get 2870fps out of it pushed by RL26 and under MOA groups. At that speed it doesn’t drop to under 1500ft/lbs energy until 620yds. Plenty of energy at a range beyond most people’s ethical hunting range.

 

[alpinewanderer]

Tissue damage caused by bullet expansion....bullet expansion dictated by velocity!!! So you tell me DINGUS, whats the minimum energy your preferred bullet manufacturer lists for proper expansion?!?!?

An open hand moving through a pool of water slowly will only make a ripple. An open hand moving quickly will make a splash. Now imagine the pool of water is tissue. Which do you think will do more damage? Slow or fast? A heavier higher BC bullet retains its velocity longer which gives higher retained energy. F=ma. You can change the size of m or you change the size of a but F does the work. If a is near constant and you increase m F gets bigger. If we used your reasoning then it would be better to try and drive though a brick wall with a Honda Civic than an F250, all else being equal. But the difference in masses of bullets I've discussed here is greater than the difference velocities. Change m vs. change in a. Why don't we all go elephant hunting in Botswana with .22 mags ...it'll be a gas.

Velocity is a component of energy. We are talking past each other. A light bullet moving really fast kills well (until it loses momentum) because it has more energy. But a heavier bullet moving at the same speed would do even better because it's equal speed and greater mass give it more energy.

 

[Byrdman]

Tissue damage caused by bullet expansion....bullet expansion dictated by velocity!!! So you tell me DINGUS, whats the minimum energy your preferred bullet manufacturer lists for proper expansion?!?!?

You are correct that they don’t list an energy limit for expansion. But at recommended velocity for expansion OP still wants to meet 1500ft/lbs so please respect that as he has a limit to what he wants

 

[alpinewanderer]

I just went thru this with an old favorite 25-06 I grew up hunting with. When it came time to retire it, I decided to upgrade it instead... keeping the same caliber but a fast twist barrel to handle the new heavier monolithincs.

You need to do the same with your 270 and yes it will bring it up to modern new caliber technologies. Get a 7 twist and dont hold back on the twist rate, you can still still shoot the lighter bullets too. If you do this build a dummy round with the heavy bullet you want and have the smith throat the chamber to that length, to optimize case volume to get the velocity you will need. Yes, velocity trumps energy but I'll leave that for you to decide. If you can, chamber your new 270 barrel to ackley improved, get all the velocity you can out of the new 270.

Thanks for the insightful response.

 

[ericmcd]

I built a fast twist .270 with a long throat usually load just under 3.6. everyone says don't do .277 for bullet choice but I've found if you shoot monos (I live in California) that is absolutely not true and every nonlead manufacturer has good options for heavy .277.
Right now I'm shooting badlands bulldozer 140s at 2950 which keeps me above 2k out past 1k with low recoil though that's way past my comfortable range

 

[bmart2622]

Velocity x Velocity x bullet weight= ft/lbs of energy. Velocity dictates energy. Velocity dictates bullet expansion, bullet expansion creates wound channels, wound channels =death. What was the minimum energy required for bullet expansion, I must have missed you posting that.....Ill wait

 

[bmart2622]

You are correct that they don’t list an energy limit for expansion. But at recommended velocity for expansion OP still wants to meet 1500ft/lbs so please respect that as he has a limit to what he wants

No thanks

 

[Gorp2007]

While I’m hesitant to help out someone dumb enough to run around calling people on the internet a dingus, if you’re converting a Tikka to something you’ll handload for and you’re dead set on .277, I’d go full Wildcat and get a 270-284 Win spun up. No need to swap bolts, a little more speed than a 270, and friendlier to a Tikka action.

Neutering it with heavy-for-caliber copper is objectively stupid, but if you’re gonna make bad decisions, at least make them interesting.

 

[alpinewanderer]

While I’m hesitant to help out someone dumb enough to run around calling people on the internet a dingus, if you’re converting a Tikka to something you’ll handload for and you’re dead set on .277, I’d go full Wildcat and get a 270-284 Win spun up. No need to swap bolts, a little more speed than a 270, and friendlier to a Tikka action.

Neutering it with heavy-for-caliber copper is objectively stupid, but if you’re gonna make bad decisions, at least make them interesting.

Then explain the difference in velocity and energy to me between these two loads. And explain to everyone why you think the 129 would perform better than the 155 on elk at each incremental distance past 400 yards. Assume a shooter mistake and the bullets are both going to hit the elk in the scapula.

 

[Byrdman]

Velocity x Velocity x bullet weight= ft/lbs of energy. Velocity dictates energy. Velocity dictates bullet expansion, bullet expansion creates wound channels, wound channels =death. What was the minimum energy required for bullet expansion, I must have missed you posting that.....Ill wait

Velocity does dictate energy but so does bullet weight. They work in combination. The heavy high bc bullets hold velocity longer and with the weight also have more energy at range

 

[alpinewanderer]

Velocity x Velocity x bullet weight= ft/lbs of energy. Velocity dictates energy. Velocity dictates bullet expansion, bullet expansion creates wound channels, wound channels =death. What was the minimum energy required for bullet expansion, I must have missed you posting that.....Ill wait

Velocity x velocity x mass does not equal force. Change in velocity x mass = force (energy).

 

[Koda_]

Whatever metric you use to determine "killing power", your gonna need velocity to increase it.

Supercharge that 270 with a fast 7 twist deep throated for those heavy high BC bullets and send it fast and you will have a one of a kind custom rifle that hits as hard or harder than other calibers in its class.