Measuring Blackhorn 209 by volume vs weight

[Pooch]

I'm kinda new to muzzleloaders so be gentle, I have CVA Accura and planning on using the 209 powder with 250 gr. Powerbelt ELD's on elk. I have read a bunch of threads and am a little confused. Can I just use a volume say 100 grains to start and work up or down to get best accuracy? TIA

 

[swavescatter]

Best accuracy = weigh each charge. Density/packing fraction varies lot to lot.

Edit - and start a lot lower than 100 grains. My CVA LR/X with Arrowhead LRMP plug shot 75 grains really well.

 

[MuleyFever]

Yes you can. Your rifle manual should also list the max load they say is safe. The Blackhorn site also has info on loads.

 

[bigsky_hunter]

I buy plastic medical vials off eBay and weigh each charge. I then have a bunch of pre weighed available.I use 77gr by weight, iirc that equals 100 gr by volume. Blackhorn has table listed on their website with conversion.

 

[elkivory]

I'm kinda new to muzzleloaders so be gentle, I have CVA Accura and planning on using the 209 powder with 250 gr. Powerbelt ELD's on elk. I have read a bunch of threads and am a little confused. Can I just use a volume say 100 grains to start and work up or down to get best accuracy? TIA

You'll probably get lots of comments on this, so here's mine based on reading multiple online discussions addressing this process. I've decided to do 10 samples by volume, then weigh and average from each batch (canister) I use. Last night I took a sample of 10 from a canister I've been using for a couple of years. I measured 100 volume and my average weight was 69.88. Highest weight was 71.1 and lowest was 69.10. I was not super careful on filling my volume measuring tool. Another kicker I read couple of days ago is roll the canister if it has been transported, because finer granules could settle and cause inconsistent velocities. Whenever I'm going to shoot, I will weigh my charges mostly because I have the time and it might make things a little more consistent.

 

[elkivory]

I buy plastic medical vials off eBay and weigh each charge. I then have a bunch of pre weighed available.I use 77gr by weight, iirc that equals 100 gr by volume. Blackhorn has table listed on their website with conversion.

I'm pretty sure it's 100 volume equals 70 weight. I took this off Hodgdon website. Answer to FAQ, can I weight BH209.
"Yes. If you prefer to weigh charges, you can convert the volume load recommendations into weighed grains by multiplying the volume load by 0.7. Example: 100 units by volume x 0.7 = 70 grains by weight. 110 volume charge x 0.7 = 77 grains by weight."

 

[ElDiablito]

This is one of the most common questions among new shooters. The short answer is, as long as you’re consistent in your method, you’ll see no dispersion difference in weighed vs volume measured Bh209 charges. If you’re going to volume measure, get yourself a good brass volume measure like this one.



When Bh209 first hit the market, the volume to weight conversion factor was .7. However, with the current lots, it is more like .801. It has gotten slightly heavier. So a max charge (for example) of 120 gr volume of Bh209 will weigh 96.1 gr weight.

Here’s the current load data:

https://hodgdonpowderco.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/08/2023-MDATA.pdf

More importantly, a 250 gr Powerbelt is undoubtedly one of the worst choices you could possible make for an elk bullet. Too soft and light!!

 

[WCB]

I use a brass measure like above. I try to fill it the same and make sure the top is tight...it will work itself loose and not "cut" the powder right at the top.

Shooting some where in the 90s by volume depending on what MZ I'm using with the brass tool my groups out to 200yards are way more than acceptable. Just for kicks I am going to weigh some and see how or if my groups improve to the point that it is worth the extra time.

 

[bigsky_hunter]

I'm pretty sure it's 100 volume equals 70 weight. I took this off Hodgdon website. Answer to FAQ, can I weight BH209.
"Yes. If you prefer to weigh charges, you can convert the volume load recommendations into weighed grains by multiplying the volume load by 0.7. Example: 100 units by volume x 0.7 = 70 grains by weight. 110 volume charge x 0.7 = 77 grains by weight."

You’re right, thanks for clarifying. Was just going off of memory and wasn’t home to check my notes. Fwiw I use 77gr by weight and get good accuracy with 250 Barnes tmz out of an omega. I get around 2000 fps.
To the OP, you are going down the right path by using BH209 to begin with.

 

[Scoggin12]

My recommendation is load a volume measure and pour on a powder scale a few times. Then shoot those same loads at a target. You will load by weight every time after that I promise.

 

[Pooch]

Thanks for replies. next question what is a good brand for powder scale?

 

[ENCORE]

Thanks for replies. next question what is a good brand for powder scale?

Scales & Accessories - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc

Scales & Accessories...

www.hornady.com

Amazon.com : digital reloading scales for powder grains

 

[ENCORE]

I'm pretty sure it's 100 volume equals 70 weight. I took this off Hodgdon website. Answer to FAQ, can I weight BH209.
"Yes. If you prefer to weigh charges, you can convert the volume load recommendations into weighed grains by multiplying the volume load by 0.7. Example: 100 units by volume x 0.7 = 70 grains by weight. 110 volume charge x 0.7 = 77 grains by weight."

The 0.7 conversion was determined two decades ago by Western Powders, and it's just continued to be published for safety reasons.
However, that conversion hasn't been "totally accurate" in years. Each lot number of propellant has a different volume to weight ratio.

 

[Gone_fishin29]

My cva optima shoots 84gr by weight which is roughly 120 by volume

 

[elkivory]

The 0.7 conversion was determined two decades ago by Western Powders, and it's just continued to be published for safety reasons.
However, that conversion hasn't been "totally accurate" in years. Each lot number of propellant has a different volume to weight ratio.

I have 3 unopened 10 oz. containers. I plan to sample volume to weight and then measure by weight as I open them. They could be pretty old. The one I sampled a couple of days ago came out right at the .7 ratio. It had a sportsmans warehouse sticker on it $39.99. Probably pretty old.

 

[ENCORE]

I have 3 unopened 10 oz. containers. I plan to sample volume to weight and then measure by weight as I open them. They could be pretty old. The one I sampled a couple of days ago came out right at the .7 ratio. It had a sportsmans warehouse sticker on it $39.99. Probably pretty old.

I wasn't going to post this, as the OP is new/newer to the MZ.

I HIGHLY RECOMMEND HE FOLLOW HIS OWNER'S MANUAL OR THE PROPELLANT MANUFACTURER'S RECOMMENDATIONS.

Your mileage may vary...........

Using seven different lot numbers of BH209, the volume to weight ratios were checked.

Using 120grs VOLUME in two different volume measures, 10 charges were thrown and TAPPED full.
Each throw was weighed and the average weight of the 10 charges was recorded.

No velocity testing at this time of year..........

120grs VOLUME TO WEIGHT AVERAGES

Lot#30......... 89.3grs weight
Lot#31........ 85.0grs weight
Lot#37........ 94.7grs weight
Lot#38........ 93.8grs weight
Lot#39........ 95.1grs weight
Lot#41........ 96.2grs weight
Lot#42........ 97.4grs weight

12.4grs difference between the high and low.

I shoot a ridiculous amount of BH209 between just shooting and competing, where I'll shoot over 12,000grs in a weekend.

 

[tracker12]

My recommendation is get a quality Volume measurer and see how your results are. As you get more familiar with muzzleloading you can always move on to weighted charges. With my current gun and load I can consistently touch 3 shots at 100 yards. Not sure weighting my charges will have a benefit. I did it in the past but have just gone back to using volume. I am consistent in how I pour, tap and load.

 

[MallardSX2]

My cva optima shoots 84gr by weight which is roughly 120 by volume

This is what I shoot under a 300 grain bullet.

The recoil is significant but it shoots great and has plenty of power!

 

[Balderdash]

I've done both. Haven't noticed different levels of precision, which has been very high, between the 2 methods with BH 209. My 2 Knights do best with 120 GBV. My 700 likes 110 GBV.

I haven't killed much with PB bullets, but I have killed a lot of game with Hornady FPB and Bore Drivers, and I can report nothing but positive experiences. Maybe more guys can chime in eith direct experiences with the PB's, but they've been much maligned for awhile, which matches my limited experience with them.

 

[Balderdash]

I wasn't going to post this, as the OP is new/newer to the MZ.

I HIGHLY RECOMMEND HE FOLLOW HIS OWNER'S MANUAL OR THE PROPELLANT MANUFACTURER'S RECOMMENDATIONS.

Your mileage may vary...........

Using seven different lot numbers of BH209, the volume to weight ratios were checked.

Using 120grs VOLUME in two different volume measures, 10 charges were thrown and TAPPED full.
Each throw was weighed and the average weight of the 10 charges was recorded.

No velocity testing at this time of year..........

120grs VOLUME TO WEIGHT AVERAGES

Lot#30 89.3grs weight
Lot#31 85.0grs weight
Lot#37 94.7grs weight
Lot#38 93.8grs weight
Lot#39 95.1grs weight
Lot#41 96.2grs weight
Lot#42 97.4grs weight

12.4grs difference between the high and low.

I shoot a ridiculous amount of BH209 between just shooting and competing, where I'll shoot over 12,000grs in a weekend.

View attachment 845623

I have burned a lot of cans of BH 209, but not that much. Just yesterday my local Fleet Farm had it priced at $94 per can.

Was actually thinking of trying some Shooters World in a couple of ML's. I ran Shockeys Gold years back with good results, so long as the barrel was free of oils and lubes.