Pattern Test - Beretta Factory, Patternmaster, Carlson

[ShortMountain91]

So I did a pattern test with my factory Beretta chokes a couple years ago and shared on here. Since then I've added a couple more chokes so figured I'd put all the patterns together and get some opinions / thoughts. All shots were at 40 yards.

So the chokes are the Beretta factory modified, improved modified, and full. The Carlson cremator mid range and long range, both non-ported. And finally the Patternmaster code black goose.

I primarily hunt with 2 loads, Boss legacy 3" bismuth #4 for ducks and Winchester Super X 3.5" BB for geese so these are the 2 loads patterned. I also have quite a bit of steel #2 of various brands so need to pattern that one day also.

Patterns below so I can group them by load. Let me know what y'all think and would hunt with yourself!

Sent from my SM-S936U using Tapatalk

 

[ShortMountain91]

Boss legacy 3" #4, 40 yards

Sent from my SM-S936U using Tapatalk

 

[ShortMountain91]

Winchester Super X 3.5" BB

Sent from my SM-S936U using Tapatalk

 

[OneGunTex]

I like the way the Carlson's LR looks.

Personally I used to like Boss #5s and a factory Mod, but I'm not paying that kind of money for copper.

 

[Irish Miner]

Always fun and interesting throwing some patterns on paper. It's good to do. I've found it can be easy to overthink it sometimes for myself. Lots of factors in the real world. Us (the shooter) being the largest factor. Not to mention wind speed, bird speed, direction, distance, the gun, the load, etc..

Always have liked the Carlsons in my experience.

 

[Jesse Jaymes]

Watched a lot of YT videos on chokes. I drank the Muller Kool Aid and paid big money for it. I have yet to pattern it. Did see that every ported shot worse than non ported.

Carlson seems to be a great all around choke tho.

 

[ShortMountain91]

Always fun and interesting throwing some patterns on paper. It's good to do. I've found it can be easy to overthink it sometimes for myself. Lots of factors in the real world. Us (the shooter) being the largest factor. Not to mention wind speed, bird speed, direction, distance, the gun, the load, etc..

Always have liked the Carlsons in my experience.

I agree very interesting and fun too. I also have that issue where I'm constantly chasing perfection so I tend to over think and over analyze. What I tend to think when I see these patterns is there's not much difference in $100 aftermarket chokes and what the gun came with

Sent from my SM-S936U using Tapatalk

 

[ShortMountain91]

Watched a lot of YT videos on chokes. I drank the Muller Kool Aid and paid big money for it. I have yet to pattern it. Did see that every ported shot worse than non ported.

Carlson seems to be a great all around choke tho.

Yep watched the same Joel Strickland videos. Bought the Patternmaster because a friend swore by it. When I patterned it I didn't think it was much different than the stock chokes. Tried the Carlson because of Joel's testing and think it's not that different than stock as well. I can't stomach dropping another chunk of cash for a Muller. The videos I've watched where people pattern the Muller make me think it's not a miracle choke either. I think that's my problem. I'm chasing that "perfect pattern" which likely doesn't exist.

Sent from my SM-S936U using Tapatalk

 

[OneGunTex]

The videos I've watched where people pattern the Muller make me think it's not a miracle choke either. I think that's my problem. I'm chasing that "perfect pattern" which likely doesn't exist.

When I did my huge set of testing (something like 300 combinations of ammo, choke, and range), I also factored cost into my analysis. That's how I came to the decision to go with more expensive ammo that put more (smaller #5) pellets on target rather than an expensive choke tube. I only tested with choke tubes that accepted returns even after fired (Carlsons & Rob Roberts)

 

[Macintosh]

Just to add to above^. Chokes and shot shells are like rifle groups, ie you have to shoot multiple patterns to get a sense of what they do with consistency, and when you do that the smaller differences tend to disappear based on shot-to-shot variability ime, or at least the gap between similar tubes becomes truly very small. Usually negligible.

 

[ShortMountain91]

Just to add to above^. Chokes and shot shells are like rifle groups, ie you have to shoot multiple patterns to get a sense of what they do with consistency, and when you do that the smaller differences tend to disappear based on shot-to-shot variability ime, or at least the gap between similar tubes becomes truly very small. Usually negligible.

Agreed. Will probably shoot a couple more on the 3.5 BBs. If the Carlson is still showing higher counts there, I'll probably keep the Carlson twin pack and send the Patternmaster back. I think the Patternmaster looks fine with the Boss but the Carlson looks just as good to me and I shoot a lot of 3.5" BB since we are primarily shooting snows with the occasional ducks here and there.

Sent from my SM-S936U using Tapatalk

 

[ichthus329]

What's your reasoning for shooting primarily bismuth? I run Winchester DryLok 2 3/4" #4's with great results out of my Beretta a400 Xtreme plus with a Muller Decoy choke.

 

[OneGunTex]

What's your reasoning for shooting primarily bismuth? I run Winchester DryLok 2 3/4" #4's with great results out of my Beretta a400 Xtreme plus with a Muller Decoy choke.

I don't have the numbers in front of me right now, but it's about retained energy/velocity at range + pattern. A #5 bismuth pellet has the same energy/velocity at X range as #3 steel, but I get 40% more pellets in a 30" circle.

There's a whole other "what shot size" thread where a couple folks posted tables and calculations that explain the real numbers.

 

[ShortMountain91]

What's your reasoning for shooting primarily bismuth? I run Winchester DryLok 2 3/4" #4's with great results out of my Beretta a400 Xtreme plus with a Muller Decoy choke.

Just to get more pellets with the same penetration as steel. I stocked up on it when it wasn't crazy expensive and have been shooting it for a few years now. It's so expensive now that I will probably switch back to a premium steel like dry lock when this runs out.

Sent from my SM-S936U using Tapatalk

 

[Jesse Jaymes]

As I have Nerd'd Out on patterns, chokes and pellets this season like some of you here, my YT algorithm is feeding me more.

Semi on topic, a dude I watched SWORE by #6 steel for Canada's. Preached that "they don't make it for a reason...it's too effective and they sell more shells the more you shoot".

Think it was this forum, possible in a thread I started RE: Bismuth. Someone posted a link that was super interesting that in summary.....said Steel #4 (don't quote me) out to 40 yards, was MORE effective than Bismuth 5s or similar. Energy died off quickly right after 40, but you had the energy and pellet count right to the edge of 40.


Made me really think about investing in shotshell reloading plans, and the $$$$ I've paid to stock up on Bismuth in 12 and 20.

I've Waterfowled for decades. But it wasn't until I found a very un-used marsh with great birds that I had to basically myself and really got to work birds that I was super impressed with Steel. Think I grabbed a case of Kent #3s. And when ducks are REALLY in range, well light, and locked up. Was kinda easy to go 7 with 8-10 shells in a morning.

I don't see how they YTrs are running range finders on flying birds and making distance claims for kills with any reliability. But 40 seems do-able with just about anything in real world.

But damn.....some of the TSS videos. CRUSHING birds with 28s and 9 shot. $53 mornings tho.

 

[ShortMountain91]

Semi on topic, a dude I watched SWORE by #6 steel for Canada's. Preached that "they don't make it for a reason...it's too effective and they sell more shells the more you shoot".

I've never heard of anyone shooting Canada's with 6s so went and found the video on YT. Looks like the guy was suggesting if you use 6s you have a better chance of getting a pellet in the brain / spine of the goose and don't need the penetration to get one into the brain. There's a lot of pellets in 6s but still not enough I would think to land one consistently in a goose brain at 50 yards. But heck I don't really know cause I've never tried.

Sent from my SM-S936U using Tapatalk

 

[SuperDUECE22]

Have you ever thought about having a custom one made. About 20 years ago i went through this and found a majority of the ones bought off the shelve were junk and no 2 were made alike (even from the same mfg). I'd find a reputable shop with a good track record and send your Barrel in so they can measure the forcing cone and make you one specific to your barrel.

 

[OneGunTex]

Semi on topic, a dude I watched SWORE by #6 steel for Canada's. Preached that "they don't make it for a reason...it's too effective and they sell more shells the more you shoot".

I've seen the video. Note that he is a "custom shotshell manufacturer" so he's just hawking a product. He's also full of it - there's plenty of steel #6 on the shelf. I use it for teal and the occasional non-tox dove hunt. Have killed Gaddies with it too when that's what stuck in my waders.

I don't doubt that a steel #6 to the head will kill a honker. But I do doubt that 99% of people are good enough at both shooting AND calling/hiding to regularly be head-shooting Canadas within steels energy/velocity envelope. Oh not to mention that you can't shoot steel through most Full chokes.

 

[OneGunTex]

Have you ever thought about having a custom one made. About 20 years ago i went through this and found a majority of the ones bought off the shelve were junk and no 2 were made alike (even from the same mfg). I'd find a reputable shop with a good track record and send your Barrel in so they can measure the forcing cone and make you one specific to your barrel.

If you know someone reputable selling custom shells for less than the price of TSS, would love the recommendation please