Pack goats... any info?

[aggieland]

I was given 2 Boer goats that a Doctor I work with raised from birth because he was moving and could not keep them at his new home in the city. Anyway, I was considering buying some pack goats for my trips out West and figured these work probably work or at least be a good test run for raising goats.
Overall they were great animals who caused zero problems, If I let them out of their pen they would never run off even thought I have 140 acres for them to go eat on. They would never leave my side out of the pen, it was pretty amazing how they wanted to be with me all the time. It is very important to keep goats in a place with other goats never alone. The two I had seemed to be lonely for some reason and I decided keeping two goats year around in TX for just one trip a year out West was going a little overboard. So I just gave the goats away last week to a woman that has many breeding goats. If I ever move out West I would not hesitate to get a few for backcountry hunting and just fun backpacking.

 

[jmez]

They eat about 5lbs or hay per day and only need a small pen to keep them in. They are best kept in a well constructed pen. They can be hard to keep in and are a nuisance if they are out. They like to climb up on things, such as vehicles, and will walk all over them.

 

[garrenj]

Out of the six goats I have three are alpines, two are boer sannan crosses, and one is a pure sannan. I've paid anywhere from 125 off of Craigslist to $300 from a breeder for a trained goat. All of them have about the same work ethic but I'd recommend the money for a trained ready to pack goat. The cheaper ones I purchased needed training and were a year old so I had to wait another year to pack them. At 3.5 they are now good to go but it was a long wait. As far as pack gear goes I really like the stuff from Butt Head Packgoats.
They definitely need a good fence and mine are either in a dry lot with hay or out on about three acres to feed.

 

[thru-hunter]

Please remember, don't take pack goats anywhere they may encounter wild sheep due to disease transmission concerns.

This is KEY!!! Goats especially have no business in our wild sheep mountains. Domestic animals have been selectively bred for thousands of years to be able to live in close confines with other livestock and stay healthy. Our wild sheep are susceptible to naturally occurring bacteria in HEALTHY domestic animals. Pneumonia has decimated big horn populations in numerous areas killing.

I have piles of research done on this topic and rather than bore everyone with facts and studies just know that most of the decline in Big Horn Sheep has been due to contact with domestic goats and sheep. It has completely decimated some populations and killed 1/2 or more of others. It hasn't happened in AK (yet) but in AK it would likely spread more rapidly and be worse as there are large contiguous areas of habitat so the spread would be wide spread and catastrophic.

Some info taken from a Alaska Department of Fish and Game presentation to the Big Game Commercial Services Board (BGCSB) in Anchorage.

Healthy pack goats in Idaho have been tested and 35 of 45 were found to harbor pathogenic strains of Pasteurella haemolytica

Domestic sheep and goat pathogenic strains of pneumonia causing organisms
BACTERIA (Pasteurella, Mannheimia, Bibersteinia)
VIRUS (Infectious Bovine Rhinotracheitis)
VIRUS (Ovine progressive pneumonia)
Mycoplasma ovipneumoniae
LUNGWORM (Muelleris sp.)

In short, NO domestic goats or sheep in wild sheep areas is the only logical policy no matter how great they are at packing.

 

[tstowater]

I get real nervous about anyone bringing domestics into wild sheep country. I'm not sure that goats present a problem, but I think there is a possibility that needs to be explored by anyone who wants to use goats as pack animals. Wild sheep are way to precious for people to ruin a herd due to exposure to disease. Not just hunters where these problems are coming from, but also hikers, etc. Contact the Wild Sheep Foundation and they will be able to tell you the details of whether this should be a concern. Remember, the rams travel pretty extensively. Every sheep die-off decreases our chances to hunt them. Terribly expensive in time, sweat and money to rebuild a herd after a die-off.

Thanks, Todd

 

[flatlander51]

Anywhere to rent goats in western wy

 

[thru-hunter]

I get real nervous about anyone bringing domestics into wild sheep country. I'm not sure that goats present a problem, but I think there is a possibility that needs to be explored by anyone who wants to use goats as pack animals. Wild sheep are way to precious for people to ruin a herd due to exposure to disease. Not just hunters where these problems are coming from, but also hikers, etc. Contact the Wild Sheep Foundation and they will be able to tell you the details of whether this should be a concern. Remember, the rams travel pretty extensively. Every sheep die-off decreases our chances to hunt them. Terribly expensive in time, sweat and money to rebuild a herd after a die-off.

Thanks, Todd

My info above is from Tom Lohuis the area sheep bio out of the Anchorage ADG&G office. Awesome guy and the FACT is that even a healthy domestic animal carries diseases that WILL kill sheep.

How is this for more evidence.

In contact experiments, BHS were penned with healthy domestic sheep and/or argali/mouflon sheep hybrids
All 23 BHS died of respiratory disease while all domestic and hybrid sheep remained healthy.
In other pen experiments:
2 of 9 BHS penned with domestic goats
1 of 9 BHS penned with cattle
died of respiratory disease




Experts uniformly recommend complete separation of domestic sheep and goats from wild sheep and goats to prevent disease transmission
Disease transmission risks are fewer but still substantial from llamas, alpacas and cattle
Yaks have not been evaluated in published risk assessments but based on similarities to cattle and their exotic origin, they are likely to carry pathogens and parasites potentially detrimental to wild sheep, goats and muskox

Horses, donkeys, mules (Equidae) do not typically carry parasites or pathogens that are easily transmitted to ruminant sheep/goats and thus are acceptable pack animals

This should hit close to home for some folks here

In 1995, a feral goat was found in association with BHS just prior to a large pneumonia-related die-off of 50-75% of the BHS herd in the Hells Canyon area

We should all preach no goats in wild sheep/goats areas. Personally I would not use yaks, llamas or alpacas either. Just stick to horses, planes or the Shank's mare express.

 

[flyinsquirel]

A poster on another site says the goats calmed game. He claimed to be able to walk very close to elk and deer without spooking them when he had his goats with him. Using goats to pack AND stalk game !? The guy in the goat suit may have it all figured out. Lol!

A friend who has 2 goats has confirmed this.. I tell him it's cheating using a 'goat blind'

 

[HellsCanyon]

Been talking with my brother and we are thinking about this more. We are even thinking of getting some other backpacking people on board to maybe do a 'timeshare' type thing where the goats would be getting out near every weekend during the summer and everyone chips in for buying and feed costs.

Mike

 

[Arrowslinger]

I've used goats on one trip.....they were like dogs, just kinda hung around till we loaded up each of'em with boned out blacktails. A rodeo followed and once they got worn out, they sauntered down the trail and to the rigs. Figure each of'em packed out about 50#'s of meat and as you can see in the pic, they weren't big goats.

 

[blb078]

Those of you that have goats or have used them in the past, how do you travel w/them? A small horse trailer or can you throw them in something like a dog crate and put them in the bed of your truck?

Brian

 

[Arrowslinger]

Those of you that have goats or have used them in the past, how do you travel w/them? A small horse trailer or can you throw them in something like a dog crate and put them in the bed of your truck?

Brian

Brian, my buddy had them loaded in a tacoma with shell on the back. They could stand up inside it.

 

[garrenj]

Mike, I like your timeshare idea. If anyone in western Oregon is interested in this let me know. I'd love for my goats to get out more than they do.

Brian, I haul mine in a horse trailer only because I happened to have one. I have friends that just use the bed if the pickup with wood racks.

 

[HellsCanyon]

Mike, I like your timeshare idea. If anyone in western Oregon is interested in this let me know. I'd love for my goats to get out more than they do.

Brian, I haul mine in a horse trailer only because I happened to have one. I have friends that just use the bed if the pickup with wood racks.

Thanks! And it helps that my brother is mainly into fishing and it wouldn't be too hard to select other hikers for the timeshare so there wouldn't be conflicts about who gets to use them during the hunting season!

Mike

 

[actionshooter]

Mike, I have done the packgoat thing for 7-8 years and as mentioned on here, Alpine gus and I have taken our goats out several times (he got me started). If you look at the Hunt-wa site I have a bunch of pics.
PM me when you want and we can talk on the phone. I am a hunt when typing and it would take a week to go intop detail.
Steve

 

[philw]

I ran into a couple guys in the back country this year while I was on my wilderness hunt who had 10 of them things about 5 miles in. He and his buddy packed in a 16 man tipi, stove, the whole nine! One night on my way back down the mountain I stopped and shared a cocktail with them as they were celebrating the kill of a nice bull. One of the guys raised them and told me they go for about $600 each but they were "trail" trained! It blew me away how much gear these two guys had in there, their camp looked like the Hilton! The next day he passed our camp, each goat had packs on carrying out his bull. Looked pretty neat at the time but not sure I'd like them around the other 51 weeks of the year.

Those guys are from Eastern Nebraska, and here's their website if anyone is interested:

http://www.summitpackgoat.com/

Great guys, one is a veterenarian and they put a lot of effort into raising and training their goats. The goats are hand-fed with bottles from about a day old so that they imprint (if that's the right word) on humans and that's why they follow you around like dogs. I was fortunate to hunt with them a couple years ago, we had a string of about 14 goats which was many more than needed but they always bring new goats along on their own trips to train them and see how they do. Most of the new ones did really well, but there was one really stubborn one who casued trouble, and they identified him as one they couldn't sell for a pack animal. I named him "Cabrito."

They generally loaded their goats with up to about 40 lbs. each. The goats were never a problem in camp, didn't make any noise to speak of, and I shot a cow out of a small herd (with a bull) about 3-400 yards from camp the third day we were camped in that spot. To fedd them, someone would have to let them off their tethers to eat around lunchtime every day. They never went far, and to get them back all you had to do was get out the bag of salted peanuts and rattle it; they came in on a trot.

Here is a link to a write-up I did on that hunt, and a few photos:

http://www.kifaruforums.net/showthread.php?t=26699&page=5


They are curious and friendly, this was during a break:

In camp:

Rocky Mountain Surf & turf:

 

[thru-hunter]

I brought this thread up to Tom Lohuis the Alaska head Sheep bio and he was was intensely interested. Apparently interested enough that just 6 months after this thread the new 2013-14 Alaska Hunting Regulations came out with this addition.

 

[SHTF]

Please remember, don't take pack goats anywhere they may encounter wild sheep due to disease transmission concerns.

Actually you may want to check your local state laws. Some places its illegal for this reason to use them over a certain elevation because of the Goat Disease transmission. Especially where the DOW is trying to increase the population of the Sheep and Goats.

 

[SHTF]

I didnt see thru hunters post. Guess I should of kept reading =-)

 

[Sundodger]

Never used goats, but my concerned has always been predators. I would think if you high line or hobble them in camp that would be a rather inviting meal for a bear, cougar, or wolf; especially if you are out hunting all day.

There are a ton of bears in some of the areas I go. How do you guys deal with that? Cover them in human piss?