Looking for 600 yard deer/elk rifle. Recommendations?

[The Fish Box]

@Tricer So in this hypothetical scenario when you say the same bullets your thinking each bullet is optimized for tissue damage? I don’t think anyone including form could argue that the 300 wouldn’t create more damage, but the argument isn’t that. The point being made by others is that shooting a 30 cal magnum with a less optimized bullet doesn’t do as much damage as a 6mm optimized bullet, so you are getting the same or more tissue damage, less recoil and in some cases better ballistics.

Now if you like the big magnums and shoot optimized bullets out of it for big wound channels because you can, this is America after all so send it.

 

[Mountainrancher]

Yup 100%. If I have to choose between the two I am picking 6cm because without a doubt the 300wm is doing a lot more damage on impact.

This is obviously a hypothetical question that none of us will ever have to make a real choice about. But it’s the way I think.

I want a big bullet that hits hard on impact and causes a lot of trauma deep into the animal ideally all the way through. Especially on elk.

i have no issue with people focusing on velocity over energy or follow up vs recoil. I think that’s great. I am a simple dude and I like the 1500lb rule it just works for me. Not sure why that resulted in a bunch of people trying to change my mind. But it’s still nice to see everyone’s opinions.

Some of y’all are pretty passionate about this. I should get you on my my Podcast to talk about it. I love reloading and always like hearing different opinions.

Granted I’ve never been shot, but I don’t think it really matters what you pick. With a center mass hit you’re going to be in real trouble with either. Like dead in seconds to a few minutes without extreme medical attention. If we’re talking a leg or arm hit then it comes down to bullet for me. I’d rather get hit in the leg with a 300wm shooting an all copper vs a 6cm shorting an eldm and vice versa. Even with a limb hit it’s still going to be tough to survive. I’d rather have a copper bullet make a hole through me than an eldm send fragments all over with a football sized wound channel.

 

[Tricer]

Granted I’ve never been shot, but I don’t think it really matters what you pick. With a center mass hit you’re going to be in real trouble with either. Like dead in seconds to a few minutes without extreme medical attention. If we’re talking a leg or arm hit then it comes down to bullet for me. I’d rather get hit in the leg with a 300wm shooting an all copper vs a 6cm shorting an eldm and vice versa. Even with a limb hit it’s still going to be tough to survive. I’d rather have a copper bullet make a hole through me than an eldm send fragments all over with a football sized wound channel.

Same bullet both calibers. I don’t care what bullet you pick guaranteed you are choosing to get shot by the 6cm because it will not be as effective.

 

[Mountainrancher]

Same bullet both calibers. I don’t care what bullet you pick guaranteed you are choosing to get shot by the 6cm because it will not be as effective.

I don’t think this is even remotely close to true. Your are very dead either way

 

[Timberline001]

Fine you are right. Kinetic energy is a myth and useless.

But let me ask you would you prefer to be shot by a 300wm or a 6mmCM for the sake of this thread let’s say the range is 500yds. Same bullets. Only one shot.

I would prefer to be shot by the 6mmCM but that’s just me.

Do you really think you’d notice a difference? You’re dead in a split second from either one. What a weird comparison.

 

[Timberline001]

I dont care what caliber you shoot me with, just please don’t use a monolithic

 

[Formidilosus]

Same bullet both calibers. I don’t care what bullet you pick guaranteed you are choosing to get shot by the 6cm because it will not be as effective.

The most polite way to say this is- you are wrong, and you do not understand what you are writing. The reason people are responding to you isn’t because of what you like, it’s because you are stating things definitively that are factually and objectively incorrect.


The Barnes 175gr LRX creates a wound that is around 1/4” as wide or less, as a 6mm 108gr ELD-M at like impact speed. The LRX kills slower- not better.

 

[Timberline001]

This isn’t an opinion matter is what’s everyone is trying to say. We’re all trying to put the facts out and get rid of the old wise tells.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Same bullet both calibers. I don’t care what bullet you pick guaranteed you are choosing to get shot by the 6cm because it will not be as effective.

There was a medical paper I read, maybe 10 or 12 years ago, written by a few army and marines combat medics. Basically sharing their experiences and compiling a bunch of field data. The conclusion was that they would MUCH rather be shot with 7.62 variant chamberings instead of 5.56 chamberings.

You live and learn and if you shoot at and kill enough big game animals you start to see patterns..

I used to use and recommend 7mm for elk, I then moved to 6.5mm, and now I always recommend 6mm. This season, I’m planning to hunt all my big game animals with 5.56 77grain TMKs…

New Zealand Tahr
California Deer x2
Alaska Moose
Wyoming Elk x2
Arizona Elk
Arizona Deer
Arizona Mountain Lion
Minnesota Deer x4 minimum

I’ll let you know if it is “not as effective”.

 

[Willie IV]

Ummm..... I just wanna know what everyone thinks between a 300WM versus a 7mm PRC on an elk at 600 yds with factory ammo.

Where and how did we get to "what would you rather be shot with".... Good grief

 

[Tricer]

Ummm..... I just wanna know what everyone thinks between a 300WM versus a 7mm PRC on an elk at 600 yds with factory ammo.

Where and how did we get to "what would you rather be shot with".... Good grief

Both great elk cartridges at 600yds.

 

[IDVortex]

Id rather be shot with a 300wm FMJ then a .223 shooting a eld-m or tmk.

 

[Timberline001]

Ummm..... I just wanna know what everyone thinks between a 300WM versus a 7mm PRC on an elk at 600 yds with factory ammo.

Where and how did we get to "what would you rather be shot with".... Good grief

The majority on rokslide agree. When given two choices the less recoil choice is best.

 

[Tricer]

There was a medical paper I read, maybe 10 or 12 years ago, written by a few army and marines combat medics. Basically sharing their experiences and compiling a bunch of field data. The conclusion was that they would MUCH rather be shot with 7.62 variant chamberings instead of 5.56 chamberings.

You live and learn and if you shoot at and kill enough big game animals you start to see patterns..

I used to use and recommend 7mm for elk, I then moved to 6.5mm, and now I always recommend 6mm. This season, I’m planning to hunt all my big game animals with 5.56 77grain TMKs…

New Zealand Tahr
California Deer x2
Alaska Moose
Wyoming Elk x2
Arizona Elk
Arizona Deer
Arizona Mountain Lion
Minnesota Deer x4 minimum

I’ll let you know if it is “not as effective”.

That’s awesome for you. Again all I said was my recommendation 308 or 7mm with 1500 lbs of energy at 600 yds for elk.

You guys are funny, glad you killed all those animals lol.

There is more than one way to skin a cat and when I am hunting elk this is what I am looking for.

Not sure if you guys are used to steam rolling people or something but definitely not changing my opinion of what I like to use and recommend for elk.

Highly doubt the majority of hunters on this forum prefer a 6.5 or smaller for elk. They are probably tired of voicing there opinion and having you guys tell them they are wrong for shooting 300wm.

 

[IDVortex]

Highly doubt the majority of hunters on this forum prefer a 6.5 or smaller for elk. They are probably tired of voicing there opinion and having you guys tell them they are wrong for shooting 30300wm.

Well as one of your future influencers I'll either will be using a 6.5 cm on elk, or a 6arc if i get it built in time. (Gotta keep humor in life)

Now, I think you're missing the point on larger calibers, no one is saying they can't kill, or the bullet will bounce off the elk. The whole point of a smaller caliber is better shot placement, better confidence, more practicing hopefully vs a magnum. Then it goes into, why use a bigger gun if a smaller one works? I don't believe anyone is saying someone is wrong on a magnum cartridge, if anything, its more of telling people that they're wrong on thinking they're as accurate as they think they are with a magnum, and just having a magnum doesn't give more room for error in a bad shot, a bad shot is a bad shot.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

That’s awesome for you. Again all I said was my recommendation 308 or 7mm with 1500 lbs of energy at 600 yds for elk.

You guys are funny, glad you killed all those animals lol.

There is more than one way to skin a cat and when I am hunting elk this is what I am looking for.

Not sure if you guys are used to steam rolling people or something but definitely not changing my opinion of what I like to use and recommend for elk.

Highly doubt the majority of hunters on this forum prefer a 6.5 or smaller for elk. They are probably tired of voicing there opinion and having you guys tell them they are wrong for shooting 300wm.

Not trying to steam roll. You have a similar opinion to what mine was, as soon as just 3 or 4 years ago, on chambering recommendation for elk.

I was also like you and “wouldn’t change my mind”. I killed a lot of animals and shot thousands of rounds a year from about 12 rifles. I thought I knew it all and anyone who disagreed with me wasn’t as “effective” as I was. I recommend abandoning that mentality completely. Turns out, it held me back on becoming a more effective hunter and killer than I could have been over the last 25+ years.

 

[Jake Larsen]

Not trying to steam roll. You have a similar opinion to what mine was, as soon as just 3 or 4 years ago, on chambering recommendation for elk.

I was also like you and “wouldn’t change my mind”. I killed a lot of animals and shot thousands of rounds a year from about 12 rifles. I thought I knew it all and anyone who disagreed with me wasn’t as “effective” as I was. I recommend abandoning that mentality completely. Turns out, it held me back on becoming a more effective hunter and killer than I could have been over the last 25+ years.

I’ve had a somewhat similar experience with being rigid in my thinking with what’s necessary in order to kill effectively. Lightbulb moment for me was when I talked to my grandpa who killed 43 elk in his life. Every one with a .243 with Nosler partitions. Pair that with the ease of shooting lighter cartridges, and practicing enough to get honest about developing flinch when shooting big magnums a lot…


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[BjornF16]

There was a medical paper I read, maybe 10 or 12 years ago, written by a few army and marines combat medics. Basically sharing their experiences and compiling a bunch of field data. The conclusion was that they would MUCH rather be shot with 7.62 variant chamberings instead of 5.56 chamberings.

You live and learn and if you shoot at and kill enough big game animals you start to see patterns..

I used to use and recommend 7mm for elk, I then moved to 6.5mm, and now I always recommend 6mm. This season, I’m planning to hunt all my big game animals with 5.56 77grain TMKs…

New Zealand Tahr
California Deer x2
Alaska Moose
Wyoming Elk x2
Arizona Elk
Arizona Deer
Arizona Mountain Lion
Minnesota Deer x4 minimum

I’ll let you know if it is “not as effective”.

Looking forward to your reports!

 

[Sadler]

There was a medical paper I read, maybe 10 or 12 years ago, written by a few army and marines combat medics. Basically sharing their experiences and compiling a bunch of field data. The conclusion was that they would MUCH rather be shot with 7.62 variant chamberings instead of 5.56 chamberings.

You live and learn and if you shoot at and kill enough big game animals you start to see patterns..

I used to use and recommend 7mm for elk, I then moved to 6.5mm, and now I always recommend 6mm. This season, I’m planning to hunt all my big game animals with 5.56 77grain TMKs…

New Zealand Tahr
California Deer x2
Alaska Moose
Wyoming Elk x2
Arizona Elk
Arizona Deer
Arizona Mountain Lion
Minnesota Deer x4 minimum

I’ll let you know if it is “not as effective”.

Thats a heck of a line up! Do the doubters a favor and sneak a 30 cal kill in there and see if they can spot it.

 

[MAP1]

There was a medical paper I read, maybe 10 or 12 years ago, written by a few army and marines combat medics. Basically sharing their experiences and compiling a bunch of field data. The conclusion was that they would MUCH rather be shot with 7.62 variant chamberings instead of 5.56 chamberings.

You live and learn and if you shoot at and kill enough big game animals you start to see patterns..

I used to use and recommend 7mm for elk, I then moved to 6.5mm, and now I always recommend 6mm. This season, I’m planning to hunt all my big game animals with 5.56 77grain TMKs…

New Zealand Tahr
California Deer x2
Alaska Moose
Wyoming Elk x2
Arizona Elk
Arizona Deer
Arizona Mountain Lion
Minnesota Deer x4 minimum

I’ll let you know if it is “not as effective”.

I understand the good intention of your post but Marines dont

There was a medical paper I read, maybe 10 or 12 years ago, written by a few army and marines combat medics. Basically sharing their experiences and compiling a bunch of field data. The conclusion was that they would MUCH rather be shot with 7.62 variant chamberings instead of 5.56 chamberings.

You live and learn and if you shoot at and kill enough big game animals you start to see patterns..

I used to use and recommend 7mm for elk, I then moved to 6.5mm, and now I always recommend 6mm. This season, I’m planning to hunt all my big game animals with 5.56 77grain TMKs…

New Zealand Tahr
California Deer x2
Alaska Moose
Wyoming Elk x2
Arizona Elk
Arizona Deer
Arizona Mountain Lion
Minnesota Deer x4 minimum

I’ll let you know if it is “not as effective”.

i get the good intention of your post but the Marines don’t use medics they use Navy Corpsman. Not to give you a full resume but my dad and uncle both served in Vietnam, are both retired Marines who used both the M14 7.62 mm and M16 5.56 mm. They and most soldiers missed the superior firepower of the M14 but appreciated the tradeoff with a lighter m16 fully loaded.