Montana is #1 (well actually #50)

[H@mstar19x3]

Idaho has entered the chat. 5.7% state income tax and 6% sales tax.

Just did a quick calculation Texas vs Idaho. $150,000 salary. $500,000 house. online shows Idaho property taxes are 0.49%. I've owned houses in several cities in Texas. average of those houses has been 2.78% (my brother's rate is 3.6% for reference).

taking the 150K and 500K houses. Texan pays $3000 more in tax. then throw in our higher insurance rates and sales tax. pretty eye opening.

 

[Mojave]

I grew up in primarily in Deer Lodge (MT), Casper (WY), (Riverton (WY) and Socorro (NM).

As an adult I have spent something like 15 years overseas.

About 5 years in Oak Harbor (WA)

3 years in Jacksonville, FL

2 years in Lemoore, CA

2 years in Ridgecrest, CA

2 years in Freeport, ME

half a year in DC

half a year in Waco, TX

half a year in San Marcos, TX.

When I go to Casper, it has been over ran with non-oil field folks who are looking for a better place that they had originally. The old days of Oil Field boom and bust are now just boom with conservative retirees and

When I go to Oak Harbor, it is over ran with those work remote folks and retirees.

When I go to Socorro I only stop to get gas and keep a loaded gun on the dash. Honestly it isn't that bad, but it still sucks the same as when I was a kid. We called it Suck-OR-OH! It is not Gallup! But it has the same problems it had 34 years ago, it is just bigger.

Freeport and Brunswick, ME lost the Navy and just kept importing the same people who don't actually work in Oak Harbor. They pay taxes, some of them have kids and they work from their home. Or they are retired.

The original group of folks from Casper, Deer Lodge, Oak Harbor and Brunswick/Freeport are the ones that have problems. They can't afford the utopia the new people are trying to create.

Here from my desk in Germany, I don't know where I will end up in a couple years. I am scared to death of the cost of Wyoming, Montana and Idaho.

Alaska is cheaper on real estate than 90% of Wyoming and Montana.

One of the hardest things that Forest Service employees in Wyoming, Montana and Idaho have to contend with is living in paradise at cheap wages. Typical government employee, who can't afford where they live.

The agency I work for doesn't have much in the way of jobs in the Northern Rockies and I don't know if I will end up home or not.

A friend just turned down a job paying $150,000 a year in Los Alamos, NM because she couldn't afford to live there.

 

[Weldor]

Same on Los Alamos. Way to expensive to live around there. I always liked the Las Cruces area, but it is a homeless camp now. $150,000 does'nt get you much anymore when people are looking at $3000-5000 dollar morgage payment. That's why I won't sell, what are going to buy at those inflated prices. No Thanks.

 

[IdahoBeav]

Yet seemingly, the people that cry the loudest about this issue are usually very much against multi-family developments.

Supply & Demand

 

[S.Clancy]

Would a sales tax help take some of the burden off of property taxes or just give more money to the govt?

I think the best idea is to have property taxes paid up front like some other countries do (I think Australia does this). Property taxes should not happen in perpetuity if it is the same owner. I think we should front load 8-10 yrs of property taxes at time of purchase, it can be wrapped up in the mortgage. This incentivizes staying in homes longer (community) and disincentivizes buying and rolling homes over and disincentivizes institutions doing the same thing as the upfront cost increases (it also disincentivizes vacation rentals, although I think more needs to be done there as well). The current property tax structure is a joke.

 

[Fujicon]

The percentage of a person’s income that goes to sales taxes is the least for high incomes and hurts lower income families. Sales taxes are known as one of the the most regressive.

Ha! I'll take a sales tax over an income tax any day of the week and twice on Sundays. Honestly, it's a no-brainer. Fortunately, we have the country's best example of that difference between Portland, Oregon and Vancouver, Washington.* Oregon has no sales tax, but an income tax. Washington has no income tax, but a sales tax. Both the income tax in Oregon and the sales tax in Washington are around 9%, but here's the kicker: income tax in Oregon is charged against all your income. Compare that to sales tax in Washington which is only charged when you buy something "discretionary" such as a car, television, clothes, or similar, but not against "necessities" like mortgage, rent, food, utilities, etc. I'd be hard pressed to spend more than 40% of my total income on discretionary purchaes that get sales taxed, but let's say I'm that kind of guy. It's a no-brainer that it's better to get taxed on only 40% of your total income, not 100%.

*And that huge tax advantage is BEFORE all the people in Vancouver shop sales-tax-free in Portland!

 

[ETtikka]

1913, first income tax, 3% on earnings over 800$

3% wouldn’t pay for IRS agents salaries now

 

[IdahoBeav]

1913, first income tax, 3% on earnings over 800$

3% wouldn’t pay for IRS agents salaries now

That's a win-win

 

[Hunt eat repeat]

My wife and I bought in central MT just in the nick of time before Covid. We bought raw land and put a little cabin on it with house plans already drawn up. Now I’m thinking I might die in this little cabin. We have billionaires buying up land on three sides of us. Our land has gone up 4 or 5x in a matter of 4 years. But if we sold we couldn’t buy without a huge downgrade. I thank god every day we have what we have but where does all this lead ?

 

[LFC911]

I am waiting for the next correction/depression in the next 5 years and planning on buying 5-10 acres for my retirement home. Not sure if that will be in KS, WY or MT but that is the plan.

 

[bojangles808]

No idea how we aren't #1. probably the lava zone homes bring us our avg down.

 

[Jason Snyder]

We have enough resources to be able to do four day work weeks." When asked what about fast food workers, folks working at stores you want to go to on a Friday afternoon, do they get a four day work week too or do they matter?

You can work a four day work week that encompasses Fridays and weekends.

 

[*zap*]

I am waiting for the next correction/depression in the next 5 years and planning on buying 5-10 acres for my retirement home. Not sure if that will be in KS, WY or MT but that is the plan.

Wy.

 

[*zap*]

I am going there October to look around.

 

[LFC911]

I am going there October to look around.

I am going there Friday to look around...for elk but may have to make a trip back with the wife in the spring.

 

[*zap*]

Kill one.

 

[Fireflyfishing]

I am waiting for the next correction/depression in the next 5 years and planning on buying 5-10 acres for my retirement home. Not sure if that will be in KS, WY or MT but that is the plan.

Since you keep talking about more taxes, maybe try NY or CA?

 

[cb2176]

Pricey

 

[Andrew12gauge]

Ha! I'll take a sales tax over an income tax any day of the week and twice on Sundays. Honestly, it's a no-brainer. Fortunately, we have the country's best example of that difference between Portland, Oregon and Vancouver, Washington.* Oregon has no sales tax, but an income tax. Washington has no income tax, but a sales tax. Both the income tax in Oregon and the sales tax in Washington are around 9%, but here's the kicker: income tax in Oregon is charged against all your income. Compare that to sales tax in Washington which is only charged when you buy something "discretionary" such as a car, television, clothes, or similar, but not against "necessities" like mortgage, rent, food, utilities, etc. I'd be hard pressed to spend more than 40% of my total income on discretionary purchaes that get sales taxed, but let's say I'm that kind of guy. It's a no-brainer that it's better to get taxed on only 40% of your total income, not 100%.

*And that huge tax advantage is BEFORE all the people in Vancouver shop sales-tax-free in Portland!

Yes, this example is true, but when comparing sales tax vs property tax a sales tax will disproportionately affect the lower income families. Idaho talked about raising our sales tax to 10% and completely dropping the property tax a couple years ago because all of the homeowners were complaining that property taxes were too high due to increases in assessed values. Idaho doesn’t have a sales tax exemption on groceries so every family would’ve been paying that 10%. I’m not a genius or anything but it seems like this bill would’ve only helped those who would already qualify as “wealthy”(if you own a $500,000 home you’re not poor?) while greatly increasing the burden on the lower class.


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[Pacific_Fork]

I am waiting for the next correction/depression in the next 5 years and planning on buying 5-10 acres for my retirement home. Not sure if that will be in KS, WY or MT but that is the plan.

At this point, with the plethora of millionaires/billionaires, work from home tech dorks, etc, I do not ever foresee a correction in the intermountain west. It’s only going to get more expensive. I barely made it and fear for my kids future here. Our house on 5 acres is worth at least a mill, before Covid maybe 500K max. That price is long gone, never coming back. Would love to be wrong tho…