Newbie Help - tight bolt after FL sizing when chambering

kkp005

WKR
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I’m somewhat of a newbie to reloading and teaching myself on the go.

Recently picked up a tikka 243 and I’m working up loads for it..

I have a Lyman all American press , star line brass and Hornady custom grade FL dies…

I set up my die, FL sized the new brass… Put it in the gun and I’m getting a pretty tight bolt when trying to close it… Screw the die down more and still getting a tight bolt…

Some of the new brass , I just ran in the die deep enough to get the expander in the case mouth to uniform it up. It feeds fine and I loaded some up and they shot great. Just put some of the once fired brass in the gun and the bolt still closes super easy, without ever even putting it in the press….

What am I doing wrong? Go easy on me. lol.. I recently had shoulder surgery and I’m having to do all this left armed so I’m getting plenty frustrated 🤣
 
Any particular reason you are FL sizing virgin brass? Typically, you would just load and shoot new brass. Then, FL size it after it has fireformed to your chamber (bumping shoulder 0.002).

Do you have a set of calipers and headspace comparators? Check headspace on new or 1x fired brass vs brass that has been fired in YOUR chamber.
 
Any particular reason you are FL sizing virgin brass? Typically, you would just load and shoot new brass. Then, FL size it after it has fireformed to your chamber (bumping shoulder 0.002).

Do you have a set of calipers and headspace comparators?
I had my head up my a$& and wasn’t thinking . I FL sized like 25 of them and then said “damn dummy, why are you doing this?” I didn’t FL size anymore after that and I’m glad I didn’t..
yes I have a set of both
 
I’m somewhat of a newbie to reloading and teaching myself on the go.

Recently picked up a tikka 243 and I’m working up loads for it..

I have a Lyman all American press , star line brass and Hornady custom grade FL dies…

I set up my die, FL sized the new brass… Put it in the gun and I’m getting a pretty tight bolt when trying to close it… Screw the die down more and still getting a tight bolt…

Some of the new brass , I just ran in the die deep enough to get the expander in the case mouth to uniform it up. It feeds fine and I loaded some up and they shot great. Just put some of the once fired brass in the gun and the bolt still closes super easy, without ever even putting it in the press….

What am I doing wrong? Go easy on me. lol.. I recently had shoulder surgery and I’m having to do all this left armed so I’m getting plenty frustrated 🤣
most people don't know how to correctly set a sizing die for a specific rifle.

Remove the firing pin and ejector from the bolt.

run the case up into the die until you hit the shoulder and stop. unscrew the die until you no longer contact the shoulder.

Slowly screw the die down until you BARELY contact the shoulder.

Check it in your rifle. the bolt should close easy with just a slight bit of tension the last ¼ of travel. you should be able to tell its a snug fit with no play.

repeat until its just right.
repeat with multiple cases until it right.

Any time you fl size a case, the brass moves towards the mouth. If your headspace is really close to the new case size, you may be moving the shoulder forward enough to cause a tight bolt and the die isnt set to push it back far enough.
 
Are you getting lube down in the case mouth? If you don’t, then you can effectively size the case down, then on the upstroke, friction from the sizing button running through the unlubed case neck can pull the shoulder out back out. Put your cases in a loading block and shoot them with One Shot, aiming at an angle to make sure you get a little down into the case mouth. If sizing is happening with little effort and running smoothly it probably isn’t what I described above. Normally you will get some excessive force and/or chattering on the upstroke.
 
Virgin brass is so undersize I’m surprised the dies did anything. I’d sharpie a piece of the brass to see where it’s binding in the chamber. If dies are squeezing the sides near the shoulder causing the shoulder to squish upward, the die is too long and not keeping the shoulder pushed down. If the die is too short and fat it could be pushing the shoulder down and expanding the outer diameter.

Quite honestly it shouldn’t take this much effort or any special technique - either the rifle chamber is wonky or the dies are wonky. Most likely the dies. Regardless of brand, I’d buy or borrow another set of dies and I’d bet lunch it solves your problem. It’s never happened to me, but a friend had wonky dies and simply trying a different brand worked just fine.

There’s absolutely nothing wrong with sizing new brass - if you don’t it’s 100% impossible to have the same case neck expansion as your dies provide. The new brass isn’t measuring your expander ball, or reading its mind.
 
Are you getting lube down in the case mouth? If you don’t, then you can effectively size the case down, then on the upstroke, friction from the sizing button running through the unlubed case neck can pull the shoulder out back out. Put your cases in a loading block and shoot them with One Shot, aiming at an angle to make sure you get a little down into the case mouth. If sizing is happening with little effort and running smoothly it probably isn’t what I described above. Normally you will get some excessive force and/or chattering on the upstroke.
I’ve had that issue when I resized 6.5prc but this 243 is buttery smooth on the upstroke. Still going to probably try some one shot moving forward tho
 
Can you screw the die down further yet or is it bottomed out hard on the shell holder when you're sizing?

Also, pull out the decapping/expander assembly when setting up the sizing die so you're not sizing down and then expanding the neck over and over prior to getting your die setting correct.
 
most people don't know how to correctly set a sizing die for a specific rifle.

Remove the firing pin and ejector from the bolt.

run the case up into the die until you hit the shoulder and stop. unscrew the die until you no longer contact the shoulder.

Slowly screw the die down until you BARELY contact the shoulder.

Check it in your rifle. the bolt should close easy with just a slight bit of tension the last ¼ of travel. you should be able to tell its a snug fit with no play.

repeat until its just right.
repeat with multiple cases until it right.

Any time you fl size a case, the brass moves towards the mouth. If your headspace is really close to the new case size, you may be moving the shoulder forward enough to cause a tight bolt and the die isnt set to push it back far enough.

Am i reading this right, you intentionally set up the sizing die to have a little resistance on bolt close?
 
If the used brass is not from this rifle, that is your problem. There are chamber dimension differences between rifles regardless of cartridge. I ran into this same problem with 2 different rifles.

To solve the problem, set the FL die up so your shell holder touches the bottom of the die (standard sizing approach) and then turn the die down another half or three quarter turn to make sure you're sizing the whole case. This may take a little experimentation.

After you fire the brass in this rifle, then you'll want to make sure you have a shoulder comparator so you can measure your fire formed brass for that rifle. From then on, you can either run the brass through the FL die in the "standard" set up or turn out a little if you're only looking for .002 bump.

Here is a thread I started for this same problem a while back: https://rokslide.com/forums/threads/reloading-newbs-psa-on-used-brass.373542/
 
Am i reading this right, you intentionally set up the sizing die to have a little resistance on bolt close?
yes, but I mean barely. like you can feel it but no extra effort to close it, or it closes easy with no resistance, but zero play front to back.
That is typically what .002"-.003" shoulder bump feels like.

If you set up dies like the manufacturer instructions suggest, shoulder bump is usually more like .010"-.015" depending on cartridge and SAAMI spec.
 
yes, but I mean barely. like you can feel it but no extra effort to close it, or it closes easy with no resistance, but zero play front to back.
That is typically what .002"-.003" shoulder bump feels like.

If you set up dies like the manufacturer instructions suggest, shoulder bump is usually more like .010"-.015" depending on cartridge and SAAMI spec.
Huh. I never take the FP and ejector out but if I feel any resistance at all I'm not sizing enough because lord knows theres going to be a piece or 5 in a batch that were more work hardened, didn't get lubed the same, or i didn't give it the same ummph on the press that get tighter than the ones i tested!
 
Yeah, i recall when discussing use of Lee Collets. Gross. 😂

Even with ammo that slides home with zero resistance i had 3 rounds that wouldn't chamber due to carbon falling from a suppressor at a match recently.
carbon hosed me once too. Carbon got crushed so bad I had to use a chamber reamer to get it out.

removing the FP and ejector just give you a positive feel. leaving both in, you fight cocking and/or false resistance from the ejector.
 
If a fired case chambers easily but a FL sized one chambers with resistance, it's almost always because the case grew from being sized down at the base and the shoulders haven't been bumped back yet.

If the die isn't already maxed out with cam over, screw it down more and size another piece and chamber check, rinse and repeat. Use a new piece each time and once you get your numbers and it's properly set, size all the original test pieces too.

If it is maxed out, then you likely have conflicting tolerances and will need to surface grind some material off a shellholder (which does weaken them), or remove some material from the bottom of the die (my preference on a cheap die).

I go about 1/8 turn at a time setting up sizing dies, it's better to measure with a comparator so you have numbers for future reference, .002-3" bump from resistance on close has been optimal for me.
 
I borrowed a buddies RCBS die and I’m still having the same issue.
Ran the shell holder up, screwed the die in to where it touched it. Sized a die and same issue… did this in 1/4 turn down increments and have over a full turn down and it’s still a tight bolt.
Talked with Hornady and they are going to send me another shell holder to try
 
Get a comparator set so you can actually measure what's going on. I bet you didnt screw the die in enough and it potentially got longer. You need tools to measure with to do this correctly.
 
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