Please school me on PAC boots

[husky390]

Last weekend I was in Kansas for a late season deer hunt and my feet froze in temps that were -9 with the windchill included. I was wearing 1,000gram thinsulate boots with heavy Bass Pro socks while in a Heater Body Suit and my feet still froze. So now I'm thinking I might need a PAC boot to keep my feet warm for next year. What specs should I be looking for in one since there are so many choices and options. Thank you.

 

[direwolf]

You probably need to look at an external heat source like chemical hand/foot warmers or some of the new battery powered socks/gloves if you are going to try sitting still for long periods in that kind of weather.

 

[Bughalli]

Pac boots are great for warmth in really cold weather, but not intended for hiking. There's not enough ankle support for any real hiking and they generally weigh a lot. There's not much to learn about them that isn't said in product descriptions. I've always had Sorels, but there's plenty of good brands out there. My one suggestion is to make sure you don't get them too small. It's very very important you have good circulation. Having too small a boot or wearing too many socks or too heavy of socks leads to more cold feet than anything else. Circulation is key. I bet that was part of the issue with your current boots...too tight. I've actually taken socks off to give my feet more room and felt significantly warmer. It was totally counter intuitive, but works. So when you buy a pair, bring the socks you would wear in the coldest conditions. The boot should be comfortable, but not snug, just covering your foot without any constriction. Don't worry if they seem rediculously big. You don't want big air gaps in the boot either though. If undecided on fit, error on the side of having a little too much room than not enough.

I've always had leather uppers which I treat with SnowSeal to keep them waterproof. I never tried the nylon uppers, so I don't have an opinion. Nylon uppers might be a little more noisy if you stalk into and out of your hunting stand, where leather is quiet. I often do late season archery hunts in snow, so noise is a factor for me.

Most pac boots you can take the liner out. That's important because it makes drying them out much easier. I would never buy ones where I couldn't take the liner out. You never want to go out with wet boots, even if damp from a long hike out of a stand where your feet sweated. Need to stay dry at all times.

They come in different heights. My last pair were 12-14 inches high. I thought they would be warmer or help stay dry if crossing creeks. Not sure it helps too much, other than add weight. When these wear out I might go back to a standard height.

They come in different temp rating. Assuming you're not hiking far, I.e. only from truck to hunting stand and back, why not go the warmest you can get. If it's not super cold, then you'll probably wear different boots anyway. The longer you can sit, the more likely the deer are on the move....either from other guys pushing them from being cold and walking or the deer themselves getting more active to stay warm. I've shot a lot of deer from 10am to noon because other guys start walking.

Also....dropping a chemical hand warmer in the bottom of each boot once you get to the hunting stand makes a big difference. The small amount of heat goes a long way. Lastly, if you want extra protection, try the boot shields....those insulated boot covers you put on once you get to the stand. They help with wind chill. I can sit in the stand all day in nasty weather and cold temps without issue. But it took a lot of trial and error.

 

[Retterath]

i think even with really good boots and sitting for long pierods of time and not able to move much causing not much circulation in your feet. i have tryed so many different boots and my feet still get cold if i sit for a long time. im probally going to have to get those thermacell foot inserts that have heat settings.

 

[StrutNut]

Living in MN I find myself hunting in those conditions often. If you are on a budget the old military bunny boots (white) or mickey mouse boots (black) are really good. Make sure you get the ones with the valve. They are warmer. They are somewhat heavy and pretty big. On a small hang on stand you wont have a lot of foot room. I have used them for years and am now switching to something even better. Steger Mukluks. I hopefully will be picking them up within a week. Waiting on a bonus check. Everything I have read has me believing this is the best boot I can buy for the late season hunting I do in MN. Also, just throwing this out there, I have had a lot of luck and a much more comfortable hunt in a ground blind with a Mr Heater. I shot a deer last weekend in WI with very cold temps and I was wearing no gloves, only a black fleece zip up jacket and regular muck boots. The shot was less than 20 yards and the deer saw the blind and really didnt care. Just kept marching out to feed.

 

[robby denning]

If you can hang on a bit, we'll have a pac review for our February Boot Month on Rokslide.
It covers everything you're asking about, just not ready for publish yet.

There are some high-end pacs like the Schnee's Hunter II that are suitable for hiking in steep/nasty country. I've used mine in it for years.

Also, Grabber makes a boot heater shaped like a sole and functions like an insert that will cure cold feet down to below zero for about $3 per day and you can hike in them.

 

[Ridge Ghost]

Were you hiking or sitting in a stand?

I used Kennetrek pac boots this fall on a mule deer hunt. It was -10, but with wind chill was probably more like -25 or so. I hiked up and down coulees all day, and they provided plenty of support. They also kept my feet warm enough, but I was moving all day. I don't think they would be warm enough for someone sitting in one spot in those conditions.

 

[rayporter]

i have kinda switched to boot blankets because i like to walk. i drop a heater in them before i put them on and get by. the heaters dont put out a lot of heat, probably cause of the lack of oxygen.

but it has been years since i was in constant negative temps

 

[Chad E]

I got a pair of the Schnees Hunter II pac boots right before Christmas. They are incredibly comfortable and very light considering they are 13 inch pacs. I've spent several days hiking in them and I think they have plenty of support for most tasks. I think they are going to be a great investment and will solve my late season boot issues.

 

[2rocky]

I'd say the over boots would be better suited for stand hunting.

Kenetrek, Hoffman, Schnees and Whites tend to be well suited to active stillhunting, logging, ranching, riding with tops 12-18 inches.

the Sorels you find in the department stores are less aggressive soles, and less intended for uneven terrain. Usually have lower tops and fewer eyelets. They come with thicker insulation, and come in cute colors....

 

[larryschwartz]

This may not have been part of the problem, but adequate circulation is key to keeping your feet (and hands) warm. Since you had on heavy socks, and your boots were sized for regular thickness socks, it is possible that your boots may have been too tight, which would hurt the circulation and therefore keep your feet from getting and staying warm. In cold weather you always want your boots (and gloves) to be a little loose to a) allow for good blood circulation, and b) to provide some air space to trap and keep warm air against your body. Once I learned this trick my cold hands and feet days went away.

Of course, everything said above goes to, but this is an often overlooked detail that can provide surprising benefits.

 

[jmez]

Another consideration on the boot temp ratings. These are the comfort rating of the boot during physical activity, not sitting idle in a stand.

 

[husky390]

Thanks guy's. Needing boots that give support is not an issue as I will only be using them in Kansas and the longest hike I have is a 1/2 mile through a field. During these hunting trips, I will be sitting in a stand or on the ground, motionless, fighting boredom and cold feet. When I was hiking to/from the stand, my feet were fine. It's when I sit in a stand that they were cold. I also borrowed a heater body suit and my feet still got cold after about two hours. In fact, that was the main reason I left after hour 3 as I could no longer feel my toes. I'm in no hurry to buy PAC boots and can easily wait for the Spring sales to hit as I wont have any use for the boots here in CO, so thanks for the heads up on the future article Robby. Also, after reading several posts, one thing I'll have to try is to wear a regular sock and boot during the hike in and then change into a heavier sock and PAC boot, possibly throwing in some toasty toes while I'm in the stand.

Thanks for all of your help everybody, I appreciate it. Oh, and I did get my first deer so the trip was well worth it.

 

[Biggs300]

Husky390, when I hunt elk in CO, or deer in OK in moderately cold temps, I regularly use my Kenetrek Mountain Extremes with 400 gram insulation. These boots are comfortable and work well. But, for temps like you are talking about, I have found no warmer boots than my Baffin Control Max boots. They are big boots and even feel a bit clumsy until you get use to them. I have only had to use them twice, but they are incredibly warm boots and work well if you are not walking several miles or trekking in the mountains. If it is really cold and I'm not walking or stalking more than a mile or two, my Baffins work really well. I bought one size larger than my normal size so I could use heavy socks and could not be happier with the comfort and warmth of these boots. They work well in the flat lands in OK and I bet they would work well in KS as well.

 

[husky390]

Thanks Biggs, I'll add those to the list.

 

[realunlucky]

X2 on the baffins warmest boot I ever wore. Everyone I knew that had a snowmobile wore them before the plugin came along.

 

[Hunt'nFish]

After my Sorels wore out, I went w/ a pair of Columbia SnowTrek boots.
Super warm and very light.

 

[robby denning]

Boot Month starts later next week and pacs will be covered
http://www.rokslide.com/forums/showthread.php?25384-Boot-Month-on-Rokslide&p=298601#post298601

 

[robby denning]

i have kinda switched to boot blankets because i like to walk. i drop a heater in them before i put them on and get by. the heaters dont put out a lot of heat, probably cause of the lack of oxygen.

but it has been years since i was in constant negative temps

On the boot heaters, the grabbers that are sole shaped have worked for me. You don't "feel" the warmth as they sit below your sock, but what I notice is that my feet don't get cold. I'm not a stand hunter, but ride a lot of horseback.

2rocky, I have a pic somewhere of Ryan in those pink Sorels sitting on a goat. I'll see if I can find it.

 

[Jens]

Ive used a pac boot from Cabelas while treestand hunting in South Dakota late season temps the last couple of years. i think they are called Saskatchewan pac boots. They are pretty big and have a very thick sole. They have kept me from freezing out.