Preferred sizing die

[Ram94]

Considering going to this, just ordered my first Lee collet. So basically, you pull the expander ball from your FL sizing die, bump the shoulder with that setup and then set neck tension using the Lee collet- right?

If you just pull the expander ball out of a regular FL die, you will still be working the neck of the case. You’d want to use either a bushing die with the bushing removed or a Body die. Otherwise yes, that’s the idea. Some guys will size the neck and then the body and others do the body first. I haven’t noticed any difference in either order.

 

[OXN939]

If you just pull the expander ball out of a regular FL die, you will still be working the neck of the case.

For sure, but even if you downsize the neck with the FL sizing die, the collet die would still uniform it and set the correct neck tension when used afterwards, correct? Planning to do that operation about every third firing and just use the collet die by itself to set neck tension the rest of the time

 

[Lawnboi]

For sure, but even if you downsize the neck with the FL sizing die, the collet die would still uniform it and set the correct neck tension when used afterwards, correct? Planning to do that operation about every third firing and just use the collet die by itself to set neck tension the rest of the time

Negative. You would need to Mandrel it up to proper neck tension if you just pulled the expander out of an fl sizing die. The lee collet dies basically just squeeze the neck against a mandrel in the die to bring the neck down to the desired dimension, not the other way.

Iv got a couple collet dies as well but do not use them all that much. Been trying to minimize the amount of times I have to touch the brass

 

[OXN939]

The lee collet dies basically just squeeze the neck against a mandrel in the die to bring the neck down to the desired dimension, not the other way.

So the mandrel in the Lee collet die wouldn't expand the neck to the correct diameter? Mine's still in the mail so not intimately familiar with the process yet

 

[Lawnboi]

So the mandrel in the Lee collet die wouldn't expand the neck to the correct diameter? Mine's still in the mail so not intimately familiar with the process yet

Not likely. Most regular fl sizing dies, Atleast ones Iv used really squeez the neck down and require a mandrel that is pretty large to bring back to .002 neck tension. Even if the lee mandrel was big enough, the brass would be stretching around the mandrel making the collet portion essentially not do anything. Not quite what they are designed to do.

If your case, you would be better off pulling the expander and setting neck tension with a mandrel. Many comp guys have been doing this for a while, and with different sized mandrels at your disposal it’s easy to adjust to what gives you what you want.

 

[wind gypsy]

Most of my sizing dies are redding type S FL bushing dies. Everyone said they were "the best" when I got into reloading.

I like being able to tailor neck tension easily with bushing swaps and I wonder if not sizing the full neck aids in preventing donuts inside at the neck/shoulder junction.

I've since read enough from people I trust that suggests the redding bushing dies aren't likely a strong performer in regards to run out.

I also have a few Forster dies with necks honed to spec and they work well for less money. I haven't broken out my concentricity gauge in years so can't say if there is measurable difference between the forster dies and redding.

 

[Hondo64d]

Curious what everyone is using for sizing does. Bushing, standard FL? Custom FL? Honed FL?

I’m fairly new to reloading. I started some wilson bushing dies, which have worked well. Been experimenting with some standard full length dies (Redding) minus the expander and ordered mighty armory which seems a little different yet.

Following sizing currently I mandrel to neck tension. No expander buttons and measure neck tension with a pin guage. Found it dosnt take much to go from .002 neck tension to .004 and indent bullets on seating.

Iv also thought of ordering some honed standard FL dies. I know my bushing size and the idea of eliminating the bushing, and the unsized neck portion is appealing to me.

Anyone used them all?

I’ve used Redding bushing dies, Harrell’s Precision bushing dies, Redding body die w/ Lee Collet die, Mighty Armory die and honed Forster dies. The quick version is the honed Forster die is where it’s at.

It produces ammo as straight as the bushing dies but isn’t as prone to developing the donut. If you position the expander ball correctly, the neck is supported by the die as it pulls over the expander, which keeps the neck from being pulled off center.

Mighty Armory has the best fit and finish and the sizing operation was noticeably smoother than other dies, but did not produce as straight ammo as the Forster or Redding/LCD combo.

The Redding body die combined with a Lee Collet die produced very straight ammo but adds an additional step over a honed Forster.

The FL bushing dies make very straight ammo but don’t size the entire neck.

So, for me, it’s the honed Forster.

John

 

[Lawnboi]

Most of my sizing dies are redding type S FL bushing dies. Everyone said they were "the best" when I got into reloading.

I like being able to tailor neck tension easily with bushing swaps and I wonder if not sizing the full neck aids in preventing donuts inside at the neck/shoulder junction.

I've since read enough from people I trust that suggests the redding bushing dies aren't likely a strong performer in regards to run out.

I also have a few Forster dies with necks honed to spec and they work well for less money. I haven't broken out my concentricity gauge in years so can't say if there is measurable difference between the forster dies and redding.

The reason I started this thread is because Iv been using bushing dies, and have been getting a little bulge at the unsized portion of the neck. It hasn’t caused problems, that I can tell, and hasn’t really been noticeable till the fifth firing on this brass but it’s there. Iv read it has possible self centering, due to part of the neck being a chamber fit, but I’m not sure I buy it. Below is a picture, left is a wilson bushing die piece of brass, right a mighty armory full length. Not quite sure this is what people refer to as a doughnut starting or not. I do know for certain that my goal is to never have to neck turn brass. I enjoy shooting more than sitting at the bench fixing things I don’t want to fix.

Probably dosnt help that this is likely a loose neck factory chamber, and Hornady mixed lot brass.

 

[Lawnboi]

I’ve used Redding bushing dies, Harrell’s Precision bushing dies, Redding body die w/ Lee Collet die, Mighty Armory die and honed Forster dies. The quick version is the honed Forster die is where it’s at.

It produces ammo as straight as the bushing dies but isn’t as prone to developing the donut. If you position the expander ball correctly, the neck is supported by the die as it pulls over the expander, which keeps the neck from being pulled off center.

Mighty Armory has the best fit and finish and the sizing operation was noticeably smoother than other dies, but did not produce as straight ammo as the Forster or Redding/LCD combo.

The Redding body die combined with a Lee Collet die produced very straight ammo but adds an additional step over a honed Forster.

The FL bushing dies make very straight ammo but don’t size the entire neck.

So, for me, it’s the honed Forster.

John

Sounds like I need to try a honed forester. Iv got another mighty armory coming to see if it makes a difference in my match rifle. I don’t have a means to measure concentricity, I’m just trying to simplify loading without effecting my .75-1.25 moa loads.

Another option to test would be the mighty armory with the pin removed, followed by a mandrel. But they would defeat the purpose of trying to simplify.

Currently I’m sizing with a bushing to die without an expander and using a mandrel to bring the brass up to my desired neck tension.

 

[wind gypsy]

Sounds like I need to try a honed forester. Iv got another mighty armory coming to see if it makes a difference in my match rifle. I don’t have a means to measure concentricity, I’m just trying to simplify loading without effecting my .75-1.25 moa loads.

Another option to test would be the mighty armory with the pin removed, followed by a mandrel. But they would defeat the purpose of trying to simplify.

Currently I’m sizing with a bushing to die without an expander and using a mandrel to bring the brass up to my desired neck tension.

I know you went all Gucci with 419 dies now but what are your current thoughts on the mighty armory dies?

I still don’t have a sizing die for my 6 creedmoor and not sure I’ll even load much for it because it seems to shoot factory ammo great but I should get a dang die. Was leaning towards Forster and just overworking necks until I figured out what brass I’ll stick to and then having it honed but mighty armory caught my eye.

Only concern is reports of stuck cases. I’ve always used one shot and never stuck a single case in Redding, Forster, and hornady dies so I don’t like the sounds of that.

 

[Lawnboi]

I know you went all Gucci with 419 dies now but what are your current thoughts on the mighty armory dies?

I still don’t have a sizing die for my 6 creedmoor and not sure I’ll even load much for it because it seems to shoot factory ammo great but I should get a dang die. Was leaning towards Forster and just overworking necks until I figured out what brass I’ll stick to and then having it honed but mighty armory caught my eye.

Only concern is reports of stuck cases. I’ve always used one shot and never stuck a single case in Redding, Forster, and hornady dies so I don’t like the sounds of that.

I don’t have any a419 dies just SAC.

I sold my mighty armory dies. They sized too much, akin to what I’d see with standard FL sizing dies. The mandrel wasn’t adjustable, and I just saw too much work happening to the brass, both on the inside with the mandrel and out. They seemed like high quality dies.

In the mean time I also bought a honed forester for my 3006. Good die but I do mandrel separately. If I could buy other size buttons I would try them but the button supplied was just too much. Just more handling of the brass which I am wanting to get away from.

I still am a huge fan of the SAC die…. I’d just buy one for the creedmoors if I were in your shoes. I just finished my match season burning a 6 creed barrel. The die saves me a boat load of time. I get more consistency than when I was using a bushing die and a mandrel, and I do it all in one step (size, mandrel, deprime). The brass only touches my press once. It’s an awesome die. I actually would like another creedmoor die just cause I have multiple calibers in it that I load at the same time. That said I have also just swapped internal, and used shell holders to adjust shoulder bump. It is an investment when you look at the parts to make it a one step die but for me, it was worth it not sitting at the bench doing multiple steps for a less consistent result.

 

[wind gypsy]

I don’t have any a419 dies just SAC.

I sold my mighty armory dies. They sized too much, akin to what I’d see with standard FL sizing dies. The mandrel wasn’t adjustable, and I just saw too much work happening to the brass, both on the inside with the mandrel and out. They seemed like high quality dies.

In the mean time I also bought a honed forester for my 3006. Good die but I do mandrel separately. If I could buy other size buttons I would try them but the button supplied was just too much. Just more handling of the brass which I am wanting to get away from.

I still am a huge fan of the SAC die…. I’d just buy one for the creedmoors if I were in your shoes. I just finished my match season burning a 6 creed barrel. The die saves me a boat load of time. I get more consistency than when I was using a bushing die and a mandrel, and I do it all in one step (size, mandrel, deprime). The brass only touches my press once. It’s an awesome die. I actually would like another creedmoor die just cause I have multiple calibers in it that I load at the same time. That said I have also just swapped internal, and used shell holders to adjust shoulder bump. It is an investment when you look at the parts to make it a one step die but for me, it was worth it not sitting at the bench doing multiple steps for a less consistent result.

SAC, that's what i meant.. Thanks for the input.

 

[Mike D Texas]

I’ve really come to like the Micron bushing dies from Bullet Central. They seem to size the base of the cartridge down a bit more than others.

I still prefer bushing dies because of varying neck thickness in brass. I deal with a little runout over trimming case necks because I haven’t seen any difference in accuracy with up to .004 runout on my ammo.


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