Mid-Layer Shootout Review ***Updated 2/18/23***

[Bump79]

@mtwarden Might as well reach out to Canis Athlete. I have a Chamois top and bottom, not a huge fan, but I'd like to see their Alpha Grizzly mid layer insulation tested.

Alpha Grizzly Insulation Jacket

This is the jacket to wear for high-intensity activities in challenging conditions and changing weather. Strategically constructed with lightweight and flexible CORDURA® fabric to give your arms complete range of motion. Lined with a knitted, highly-breathable European blend of Merino and...

www.canisathlete.com

Might see if Pnuma will toss in their Alpha Vertex Jacket

Alpha Vertex Jacket

The Alpha Vertex was designed from the ground up with the bowhunter in mind. It is insulated but lightweight, packable, and weather-resistant. Use it as an outer layer for early to mid-season. Alpha is also an ideal mid-layer when the temperature really drops because it offers core warmth...

pnumaoutdoors.com

 

[pattimusprime22]

Patagonia is worse than OR even for discontinuing good stuff- has to be they are somewhat niche products and not a ton of sales; regardless how good there are

A piece Patagonia has had for a while that may be worth considering in the testing is the R1 fleece (I think they have a hoodie, jacket, and pullover). It is made with Polartec Powergrid, and they advertise it as lightweight and breathable. I'm assuming it wouldn't perform as well as Alpha direct, but I haven't seen a side by side test of the two materials before.

Either way looking forward to the results! Nothing like a good real world test to validate/invalidate the marketing claims. What base layer will you be using for the test?

 

[mtwarden]

^ the R1 is one of the few good ones they kept (Houdini another); it's a very similar fabric to what Sitka is using in their Heavyweight Hoody

Going to use the Sitka Lightweight Core hoody; it's been my go to base layer for the last 5-6 years.

 

[manitou1]

This is great! IMO, mid layers are the thoughest piece to nail down. So far, Kuiu Peleton and Military grid fleece have been my go-tos, but not totally sold on either. Have tried various others.
Good luck. Looking forward to the results.

 

[Cahunter805]

The Peloton 240 has been my go to mid layer for a while now.
Will you be testing any of the strong fleece? The 210 seems to possibly be a little better for milder mid layer use.

 

[browning2480]

What about something from Fayettechill? Made in the good ol USA

Livingston

Description Keeping our trail needs in mind, the Men's Livingston mid-layer fleece hoodie is built with a lightweight, highly breathable moisture wicking fabric that has a standard fit. Size Guide - Updated Fit, fits true to size. Need help with sizing? × Features Bluesign® Certified Dyed Fabric...

www.fayettechill.com

 

[mtwarden]

All good candidates and ideas

Robby is subscribed to thread so he'll look things over to see what else should be included; we both agree that we it would be better to keep at 4-5 pieces to get a more thorough review

 

[pattimusprime22]

^ the R1 is one of the few good ones they kept (Houdini another); it's a very similar fabric to what Sitka is using in their Heavyweight Hoody

Going to use the Sitka Lightweight Core hoody; it's been my go to base layer for the last 5-6 years.

Ya, the Houdini comes everywhere with me.

Also, no need to include the R1 in the test if a similar fabric is being tested in another garment. Thanks for doing all the legwork!

 

[TheTone]

I guess I kinda look at the R1 as kind of the standard or measuring stick. They’ve been around a long time and used by tons of people. Is like to see it included for those reasons

I get a bit lost with the kuiu miss between the different numbered peletons and strong fleeces. I’d like to see some of them tested

 

[Steve O]

I’ve not read all the replies but I’m at the Total Archery Challenge up in norther Michigan this weekend and the Sitka gear booth has a new product replacing the Kelvin Active Hoody and Jacket. It is called the Ambient. They are amazing; much warmer and all the breathability. Amazing. They will be on the website Monday. I will be ordering.

 

[C.payne]

Lots of great suggestions. I’ll throw in mine. The Kryptek Shahikot Alpha would be interesting to see stack up against the Sitka MDWi and possibly the Arcteryx Proton LT. All are active puffy style mid layers that are designed to move moisture during high exertion. It would also be interesting to see how Sitkas 80grams of Polartec Alpha and face fabric differ in performance from Krypteks 100 grams and choice of face fabric.

Following along with this one for sure.

 

[Wyobohunter]

Gents - the fine folks from Rokslide have asked me to do a mid-layer shootout and I agreed. We were hoping to complete it in the Spring when the weather was more favorable (cooler temps), but were waiting on a few additional mid-layers. We still haven't received the Kuiu 240 yet.

Thus far we've got the First Lite Origin hoody, Sitka Heavyweight hoody and the Sitka Arrowhead MDWi hoody (that I reviewed earlier).

I want to look at several things, but near the top are warmth/weight and moisture movement. I think I might have a pretty slick way to compare moisture movement. I had an ah ha moment after I was swept by a fast moving stream this past winter. I was wet up to my neck, base layer soaked. I put on a mid-layer and started hiking (hard) for ~ two hours and lo behold, my base layer was very close to being fully dry.

I'm not volunteering for any swift water sweeps , but my thought is taking a base layer (using the same one each time) soaking it with water-, writing it slightly and weighing it (insuring that each time the garment weighs the same). Putting it on and donning one of the mid-layers. Using a 4-5 mile route (again using the same route & pace each time) and then weighing both the base layer and mid-layer. Obviously the lighter each is (less moisture), the better. I'll do my best to keep environmental conditions as close to the same each time- temperature, humidity, etc.

Anyways Robby suggested starting a q & a thread to get ideas from folks on testing, other possible candidates, etc.

As summer is almost here in Montana, probably realistically looking at September to give this a go.

Thanks
Mike

Maybe add some brands in the mix that aren’t necessarily marketed to hunters? Patagonia mid-weight Capilene, some stuff by Black Diamond and Mountain Hardware come to mind.

It’d also be cool to see what you can find at the Goodwill or some of the less expensive brands. This might be something good for the folks just starting out who don’t have much extra cash. I’ve found some great stuff at second hand stores. It was all I wore in my college years. Ski resort towns without a nearby university are the best place to look. Rich skiers tend to buy new stuff and ditch really great pieces all the time.

 

[Wyobohunter]

@mtwarden
BTW. This is a great test and I can’t think of a more scientific + real world approach. Looking forward to it.

Edit - One variable could be how each piece fits you. Ideally they’d all fit the same but if not that should be noted.

Another edit
And weather. Temperature, humidity and precipitation.

 

[mtwarden]

I’ve not read all the replies but I’m at the Total Archery Challenge up in norther Michigan this weekend and the Sitka gear booth has a new product replacing the Kelvin Active Hoody and Jacket. It is called the Ambient. They are amazing; much warmer and all the breathability. Amazing. They will be on the website Monday. I will be ordering.

Funny I got an email from Sitka Arrowhead the other day and said they were pulling back from the military line and instead concentrating on hunters.

Soooo my guess is that Arrowhead is gone, but that their MDWi is now going to be in Sitka’s lineup. Might just be the Ambient. We’ll see Monday

 

[Ten Bears]

Funny I got an email from Sitka Arrowhead the other day and said they were pulling back from the military line and instead concentrating on hunters.

Soooo my guess is that Arrowhead is gone, but that their MDWi is now going to be in Sitka’s lineup. Might just be the Ambient. We’ll see Monday

Wow. Perhaps some sales on the remaining Arrowhead line upcoming?

 

[mtwarden]

Wow. Perhaps some sales on the remaining Arrowhead line upcoming?

I think guys have been posting some pretty good sales on Arrowhead stuff from their few retailers. Check at the bottom of my review of the MDWi jacket- was just a couple of days ago that someone posted up a link(s)

 

[P Carter]

Probably too much to ask at this point, but I’d love to see some comparison of the activ3 insulation pieces, including Polartech alpha and what appear to be Alpha “copycats.” Like this one I just noticed: https://www.hellyhansen.com/en_us/rapide-lifaloft-air-jacket-63090

I know Arctyrx has one as well.

 

[HaydenLane]

Funny I got an email from Sitka Arrowhead the other day and said they were pulling back from the military line and instead concentrating on hunters.

Soooo my guess is that Arrowhead is gone, but that their MDWi is now going to be in Sitka’s lineup. Might just be the Ambient. We’ll see Monday

Would it actually be warmer? I only just tried on my MDWi hoody last night, but nothing about it seemed warmer than my active jacket, just more breathable.

 

[TX4ever]

Looks like the new ambient line features primaloft evolve insulation. Not familiar with it, but curious how it compares with polartec alpha and the MDWi.

 

[mtwarden]

different insulation; looks similar to Alpha Direct, but not the same

hard telling how they would compare

also a pullover, which if I had my choice would be full zip- just my personal preference

wee bit heavier too