My side of the BlackOvis/Camofire story - Podcast and Q&A

All those critiquing should read "The Man in the Arena"

Good for Kendall for putting himself out there and explaining what seems like a cluster on multiple fronts. Definitely makes me hate PE even more than I already do.

You can tell who runs a business, and who doesn't by the way guys respond for sure.
 
Thanks for putting this out there, I was super curious as I really liked BO gear and I could afford it.

I find it funny people are bashing when they will turn around and buy Kuiu to help support a rich guy trying to limit out access to public land.
 
Thanks for putting this out there, I was super curious as I really liked BO gear and I could afford it.

I find it funny people are bashing when they will turn around and buy Kuiu to help support a rich guy trying to limit out access to public land.
I don’t think anyone is bashing, simply asking, which is the purpose of the thread. Might be the only time to get a straight answer since he doesn’t have skin in the game anymore and get a glimpse of why some of the outdoor industry continuously backs poachers.
 
I will have to listen to the podcast because I find business plans that are a success and a failure fascinating.

I will give Kendall respect though for doing this. I know a guy that was in a similar business that sold it. He needed more money to keep it relevant and he had leveraged what he had as far as he could go. He took a beating from people online when he sold. What wasn’t disclosed is all the things the dude did that people didn’t know or see. One of those was walking away from millions, because a few companies that put in offers wouldn’t agree to not move the headquarters because he wanted it to stay local and for people to retain their jobs.
 
Thanks for posting. I might listen to the podcasts while mowing or something. I was curious what happened last fall. I ordered some BO wool, zip-off base layers right before all that stuff started getting posted on social media and the webiste announcement. They came in without a hiccup so I didn't fret much about it but was curious what happened. PE being involved tells me all I need to know.

I've got my popcorn ready if you decide to respond to the muley freak questions. 🍿
 
Stay small and humble if you try it again.
Bingo. You hit that nail square on the head.

Along those lines, and perhaps this might be sensitive information given the circumstances, it sounds like there were a fair number of employees involved here. Where did they go? Are there any brands out there to look out for that might have some familiar faces or even better service as a result of this unfortunate situation?
We had around 35 employees at the end. I've been tracking most all of them and to my knowledge there are only 4 left who have yet to find work. 1 of them, she's an absolute workhorse but super shy (and quiet) as a mouse, lacks confidence. I've got her lined up for a couple of interviews. 1 of them who was customer service has had a tough time finding work, not sure why as he's a sharp young man and was great with customers. 1 is going through the long process of getting on with the Utah Highway Patrol, and I was stoked to take the lengthy survey for him and write him a recommendation. The last guy, he had worked with me for 13 years and took some time off to relax, but lately he's been anxious and I'm trying to find him some avenues.
One of the former customer service guys landed at Kings Camo, and another key guy landed at Silencer Co., FWIW.
 
Since you are responding, any idea where can I find the stockpile of San Juan gloves, Glomits, BO Granite Peak and Terrace pants?
San Juan gloves - high demand. I'm half motivated to start a new brand selling 4 or 5 pieces of gear, and San Juan gloves would be top of the list! There are about 1400 of them left in the inventory, and none of those have been sold yet to anyone. I for one am watching to find out where these end up to buy some. The factory that built them for BlackOvis has a shipment that arrived in November which they tried to unload to Midway USA or somewhere like that. To my knowledge, they haven't sold them either.

Speaking of factory, the down Glomits (Palisades Glassing Mitten/Glomits) were sold out and the refill shipment was on the water. They too are yet to be sold somewhere. If I catch wind of where, I'll pass it along.
So this may or may not be appropriate but do you know where all the inventory went? I see lots of people wishing they could still buy some items. I loved camofire and would check the site every day for deals.
Perfectly fine to ask. I think I covered this in the 4th episode, but after the bankruptcy filing the PE firm let me know that since the lease had never been transferred to the new entity from the former entity that my co-founder and I had set up the lease under, we were the proud owners of the lease on a 50,000 sq ft building, for another 16 months. (I should have known better and taken care of that vs assume that it would have been taken care of - school of hard knocks) I worked with the court to consolidate all the inventory, leased a small 4000 sq ft space and had the inventory moved there so I could lease the building to a new tenant.

Most of the inventory is still in that holding facility awaiting the liquidation sale.
 
San Juan gloves - high demand. I'm half motivated to start a new brand selling 4 or 5 pieces of gear, and San Juan gloves would be top of the list! There are about 1400 of them left in the inventory, and none of those have been sold yet to anyone. I for one am watching to find out where these end up to buy some. The factory that built them for BlackOvis has a shipment that arrived in November which they tried to unload to Midway USA or somewhere like that. To my knowledge, they haven't sold them either.

Speaking of factory, the down Glomits (Palisades Glassing Mitten/Glomits) were sold out and the refill shipment was on the water. They too are yet to be sold somewhere. If I catch wind of where, I'll pass it along.

Perfectly fine to ask. I think I covered this in the 4th episode, but after the bankruptcy filing the PE firm let me know that since the lease had never been transferred to the new entity from the former entity that my co-founder and I had set up the lease under, we were the proud owners of the lease on a 50,000 sq ft building, for another 16 months. (I should have known better and taken care of that vs assume that it would have been taken care of - school of hard knocks) I worked with the court to consolidate all the inventory, leased a small 4000 sq ft space and had the inventory moved there so I could lease the building to a new tenant.

Most of the inventory is still in that holding facility awaiting the liquidation sale.
If the Solitude Midweight wool socks could also be one of the 4-5 items that would be great! Camofire allowed me to afford some very good gear when I was in college and I became a big fan of the black ovis gear in the years after. I always had good experiences with both stores, sad deal that it ended the way it did
 
Well I'll ask the awkward question in this clearing the air thread:

Since there is no longer a business going on can we ask what was up with the whole Muley Freak loyalty and weird replies to folks asking that seemed like they could have been written by MF? First it was "oh hey look MF presented some new interesting facts" and then radio silence on it after he was convicted (multiple times).

It might seem like a tangent but that is when others including myself stopped shopping at Black Ovis. I don't mean to insinuate that was the driver in sales decline or anything (didn't help either), I just found the whole thing weird and if you are having a candid discussion here I'm curious if you have light to shed? Was there some contractual obligation to maintain ties despite multiple convictions of hunting violations?

I mean even if you were good friends or something of that nature actions have consequences in real life, he made choices and was caught/convicted (multiple times) and it was a bad look outwardly to at least some of us that you guys stayed in business with someone like that.

🍿

P.S. I do respect coming in and being candid. I'm genuinely curious about the above and not just pot stirring because I found the whole thing perplexing.
Well, since 12 people gave your post a thumbs up, and considering the magnitude of vitriol for MF that I read in the original thread about the bankruptcy, it seems only appropriate to address the "awkward question." I'm smiling and chuckling while typing this, btw. It's all good, happy to respond. Prep the🍿

When Muley Freak Eric was convicted the 2nd time, and what I came to believe to be wrongly so, it was certainly a step back moment for me and the business association. There was not a contractual obligation in place so the decision was certainly made by the team, but ultimately I was the one responsible for keeping the brand in the store.

The saying "where there's smoke there's fire" is not lost on me. I get it, we have all made mistakes, but the same style of mistake, TWICE? Hard to stomach, hard to believe.

I heard a lot of what people had said about the situation, called a few people in the industry for their thoughts. I then called Eric to get his side of the story. Figured it was only right to hear him out. After 2 or 3 lengthy conversations and some consideration of the court evidence, I felt like he was being wrongly accused by the state and the gentleman whose property he had been hunting on.


At that same time, BlackOvis had recently lost the opportunity to sell FHF with the buyout by Meat Eater, and Marsupial, which according to Jim was because of keeping up with demand but I believe was in part due to the Adak bino harness project we had undergone a couple of years prior, and (this is my own opinion, no evidence to prove my accusation as it pertains to Marsupial) IMO due to some pressure from a competitor in the retail space urging Marsupial to not sell to BlackOvis. (I heard from someone in a different company in the industry that the retailer in question had told this manufacturer that they would buy all of the inventory BlackOvis would normally buy in a year if the manufacturer would cease to sell to BlackOvis). I digress.

Needless to say, from a category standpoint, the MF bino harness was the best seller in that category and in part I made a business decision to keep selling his harness for the numbers sake. Employees were split, some telling me to drop MF, others telling me to keep MF. For better or worse, I kept his product on the website.

I personally like Eric and think he's a dedicated father/husband and what I deem to be a good person. Has he made mistakes? Sure, but who am I to cast the first stone. Is he way stoked on Eric? Yep. Could he tone it down a bit? Sure. Is he quick to lash out to defend himself? I think so, and perhaps that is why it can appear like he's in the wrong. I certainly have a different style about myself.

He is super passionate about his brand, his family, and his company. At the end of the day we made the decision to keep selling MF product. If BlackOvis lost a lot of business due to that decision, I get it and don't fault those that chose to avoid BlackOvis because of the decision.

FWIW, If you look at the filing, he's out around $145K. Not chump change for sure. I think it's the most of any "small" non-corporate entities.
 
Well, since 12 people gave your post a thumbs up, and considering the magnitude of vitriol for MF that I read in the original thread about the bankruptcy, it seems only appropriate to address the "awkward question." I'm smiling and chuckling while typing this, btw. It's all good, happy to respond. Prep the🍿

When Muley Freak Eric was convicted the 2nd time, and what I came to believe to be wrongly so, it was certainly a step back moment for me and the business association. There was not a contractual obligation in place so the decision was certainly made by the team, but ultimately I was the one responsible for keeping the brand in the store.

The saying "where there's smoke there's fire" is not lost on me. I get it, we have all made mistakes, but the same style of mistake, TWICE? Hard to stomach, hard to believe.

I heard a lot of what people had said about the situation, called a few people in the industry for their thoughts. I then called Eric to get his side of the story. Figured it was only right to hear him out. After 2 or 3 lengthy conversations and some consideration of the court evidence, I felt like he was being wrongly accused by the state and the gentleman whose property he had been hunting on.


At that same time, BlackOvis had recently lost the opportunity to sell FHF with the buyout by Meat Eater, and Marsupial, which according to Jim was because of keeping up with demand but I believe was in part due to the Adak bino harness project we had undergone a couple of years prior, and (this is my own opinion, no evidence to prove my accusation as it pertains to Marsupial) IMO due to some pressure from a competitor in the retail space urging Marsupial to not sell to BlackOvis. (I heard from someone in a different company in the industry that the retailer in question had told this manufacturer that they would buy all of the inventory BlackOvis would normally buy in a year if the manufacturer would cease to sell to BlackOvis). I digress.

Needless to say, from a category standpoint, the MF bino harness was the best seller in that category and in part I made a business decision to keep selling his harness for the numbers sake. Employees were split, some telling me to drop MF, others telling me to keep MF. For better or worse, I kept his product on the website.

I personally like Eric and think he's a dedicated father/husband and what I deem to be a good person. Has he made mistakes? Sure, but who am I to cast the first stone. Is he way stoked on Eric? Yep. Could he tone it down a bit? Sure. Is he quick to lash out to defend himself? I think so, and perhaps that is why it can appear like he's in the wrong. I certainly have a different style about myself.

He is super passionate about his brand, his family, and his company. At the end of the day we made the decision to keep selling MF product. If BlackOvis lost a lot of business due to that decision, I get it and don't fault those that chose to avoid BlackOvis because of the decision.

FWIW, If you look at the filing, he's out around $145K. Not chump change for sure. I think it's the most of any "small" non-corporate entities.

Your depth of response is pretty impressive. For what it’s worth my buddy and I stayed warm in WM Badgers chasing elk that were bought before you closed up.

I’ve been in LE for 18 years and been involved with J walking to complex Human Trafficking cases. It is not lost on me that people routinely get on the wrong side of the law for relatively minor mistakes on their part or even mistake of law enforcement. It’s top shelf of you to review the documents yourself and talk to the person involved and make a decision. I think alot of people would bite their tongue vs putting folks to the stake if they genuinely research all of the facts (and this is usually very difficult to do based on how our criminal justice system works).
 
Thanks for explaining your situation. It was always a pleasure buying from BO. Customer service and asking questions about products was always handled very well.
 
Kendall,
Kudos to you for the desire, determination, and guts to start this thread. Very interesting info to hear this side of for sure. I have no stones to throw. We all make mistakes. Thanks again for coming on here.
 
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