Outlook on Hunting in the U.S.?

[Coyote Commander]

So linked articles from government on populations vs your “probably.” And you truly think you’re right.

This board cracks me up.

You believe everything the government tells you?

This board does in fact rarely disappoint.

 

[HandgunHTR]

Do you believe estimates of populations from 200+ years ago?

I dont!

Read Lewis and Clarks journals, game was plentiful in places but completely void in many others.

2008 in the Dakotas there were more deer than theres probably ever been in history.

Even if the numbers were halved it still is a significant decline.

As for Lewis and Clark, just because they didn't see any, doesn't mean they weren't there. Read anything about the long hunters (Boone, Skaggs, Mansker, etc) and how many deer and elk those guys killed and it may give you a bit more perspective.

As for your comment on deer in the Dakotas, that may be true, but it is easy for them to populate when they don't have to compete for resources with elk and bison. However, I see a lot of recency bias when it comes to deer populations. They are great in a lot of states these days. But ask anyone who hunted in the 60's what it was like compared to today.

 

[Slickhill]

The real devastation of bison was via brucellosis or some other cattle born disease.
Even if estimates back then were 4X actual populations the hide yards didn’t ship enough hides to cover the calf crop of the year.

As for deer populations back in the 60’s. My Grandfather and his buddies were going to Co and buying multiple mule deer tags and filling them all. They didn’t hunt locally for deer because there were none. Now we can shoot 8 per year or thereabouts.

 

[Coyote Commander]

Even if the numbers were halved it still is a significant decline.

As for Lewis and Clark, just because they didn't see any, doesn't mean they weren't there. Read anything about the long hunters (Boone, Skaggs, Mansker, etc) and how many deer and elk those guys killed and it may give you a bit more perspective.

As for your comment on deer in the Dakotas, that may be true, but it is easy for them to populate when they don't have to compete for resources with elk and bison. However, I see a lot of recency bias when it comes to deer populations. They are great in a lot of states these days. But ask anyone who hunted in the 60's what it was like compared to today.

Without a doubt we over hunted a lot of stuff before we knew any better.

I’m just skeptical of “estimates” made from hundreds of years ago. Many of which are just underhanded attempts to say “white man bad”.

Heck, I read once they “estimate” there were over 300 million Indians here before the evil white Europeans wrecked everything.

Mmmhmm.

Estimates and exploits. Remember too, Davy Crockett killt him a b’ar when he was only three!

 

[Coyote Commander]

The real devastation of bison was via brucellosis or some other cattle born disease.
Even if estimates back then were 4X actual populations the hide yards didn’t ship enough hides to cover the calf crop of the year.

As for deer populations back in the 60’s. My Grandfather and his buddies were going to Co and buying multiple mule deer tags and filling them all. They didn’t hunt locally for deer because there were none. Now we can shoot 8 per year or thereabouts.

And let’s not forget, we’re supposed to believe the shooters were able to all but obliterate a bison population that was “estimated” (there’s that word again) to be as high as 60 million, and they did it in less than 20 years.

I don’t buy it.

 

[HandgunHTR]

The real devastation of bison was via brucellosis or some other cattle born disease.
Even if estimates back then were 4X actual populations the hide yards didn’t ship enough hides to cover the calf crop of the year.

As for deer populations back in the 60’s. My Grandfather and his buddies were going to Co and buying multiple mule deer tags and filling them all. They didn’t hunt locally for deer because there were none. Now we can shoot 8 per year or thereabouts.

And let’s not forget, we’re supposed to believe the shooters were able to all but obliterate a bison population that was “estimated” (there’s that word again) to be as high as 60 million, and they did it in less than 20 years.

I don’t buy it.

Gents, there are many verifiable sources to show that the hide hunters killed bison in the millions.

This isn't a "white man bad" thing. It is a "left to their own devices, men (regardless of color) will strip away natural resources until they are gone, as long as someone is paying" issue.

 

[StupidLightweight]

Early settlers killed stuff like crazy, bringing many species to the brink of extinction or extirpation, but they didn't wipe out the bison herds with Sharps rifles. Disease did that.

 

[Hunt eat repeat]

I think about all these things quite often. Everything is a mess and I feel like we are barreling down hill and no brakes.
But then I think what if hunters put all of their differences aside and just put their foot down on this anti hunting BS and put access and animal health over everything. A pipe dream I know but all this passion could move mountains !!!